US 'must break Iran and Syria regimes' (!?)

[vortexring 0]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/10/05/wiran105.xml

Love his explanation of Iraq becoming the international terrorist bug-zapper... Sorry. In fact, I don't.

I would love to set about him with a 2 pound lump hammer though.

'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

[Amazon 7]

Another fucking NEO-CON chickenhawk.. who makes the policy and expects other people to die instead of him..

If these assholes want reginme change some of them might try going and doing it in person...ALL of them.

[Royd 0]

You noticed that the Syrians weren't crying foul over the destruction of their nuclear facility. Hmmm.....

[vortexring 0]

Quote

Another fucking NEO-CON chickenhawk.. who makes the policy and expects other people to die instead of him..

If these assholes want reginme change some of them might try going and doing it in person...ALL of them.

Ah, my thoughts exactly. Except maybe I could describe him as being something worse than an asshole.

'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

[Amazon 7]

I think all of them ..EVERY last one of them should be taken and dumped out in a Bahgdad neighborhood outrside of the green zone..... the world would be a better place

[vortexring 0]

Yep, indeed in it would. Who exactly votes for these people!

How can our leaders actually call themselves such?

How can Americans be proud of the fact they're led by a Chimp FFS?

It's not a dig at the US - but how can any reasonable person vote for such a proven fool? Vote for a man who accomplished nothing in his life - Jeez, I could go on for a bit here. But it's not exactly necessary is it?

Bollox - I said this years ago; I wish Bush and Saddam just sorted it all out in the ring - with chainsaws...

'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

[Hausse 0]

Hm isn't the REAL question: DO they have OIL?

[Amazon 7]

Quote

Yep, indeed in it would. Who exactly votes for these people!

The people who think blowjobs are the worst thing that can happen in the world....

Probably because they themselves cant get laid on a regular basis.

[vortexring 0]

Or, besides being unable to get laid, are stupid?

'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

[rushmc 23]

Quote

I think all of them ..EVERY last one of them should be taken and dumped out in a Bahgdad neighborhood outrside of the green zone..... the world would be a better place

Yep, you know what everyone else should do better than fucking anybody. Nice you should suggest a way to get rid of those you do not agree with. Now doesnt that make you a winner.

Your true colors are showing and they are red with cycle and hammer

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[vortexring 0]

That's very observant - it screams that doesn't it?

Ya fruit loop!

'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

[Amazon 7]

Quote

Your true colors are showing and they are red with cycle and hammer

Get a fucking grip there Bubba

Its sooo typical of the way the NEO CONS and the republicans have been treating ANYONE who disagrees with their pet little war for oil.

We beat them commmies.... old news... we won... but you do all the people who did serve to defeat them a great disservice... all that THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE that you guys roll out is just somehow very hollow when you do not allow a dissenting opinion.

I served my country for 8 long years....

HAVE YOU ever served anything???.... or is it that YOUR NEO CON MANTRA of NEO FASCISM alive and well

Get out there and serve your country if you love war so much

Oh thats right.. OTHER people have to serve in the NEO CONS world view

All the cowards that SUPPORT this war yet will not go and serve... Make me sick

[ryoder 1,590]

Quote

Your true colors are showing and they are red with cycle and hammer

I believe this is close enough to declare it an invocation of Godwin's Law, but it would be less funny if you had used the work "sickle" instead of "cycle".

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[funkcanna 0]

Whos gonna overthrow the US regime with its nucular capability and extreme desire to control the world?

To know requires proof
To believe requires evidence
To have faith requires neither.
If you stick with that, we'll never be confused again

[Royd 0]

Quote

Get a fucking grip there Bubba

Its sooo typical of the way the NEO CONS and the republicans have been treating ANYONE who disagrees with their pet little war for oil.

We beat them commmies.... old news... we won... but you do all the people who did serve to defeat them a great disservice... all that THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE that you guys roll out is just somehow very hollow when you do not allow a dissenting opinion.

I served my country for 8 long years....

HAVE YOU ever served anything???.... or is it that YOUR NEO CON MANTRA of NEO FASCISM alive and well

Get out there and serve your country if you love war so much

Oh thats right.. OTHER people have to serve in the NEO CONS world view

All the cowards that SUPPORT this war yet will not go and serve... Make me sick

Geez,don't you have a plane to go jump out of, or something?

[Amazon 7]

Quote

Geez,don't you have a plane to go jump out of, or something?

Current weather at Whidbey Island NAS....

http://www.weather.com/weather/local/USWA0309?from=search_city

And I still think all those who support this war... should fucking be over there REALLLY supporting the troops( since most of them really do not REALLY support the troops or they would be actually funding veterans programs that take care of all those who are coming back broken or mentally infirm...just as they did to all of us in former generations)

[DZJ 0]

Quote

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/10/05/wiran105.xml

I sometimes wonder if there's any real US 'policy' towards the Middle East at all, or if it just a matter of smashing up the entire region with a sledgehammer(with the notable exception of Israel).

[Amazon 7]

The actual policy that the fucktards in THIS administration believe in.... they are fostering End Times Prophecy.. stir up the forces of "evil" enough so we all meet at the battleground of Megiddo.. so they can get RAPTURED out and be with Jesus.. leaving all the unblievers behind.

[ryoder 1,590]

Quote

Quote

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/10/05/wiran105.xml

I sometimes wonder if there's any real US 'policy' towards the Middle East at all, or if it just a matter of smashing up the entire region with a sledgehammer(with the notable exception of Israel).

It is the "shoot first; ask questions later" policy, but without the "ask questions" part, since the administration has no interest in what anyone else has to say.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[SpeedRacer 1]

Quote

The actual policy that the fucktards in THIS administration believe in.... they are fostering End Times Prophecy.. stir up the forces of "evil" enough so we all meet at the battleground of Megiddo.. so they can get RAPTURED out and be with Jesus.. leaving all the unblievers behind.

Are U.S. troops being force-fed Christianity?
A watchdog group alleges that improper evangelizing is occurring within the ranks.
By Jane Lampman | Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor
At Speicher base in Iraq, US Army Spec. Jeremy Hall got permission from a chaplain in August to post fliers announcing a meeting for atheists and other nonbelievers. When the group gathered, Specialist Hall alleges, his Army major supervisor disrupted the meeting and threatened to retaliate against him, including blocking his reenlistment in the Army.

Months earlier, Hall charges, he had been publicly berated by a staff sergeant for not agreeing to join in a Thanksgiving Day prayer.

On Sept. 17, the soldier and the Military Religious Freedom Foundation (MRFF) filed suit against Army Maj. Freddy Welborn and US Secretary of Defense Robert Gates, charging violations of Hall's constitutional rights, including being forced to submit to a religious test to qualify as a soldier.

The MRFF plans more lawsuits in coming weeks, says Michael "Mikey" Weinstein, who founded the military watchdog group in 2005. The aim is "to show there is a pattern and practice of constitutionally impermissible promotions of religious beliefs within the Department of Defense."

For Mr. Weinstein – a former Air Force judge advocate and assistant counsel in the Reagan White House – more is involved than isolated cases of discrimination. He charges that several incidents in recent years – and more than 5,000 complaints his group has received from active-duty and retired military personnel – point to a growing willingness inside the military to support a particular brand of Christianity and to permit improper evangelizing in the ranks. More than 95 percent of those complaints come from other Christians, he says.

Others agree on the need for the watchdog group, but question the conspiratorial view and some of its tactics. They say dealing with religious issues is a complex matter, and the military is trying to address them appropriately.

At the Defense Department, spokeswoman Cynthia Smith says the DOD doesn't comment on litigation, but "places a high value on the rights of members of the Armed Forces to observe the tenets of their respective religions."

Since the Revolutionary War, the armed services have tried to ensure that soldiers can practice their faiths, and that chaplains serve not only those of their own sect but all who may need pastoral care. The services have also sought to adhere to the First Amendment prohibition of any government "establishment of religion."

In the 1990s, for instance, the Air Force's Little Blue Book of core values highlighted religious tolerance, emphasizing that military professionals "must not take it upon themselves to change or coercively influence the religious views of subordinates."

Weinstein insists, however, that there are improper actions at high levels that not only infringe on soldiers' rights but, at a very dangerous time, also send the wrong message to people in the Middle East that those in the US military see themselves engaged in Christian warfare.

For example, he says, Lt. Gen. William Boykin, who gave speeches at churches while in uniform that disparaged Islam and defined the war on terror in fundamentalist, "end times" terms, was not fired but promoted. (Speaking of a Muslim warlord he had pursued, Lt. Gen. Boykin said, "I knew my God was a real God and his was an idol." And our enemies "will only be defeated if we come against them in the name of Jesus.")

"There's an eschatologically obsessed version of Christianity that ... is trying to make American foreign and domestic policy conterminous with their biblical worldview," Weinstein charges. And "there's improper pressure within the military command structure to make members join them."

The most serious allegations from the field cannot be corroborated for this article. A few will be raised in the lawsuits, but some incidents have been documented.

Perhaps the most visible situation – and the one that set Weinstein off on his mission – involved the evangelizing of cadets on the part of some faculty and staff at the Air Force Academy (AFA) in Colorado Springs, Colo., which came to light in 2004. Congress held hearings, DOD conducted an investigation, and the head of the academy acknowledged significant problems. Weinstein's cadet son experienced the pressures as a Jew.

Col. David Antoon (ret.), another alumnus of the AFA and now a 747 commercial pilot, says his heart was broken when he took his son, Ryan, to an orientation at the academy in the spring of 2004. An overt evangelistic approach during part of the orientation so upset them, he says, that they decided his son would reject the treasured appointment and instead go to Ohio State University.

"My son had dreamed of doing what I had done, but it was no longer the institution I went to," Colonel Antoon says, his voice cracking with emotion.

The Air Force set about reaffirming basic principles in religion guidelines, as a basis for widespread training, but a pushback by Evangelicals later led to Congress setting them aside until hearings could be held. The hearings have not taken place.

In 2006, MRFF learned of a video produced by Christian Embassy, a group that conducts Bible studies at the Pentagon and seeks to evangelize within the armed services. Aimed at fundraising for the group, the video was improperly taped in the Pentagon and involved endorsements by Army and Air Force generals in uniform.

MRFF's public alert spurred a DOD investigation. In a report critical of the senior officers, the Inspector General said they gave the appearance of speaking for the military. One general defended his role by saying "Christian Embassy had become a quasi-federal entity."

The report noted that Maj. Gen. Paul Sutton participated while he served as chief of the US Office of Defense Cooperation in Turkey, a largely Muslim nation whose military takes pride in protecting the country's secular status. After a Turkish newspaper wrote about the video as promoting a "fundamentalist sect," General Sutton was called in and questioned by members of the Turkish General Staff.

"They had to give him a lesson in the separation of church and state," Weinstein says. "Imagine the propaganda bonanza! And how this upset Muslims."

The DOD report on the video recommended "appropriate corrective action" be taken against the officers. According to Army spokesman Paul Boyce, "The Army has not yet completed any planned actions associated with the Christian Embassy review."

MRFF claims a victory in the case of the evangelical group Operation Stand Up. Earlier this year, OSU was preparing to send "freedom packages" to soldiers in Iraq as part of an Army program. Along with socks and snacks, the packages included proselytizing materials in English and Arabic, and the apocalyptic video game, "Left Behind: Eternal Forces." In it, Christians carry on warfare against people of other faiths.

After the plans were made public, the Pentagon announced in August that the materials would not be mailed. OSU did not respond to a request for comment.

Weinstein – an intense, voluble attorney who prizes blunt, no-holds-barred language – has struck more than one nerve with his bird-dogging. He says numerous threats have been made on his life. Last week, the front window of his house was shot out for the second time. After the lawsuit was filed, talk of "fragging" (killing) Specialist Hall surfaced on some military blogs. The Army is investigating.

Others sympathetic to Weinstein's concerns say some tactics undermine his efforts, and they question aims.

"He's uncovered some very disturbing stuff that shouldn't be going on in the armed forces," says Marc Stern, a religious liberty expert at American Jewish Congress. "But it's important that you not go too far." Mr. Stern disagrees, for instance, with Weinstein's stance on the Air Force guidelines, such as preventing military supervisors from ever speaking of religion to people under their command.

"He did a disservice to his and our cause by taking a position beyond what the law requires, and in fact may intrude on people's rights," Stern adds.

Several conservative Christian ministries publicly proclaim an evangelistic aim "to transform the nations of the world through the militaries of the world," and they are active at US military installations in many countries. (See www.militaryministry.org or militarymissionsnetwork.org.)

MRFF sees that as a harbinger of a volunteer military falling under the sway of increasing numbers of Christian soldiers. Others see a military leadership, with the exception of a few generals here or there, well aware of its constitutional responsibilities, but challenged by the demands of training on these issues in a military of millions. A group such as MRFF can provide a crucial service, they say, if it is willing to work with the military.

Right now, Weinstein is counting on a set of lawsuits to bring serious issues to the fore. The question is whether those suits will go beyond individual cases of discrimination to prove an unconstitutional pattern within the armed forces.

Speed Racer
--------------------------------------------------

[vortexring 0]

Here's something written in 2006, from the Economist:

'STUFF happens, said a nonchalant Donald Rumsfeld, as looters trashed Baghdad. The birth pangs of a new Middle East, claimed Condoleezza Pollyanna Rice last week as Hizbullah's rockets slammed into Israel and Israel's aircraft pulverised Lebanon. This week America was conspicuously resisting calls for an immediate Israeli withdrawal. Whatever else is going wrong for America in the Middle East, the Bush administration shows an unmatched ability to put its case in ways that make its friends squirm and its enemies fume with rage. Beyond the tin ear, however, is American policy really as malign, muddle-headed and incompetent as its critics say?

The short answer is that America does not have a single policy for the whole Middle East. Some of the so-called neoconservatives believe that one idea—spreading liberal democracy to the Arab world and Iran—should guide all America's actions across the region. But for all their influence, the neocons have never quite got their way. Nor should they. The Middle East is a large and complex place in which America is engaged on many fronts.… '

'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

[Amazon 7]

1. Onward, Christian soldiers, marching as to war,
with the cross of Jesus going on before.
Christ, the royal Master, leads against the foe;
forward into battle see his banners go!
Refrain:
Onward, Christian soldiers, marching as to war,
with the cross of Jesus going on before.

2. At the sign of triumph Satan's host doth flee;
on then, Christian soldiers, on to victory!
Hell's foundations quiver at the shout of praise;
brothers, lift your voices, loud your anthems raise.
(Refrain)

3. Like a mighty army moves the church of God;
brothers, we are treading where the saints have trod.
We are not divided, all one body we,
one in hope and doctrine, one in charity.
(Refrain)

4. Crowns and thrones may perish, kingdoms rise and wane,
but the church of Jesus constant will remain.
Gates of hell can never gainst that church prevail;
we have Christ's own promise, and that cannot fail.
(Refrain)

5. Onward then, ye people, join our happy throng,
blend with ours your voices in the triumph song.
Glory, laud, and honor unto Christ the King,
this through countless ages men and angels sing.
(Refrain)

[nerdgirl 0]

Quote

You noticed that the Syrians weren't crying foul over the destruction of their nuclear facility. Hmmm.....

What destroyed nuclear facility? The Der Al-Hadjar 30-kw research reactor near Damascus (built with assistance of Belgium, Germany, Russia, China, US & under IAEA safeguards) is still functioning, was not targeted by Israel, and poses minimal to no credible threat.

Do you mean the 6 September bombing by Israelis? The target appears to have been short range Scud missiles or missile parts & possibly a Russian radar installation, which might have been helping guard the Dair el Zor site.

What remains under some debate is whether the missiles/parts can be 100% ascribed to DPRK. Most unclassified evidence does point to Pyongyang. Reportedly, the US Navy wanted to board the ship in Morocco’s territorial waters but the Moroccan government vetoed the operation (if true, interesting aside of impact on Proliferation Security Initiative –such activity is *exactly* what the PSI was designed for!).

For the wonkish, the targeted shipment is thought to have been SS-1d or SS-1e variety with ranges of 550-700km (~300-400 miles). The SS1-d have been adapted in the past to carry nerve agent (thickened VX & sarin)-containing warheads. Serious speculative questions arise within that context.

http://www.dni.gov/reports/2004_unclass_report_to_NIC_DO_16Nov04.pdf
See page 5 w/r/t Syria’s previous activities on obtaining SCUD missiles from DPRK & p.8 w/r/t DPRK’s role as the Wal-Mart of ballistic missile parts (okay, the IC doesn’t use that characterization, but it’s an apt metaphor).

Additional serious context, Christopher Hill & his State VCI team just completed the latest round nuclear verifiable elimination (one can hope!) talks with DPRK - negotiations and international diplomacy to which John Bolton-esque folks have been opposed almost since Day 1. Kudos to Hill for sticking with a realist strategy.

VR/Marg

Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters.
Tibetan Buddhist saying

[akarunway 1]

Quote

The actual policy that the fucktards in THIS administration believe in.... they are fostering End Times Prophecy.. stir up the forces of "evil" enough so we all meet at the battleground of Megiddo.. so they can get RAPTURED out and be with Jesus.. leaving all the unblievers behind.

So that means I get left behind?

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[ryoder 1,590]

Quote

Quote

The actual policy that the fucktards in THIS administration believe in.... they are fostering End Times Prophecy.. stir up the forces of "evil" enough so we all meet at the battleground of Megiddo.. so they can get RAPTURED out and be with Jesus.. leaving all the unblievers behind.

So that means I get left behind?

Now honestly, would you really want to be stuck with all the Bible-thumpers for all of eternity??? That would be my idea of Hell.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.