Government workers don't like coach class.

[kallend 2,117]

online.wsj.com/article/SB119136054325946827.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[normiss 871]

they're not the only ones...two previous companies I worked for always seemed to find a way to purchase Fisrt Class tickets, and stay at 5 star hotels...
of course we never complained...but the mindset it creates. It helped some of the guys find other ways to spend money. Like buying golf shirts at restaurants over a business meal because it gets listed on the food receipt...

[kallend 2,117]

Quote

they're not the only ones...two previous companies I worked for always seemed to find a way to purchase Fisrt Class tickets, and stay at 5 star hotels...
of course we never complained...but the mindset it creates. It helped some of the guys find other ways to spend money. Like buying golf shirts at restaurants over a business meal because it gets listed on the food receipt...

If companies do it, it comes out of their profits. When government agencies do it, the taxpayers pay.

"With the serious fiscal challenges facing the federal government, agencies must maximize their ability to manage and safeguard valuable taxpayers' dollars," investigators wrote, suggesting agencies recoup the extra cost from those who abuse travel policies.

Under federal rules, government employees generally must fly coach for both domestic and international travel unless the flight takes 14 hours or longer. A few exceptions apply when the employee receives agency approval based on a medical condition, security concerns, lack of availability of coach seats or when required "because of agency mission."

Government investigators found that employees openly flouted the rules and agencies did little to check their abuses. Among the waste cited:

_An Agriculture Department executive took 25 premium-class flights costing $163,000 and said the extra expense had been authorized by a subordinate. In 10 of those trips, the traveler claimed exceptional circumstances to justify the pricier travel to western Europe, even though agency policy forbids premium-class travel unless the flight time is longer than 14 hours.

_Thirty-two State Department employees flew from Washington to Liberia in premium class over a six-month period. Five of those travelers did not have authorization for premium class; three had duplicate tickets and no evidence that the duplicates were refunded; and 17 were not properly justified, as their trips did not meet the 14-hour rule. These flights cost $293,000 and comparable coach-class tickets would have cost $124,000 — a difference of $169,000.

_At the Pentagon, a political appointee took 15 premium-class flights and cited a medical condition as justification for the $105,000 in expenses. However, the only evidence of a medical condition was a note signed by a fellow Pentagon employee, not a physician, attesting to surgery from several years earlier. The Pentagon did not have a doctor's certification from the employee as required by agency policy.

_Nine Justice Department employees charged the agency $35,000 for premium-class air tickets to Frankfurt, Germany, claiming the flight time was over 14 hours. Investigators found the employees added a separate flight to their calculations to reach the 14-hour total, a practice not allowed under government travel rules. Also, two of the flights were not authorized.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Gravitymaster 0]

Pelosis' Jet???

[Remster 30]

Business, for long trips, I can understand. First Class, really, there is no reason to buy it unless you are filthy rich and its your money.

When at a previous employer, if the flight was over 4 hours, we traveled business. Often, the price of business was very close to full fare economy.

But again, real First Class, is really a luxury.

Remster

[kallend 2,117]

Quote

Pelosis' Jet???

I guess you didn't bother to read the articles.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Shotgun 1]

Well, I'd be concerned about the sanity of anyone who actually likes coach class.

[Zipp0 1]

It mostly seems to be the big shots who are 'too good' fir coach. I work for the government, and they check everything like that here. We have limits on hotel costs,flight types, and rental cars (usually can't even get one).

--------------------------
Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

[lawrocket 3]

Ahhh, yes. What do you expect when you can spend other people's moneyt on yourself?

This is the way government works. The government can be rather lavish on itself. Anybody who doesn't have to pay the tab will want the best for him or herself.

If these guys spent money themselves, then they'd likely be content with coach. Of course, if they were buying tickets for someone else they would demand that the person took coach.

SO here you see the great example of government spending, be it on travel, healthcare or anything else.

If the government is going to pay for it, the government will expect coach class in travel, healthcare, you name it! The government will not tolerate the business or first class (ha! Sounds like the Democratic Platform, eh? Class warfare). The government cares not whether it's any good. After all, it's free, right? Which is what government healthcare will be.

Of course, the people will expect that the government provide business class of first class! Be it travel or healthcare, they'll expect the govt. to spring for the best! And the people will be sad that government healthcare is NOT first class.

Welcome to the world of government! Welcome to the future of government healthcare. People - you'll get coach service. Bureaucrats? Well, they'll likely direct a little more funding their way, thus ensuring greater compliance with the Cuban model so adored by the disciples of Michael Moore.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[Andy9o8 2]

You guys are all such a bunch of whiners. The lavish travel is good for their morale, which means they'll do a better job for you. Call it an investment. Plus, don't forget the trickle-down. Sure, the tickets cost more, but that means higher sales tax being kicked back into your pockets. And the airlines make more profits, but that means more corporate income tax being kicked back into your pockets. The airlines then invest those higher profits back into the economy, where ultimately the extra money will pay for school meals for indigent children. Overall, it's a win-win-win-win.

[pop 0]

Quote

online.wsj.com/article/SB119136054325946827.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

I am not a big fan of cattle class either. I rarely every fly coach...especially when traveling oversees......fuhgetaboutit!

7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer

[kallend 2,117]

Quote

Quote

online.wsj.com/article/SB119136054325946827.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

I am not a big fan of cattle class either. I rarely every fly coach...especially when traveling oversees......fuhgetaboutit!

But you happly cram onto a Twin Otter with 21 other people.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[pop 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

online.wsj.com/article/SB119136054325946827.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

I am not a big fan of cattle class either. I rarely every fly coach...especially when traveling oversees......fuhgetaboutit!

But you happly cram onto a Twin Otter with 21 other people.

its only for 15 minutes at a time...and i always try to sit in the front near the door :)

7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

and i always try to sit in the front near the door :)

you sit in the co-pilot seat?

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[wmw999 2,558]

Before we get all wound up about gummint workers in general, remember

Quote

Senior executives and presidential appointees, who comprise less than 0.5% of the federal work force, accounted for 15% of the tab, it said.

It's those upper class guys who are too good to hang with the proles, I tell you

Really, there are processes to keep this from happening across a whole lot of the spectrum. We can only fly other-than-coach if the flight is longer than (don't remember but it's a lot) AND we're meeting the day we arrive, or the day after if we arrive at night.

Otherwise, on those long flights, we can take a day of rest if we flew coach. My time is no way so valuable that a day + hotel and food comes close to covering the difference for a business class ticket.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[pop 0]

Quote

Quote

and i always try to sit in the front near the door :)

you sit in the co-pilot seat?

lol...i meant the back.

7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer

[nigel99 586]

I'm not going to defend your government workers spending. But I will throw something else in the mix. Airlines such as BA have sleeper beds in business class and when I was flying to the States alot it mean't that I could sleep well which meant the next day was immediately productive (hence my not defending gov workers - are they ever productive?).

I had a few clients who bitched that I wanted to travel business - which was fine - they then paid an extra day of my time (each end) due to lost productivity as they accepted you couldn't function after an overnight in coach. Strangely this incurred an extra night in a hotel and overall cost them more - but it fit their rules better.

On 2 or 3 occassions I flew London-Dallas-London business class and just being in the US long enough for meetings. I wouldn't attempt that in coach (or Delta type business where it is just a bigger seat and free booze).

The bigger question on costings is probably flexible/non-flexible tickets. You pay 2 or 3 times the price (a flexible coach ticket is more than a fixed business ticket). I reckon alot more Government money is wasted on this.

Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

Quote

Quote

and i always try to sit in the front near the door :)

you sit in the co-pilot seat?

lol...i meant the back.

ahh, you're a belly flyer

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants