kallend 2,150 #1 January 3, 2008 Has anyone read: PERFECTLY LEGAL: THE COVERT CAMPAIGN TO RIG OUR TAX SYSTEM TO BENEFIT THE SUPER RICH - AND CHEAT EVERYBODY ELSE. By David Cay Johnston. New York: Penguin Group Inc. Fascinating stuff about the IRS, political pressure applied by wealthy donors, how TIF districts funnel taxpayer money to the wealthiest families, etc.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #2 January 3, 2008 Article here.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #3 January 3, 2008 Why would any Politician try to reform our tax system? It's political suicide. Every time it's tried, the discussion is shut down by left-wing funded Democrats screaming "Tax cuts for the Rich." I've never seen a Democrat proposal for income tax reform. A tweak here and there. buts thats all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #4 January 3, 2008 QuoteI've never seen a Democrat proposal for income tax reform. You see what you want to see and you hear what you want to hear.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #5 January 3, 2008 QuoteQuoteI've never seen a Democrat proposal for income tax reform. You see what you want to see and you hear what you want to hear. Please enlighten me. What proposal for major tax reform has been submitted by Democrats and what was the result? I did edit my post to say a tweak here and there. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #6 January 3, 2008 QuoteQuoteI've never seen a Democrat proposal for income tax reform. You see what you want to see and you hear what you want to hear. Why yes, thank you, I would like an omelet right about now? ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #7 January 3, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuoteI've never seen a Democrat proposal for income tax reform. You see what you want to see and you hear what you want to hear. Please enlighten me. What proposal for major tax reform has been submitted by Democrats and what was the result? I did edit my post to say a tweak here and there. So . . . There has NEVER been any sweeping change to any part of the tax system; income, payroll or otherwise, that did not include BOTH parties.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #8 January 3, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteI've never seen a Democrat proposal for income tax reform. You see what you want to see and you hear what you want to hear. Please enlighten me. What proposal for major tax reform has been submitted by Democrats and what was the result? I did edit my post to say a tweak here and there. So . . . There has NEVER been any sweeping change to any part of the tax system; income, payroll or otherwise, that did not include BOTH parties. Kind of hard to get there when the entire concept is shut down before any healthy debate can begin. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheBachelor 5 #9 January 3, 2008 QuoteI've never seen a Democrat proposal for income tax reform. A tweak here and there. buts thats all. Actually Charles Rangel proposed a "mother of all tax reforms" (tax increases) in 2007. You can search his name and find a ton of articles. Here is one that gives an overview, along with a number of links to more information: http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Rangel_tax_overhaul_plan_(2007)There are battered women? I've been eating 'em plain all of these years... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #10 January 3, 2008 While I applaud Rangels efforts, his "Mother of all tax reforms" is the same old tweak we always get. It raises taxes on "high income families" defined as married couples making over $200K per year. Any idea of how far that goes in areas like NY, DC or many other cities in the US? I'd hardly call that level of income "rich" in those areas. Again, here just like every other attempt at any kind of reform is quashed by Democrats. http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=a2Ydcv4tYVCc&refer=home QuoteFew Democratic lawmakers or candidates rose to Rangel's defense. Of the party's top-tier presidential hopefuls, only Senator Hillary Clinton of New York commented on the plan: ``Senator Clinton and Representative Rangel share the broad goal of progressive tax reform,'' said Phil Singer, a campaign spokesman. SOTH Pelosi, one of the wealthiest politicians, also opposes Rangels "reform", so good luck there. I am glad to see Rangels effort to raise the income level before the AMT kicks in. This again is just a tweak not reform. I am not defending Republicans on this either. I am pissed they have been promising major tax reform since 1994 and so far have failed to deliver any real reforms. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
speedy 0 #11 January 4, 2008 Quote Has anyone read: PERFECTLY LEGAL: THE COVERT CAMPAIGN TO RIG OUR TAX SYSTEM TO BENEFIT THE SUPER RICH - AND CHEAT EVERYBODY ELSE. By David Cay Johnston. New York: Penguin Group Inc. Fascinating stuff about the IRS, political pressure applied by wealthy donors, how TIF districts funnel taxpayer money to the wealthiest families, etc. Is it peer reviewed? Dave Fallschirmsport Marl Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #12 January 4, 2008 Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nanook 1 #13 January 4, 2008 QuoteIs it peer reviewed? Probably not. It would probably be a conflict of interest in most eyes anyways as I can see that the Subject Matter Experts here would be the Tax People themselves. One thing is factual about U. S. taxes. It favors Buisness. I think that's more true than saying it favors the Rich. Almost all the Rich are Buisness men anyways._____________________________ "The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #14 January 4, 2008 As a practical matter, business will never "pay" taxes... they increase their prices so that their bottom line isn't affected. Too bad that Congress can't figure that out...Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lucky... 0 #15 January 4, 2008 Quote Why would any Politician try to reform our tax system? It's political suicide. Every time it's tried, the discussion is shut down by left-wing funded Democrats screaming "Tax cuts for the Rich." I've never seen a Democrat proposal for income tax reform. A tweak here and there. buts thats all. You didn't watch Clinton raise taxes on the riich? You didn't watch Clinton cut spending? You didn't watch the 250B/yr deficit get knocked to zero and the debt level off as far as increase? You apparently weren't watching. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,119 #16 January 4, 2008 > As a practical matter, business will never "pay" taxes... they increase >their prices so that their bottom line isn't affected. Well, by the same rationale, people never "pay" taxes either. They generally just spend less so their bottom line isn't affected. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #17 January 4, 2008 Quote > As a practical matter, business will never "pay" taxes... they increase >their prices so that their bottom line isn't affected. Well, by the same rationale, people never "pay" taxes either. They generally just spend less so their bottom line isn't affected. Suurrrreeee thing, Bill..... whatever you say. Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,119 #18 January 4, 2008 >Suurrrreeee thing, Bill..... whatever you say. Ah, of course. Your silly numbers example is much better than my silly numbers example. Sorry, I forgot how that works. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #19 January 4, 2008 Quote Quote Why would any Politician try to reform our tax system? It's political suicide. Every time it's tried, the discussion is shut down by left-wing funded Democrats screaming "Tax cuts for the Rich." I've never seen a Democrat proposal for income tax reform. A tweak here and there. buts thats all. You didn't watch Clinton raise taxes on the riich? You didn't watch Clinton cut spending? You didn't watch the 250B/yr deficit get knocked to zero and the debt level off as far as increase? You apparently weren't watching. And this has exactly what to do with tax reform? Right...exactly ...nothing but a strawman. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #20 January 4, 2008 Quote> As a practical matter, business will never "pay" taxes... they increase >their prices so that their bottom line isn't affected. Well, by the same rationale, people never "pay" taxes either. They generally just spend less so their bottom line isn't affected. So by your rationale we should tax businesses more so they have less to spend so more people can be unemployed. edited to add businesses. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,119 #21 January 4, 2008 >So by your rationale we should tax them more so they have less to spend >so more people can be unemployed. Nope, not at all! Next assumption? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #22 January 4, 2008 Quote >So by your rationale we should tax them more so they have less to spend >so more people can be unemployed. Nope, not at all! Next assumption? Right, the less money a business has the more people they are financially able to hire. And the fewer people who are employed, the more money they will have to spend on higher prices caused by higher taxes on businesses. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,119 #23 January 4, 2008 >Right, the less money a business has the more people they are financially able to hire. Completely wrong. Next incorrect assumption? Can you hit the trifecta? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dannydan 5 #24 January 4, 2008 Quote Too bad that Congress can't figure that out... Thus b/c they're in the "business" too!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nanook 1 #25 January 4, 2008 QuoteAs a practical matter, business will never "pay" taxes... they increase their prices so that their bottom line isn't affected. Too bad that Congress can't figure that out... I wish it was that easy. If that was the truth, then you never as a business owner have to worry about taxes as all you have to do in increase the price. But the consumer has more of a say in how much they want to pay for a product or service. If taxed too much, a company usually looks elsewhere (usually in it's own process) to be able to cut costs rather than raise prices._____________________________ "The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
