Are Hillary and Obama still "unelectable"?

[rehmwa 2]

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> With McCain all but certain to be the Republican candidate, I'm
>thinking he can beat Hillary, but maybe not Obama.

Agreed. I think the Hillary/McCain race would be a close one, but McCain would win. Obama/McCain would result in an Obama win. Just imagine the debates - you'd have the JFK/Nixon effect writ large.

Really?

Huckabee/Hillary - close, but either way the country loses.

Obama/Huckabee - Obama clear winner

McCain/Hillary - McCain clear winner

McCain/Obama - Close race, maybe some good stuff comes from it.

The only thing left is to see if the Dems torpedo their chances again with Superdelegates (a nice way to reward those in power with special privileges - do the Reps have superdelegates too? - it seems counter to any sort of ideals based on this country - it's more socialist to allow so much power into the hands of the few)

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[wmw999 2,587]

I agree with this pretty much down the line. Both McCain and Obama seem to be trying to take the high road, too, which will increase the value of a race.

Pretty good interview of Obama on 60 Minutes last night. Not-so-good of Hillary ("enough about you -- tell me more about Obame").

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[rehmwa 2]

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Both McCain and Obama seem to be trying to take the high road, too,

Hi Wendy -

yeah, they are both much better at fooling us about that aspect......


Actually, do you think that if we had Obama on the ticket with Hillary as vice...

1 - would Hillary's ego be able to even accept that role?
2 - would putting her in the backseat be sufficient to keep the knee jerk Clinton-at-all-cost voters, while tempering the anti-Hillary vote from both parties while still pandering to the vote for any female sexists?

If so, that might put McCain out no matter who he runs with.

The FAR 'social' righties would just abstain in disgust from either candidate. The FAR left would get their dream team. The center would lean to Obama at this point and McCain would only get the fiscal conservatives and some center vote - both they'd be holding their noses as they vote.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[wmw999 2,587]

Well, so far they've been able to. It may be "forced" on them. Kind of like people are "forced" to indebt themselves up to their eyeballs.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Andrewwhyte 1]

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The only thing left is to see if the Dems torpedo their chances again with Superdelegates (a nice way to reward those in power with special privileges - do the Reps have superdelegates too? -

I agree that the superdelegates issue is a time bomb for the democrats. Just about all the pundits' analysis show Obama ahead on pledged delegates and Clinton ahead over-all. I suspect that if they go into the convention like that many of Clinton's superdelegates will be 'unfaithful' and vote for the good of the party. If the networks are not covering this story in capital letters I will start wearing my tin-foil hat full time.
The GOP have unelected RNC delegates, but they are a much smaller percentage of the total.

[jcd11235 0]

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Really?

Huckabee/Hillary - close, but either way the country loses.

Obama/Huckabee - Obama clear winner

McCain/Hillary - McCain clear winner

McCain/Obama - Close race, maybe some good stuff comes from it.

McCain's chances will vary significantly based not only on who he is running against, but also who his running mate is. He's 72 years old, and like it or not, there is a reasonably high probability (not necessarily over 50%, but nowhere near zero) that natural causes will kill him off within the next five years.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[rehmwa 2]

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McCain's chances will vary significantly based not only on who he is running against, but also who his running mate is. He's 72 years old, and like it or not, there is a reasonably high probability (not necessarily over 50%, but nowhere near zero) that natural causes will kill him off within the next five years.

you got that right - and he needs to continue to appeal to the center. He will make a huge mistake trying to recover the far right social conservatives with some Huckabee or equivalent (another form of fiscal liberal, IMO). He'll get them by default, or he's already lost them due to tantrums on their part. No VP choice will change the far extremes at this point. He needs to steal the center further.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[livendive 8]

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McCain's chances will vary significantly based not only on who he is running against, but also who his running mate is. He's 72 years old, and like it or not, there is a reasonably high probability (not necessarily over 50%, but nowhere near zero) that natural causes will kill him off within the next five years.

you got that right - and he needs to continue to appeal to the center. He will make a huge mistake trying to recover the far right social conservatives with some Huckabee or equivalent (another form of fiscal liberal, IMO). He'll get them by default, or he's already lost them due to tantrums on their part. No VP choice will change the far extremes at this point. He needs to steal the center further.

I doubt it's possible, but Colin Powell could almost make him a shoe-in.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[Zenister 0]

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McCain's chances will vary significantly based not only on who he is running against, but also who his running mate is. He's 72 years old, and like it or not, there is a reasonably high probability (not necessarily over 50%, but nowhere near zero) that natural causes will kill him off within the next five years.

you got that right - and he needs to continue to appeal to the center. He will make a huge mistake trying to recover the far right social conservatives with some Huckabee or equivalent (another form of fiscal liberal, IMO). He'll get them by default, or he's already lost them due to tantrums on their part. No VP choice will change the far extremes at this point. He needs to steal the center further.

I doubt it's possible, but Colin Powell could almost make him a shoe-in.

I'm pretty sure Powell has said "no way no how"..

tinfoilery is that there is 'something on him' that would prevent him from being electable if exposed.. if there is (and depending on who holds its keys) is it enough to paint him ugly even as a vice?

Hillary as a vice would sink Obama IMO...

____________________________________
Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[Andrewwhyte 1]

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I doubt it's possible, but Colin Powell could almost make him a shoe-in.

Against Clinton I think Powell would be counter productive. Against Obama it would be tokenism at its worst; no way Powell would play. I don't think he would play in any event. He allowed himself to be part of the Bush team's lies to start the war; it was wrong and he knows it.

[idrankwhat 0]

(musings)

What I've found to be very interesting is that McCain's popularity seems to be doing a pretty good job of illustrating that the party had been hijacked by a very vocal fringe element, one that seems to be losing it's influence (Thank God). McCain realizes that in a country that has split 50:50 that an effective leader works in the middle. I appreciate that much more than those who think that 1% establishes a "mandate".
I would be very interested to know who he would like to have as VP. That office now has much more power than it once did and McCain's no spring chicken.
Also, IMO I think that an Obama/Edwards ticket would be pretty strong for the Dems.

(/musings)

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you got that right - and he needs to continue to appeal to the center. He will make a huge mistake trying to recover the far right social conservatives with some Huckabee or equivalent (another form of fiscal liberal, IMO). He'll get them by default, or he's already lost them due to tantrums on their part. No VP choice will change the far extremes at this point. He needs to steal the center further.

[Amazon 7]

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I would be very interested to know who he would like to have as VP. That office now has much more power than it once did and McCain's no spring chicken.

I wonder if Lynn Cheney is ok with where her husbands right had has been for the last 8 years...I mean where he has had his right hand stuck.. working the dummys mouth and eyeballs ( although he has gotten far better with his ventriloquism in the last 3 years.. the first for years.. he could not quite the the sync down on making the lips move to what he as saying in the wooden dummy)

[Erroll 80]

In sports one often finds folks who support the underdog and folks who support the favourite.

With Barack Obama on a roll and with the Texas primary looming, I'm curious:-

To what extent would Hillary supporters and 'undecideds' vote for Obama just because he is leading the Democratic race?

[lawrocket 3]

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To what extent would Hillary supporters and 'undecideds' vote for Obama just because he is leading the Democratic race?

A large one. It's the bandwagon effect.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[Erroll 80]

If eloquence and charisma were deciders, I think Obama would walk this thing. Listening to his speech yesterday, one could not help but be impressed, whether one agrees with him or not. (And I did not once see him refer to his notes, while McCain did not string more than four words together without looking at his notes).

[TheAnvil 0]

Sen. Obama is the best orator on the political stage in quite some time. I agree with you - if charisma could carry the day on its own, he would win hands down. Without my vote, but win he definitely would.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[nerdgirl 0]

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Sen. Obama is the best orator on the political stage in quite some time. I agree with you - if charisma could carry the day on its own, he would win hands down. Without my vote, but win he definitely would.

What other (relatively) recent politician had similar characterizations -- both the positive & the critical -- made about him?

"Yes, it's the most obvious part of him, and yes, it was mentioned, referenced, alluded to, chatted about, and glossed upon countless times this week. It seems simple enough -- the man was magnetic, charming, soothing, likeable. But try to really get your arms around this part of Reagan, beyond these thin adjectives. ...Charisma has a bad name in the media. It's squishy and suspect, part of the Character Journalism category that various media prudes feel journalists should avoid like a bad infection, especially when it comes to politicians."

VR/Marg

Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters.
Tibetan Buddhist saying

[happythoughts 0]

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Pretty good interview of Obama on 60 Minutes last night. Not-so-good of Hillary ("enough about you -- tell me more about Obame").

Wendy W.

You need to be fair about this. She is still leading the Democratic Party to victory and she has the most delegates, just ask her.

[TheAnvil 0]

Reagan is hands down my favorite president of my short lifetime. What a fantastic American. It's hard to believe it's ben 20 years since he left office. Just think of the one-liners he would have produced about El Jefe Clintonista and friends!

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[billvon 3,111]

>Just think of the one-liners he would have produced about El Jefe
>Clintonista and friends!

When I think of great presidents, I think what they might have done for the country - not what great partisan attacks they'd launch.

I read a recent article on how the "partisan divide" is getting wider and wider, and I fear it's true. We really do take more pride in dissing others than promoting good people lately.

[jcd11235 0]

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Reagan is hands down my favorite president of my short lifetime. What a fantastic American. It's hard to believe it's ben 20 years since he left office. Just think of the one-liners he would have produced about El Jefe Clintonista and friends!

The best thing about Reagan was that he was able to act presidential. Aside from that, he was an overall lousy president. We're certainly better off for his embracing of the mujahideen groups as freedom fighters in Afghanistan.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[TheAnvil 0]

EJC's reign was after Reagan left office...Reagan's Alzheimer's prevented him from being more active after his presidency. He did great good for the country and the world while in office.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[tbrown 26]

Only if they run on the ticket together (with Bubba in the background). I wouldn't even vote for that.

Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !

[TheAnvil 0]

Steve Coll wrote an excellent book called GHOST WARS. You should read it. You might also review history and familiarize yourself with something known as the Cold War.

Reagan did more good than bad - far more. What really yanks left wingers' chains is the fact that Reagan didn't let their bullshit sway him left. Firing the ATC bubbas was fantastic!

Clicky

Clicky

Clicky

Great man.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[Amazon 7]

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Reagan's Alzheimer's prevented him from being more active after during his presidency. He did great good for the country for defense contractors with his trickle on economics and the world while in office.

There fixed it for you.

Perhaps the goons in the basement of the WHite House would have been a bit more under control with their illegal actions/plausible deniability with dealing with Iran Contra if he had been a bit more awake instead of sleeping as much.