"One of Britain's biggest illegal gun dealers"

[JohnRich 4]

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What is the issue here? Police make mistakes, newspapers exaggerate facts. Unfortunate and regrettable, but looks like dog bites man to me...

I think that 10 months in prison for a crime he didn't commit, is more than just "dog bites man".

And the police mistake is particularly aggregious, since the anti-gun squad didn't even bother to check the firearms licenses to see if the man was legal, before raiding his house.

But is all of that okay with you?

What's the point of gun licensing and inspections if you're just going to ignore them and arrest anyone with a gun in their home?

I hope he sues the hell out of police to recover his losses, with a huge award for pain and suffering from his unwarranted prison time.

[DZJ 0]

As I wrote (though you apparently didn't read it) this incident is unfortunate and regrettable. Further, one would hope that the police will learn lessons from this case, and that the Met will better coordinate its activities with regional forces in future.

Also, I'd rather have a system of gun regulations that occasionally go awry than have a system with almost no regulation whatsoever.

[Scoop 0]

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And the police mistake is particularly aggregious, since the anti-gun squad didn't even bother to check the firearms licenses to see if the man was legal, before raiding his house.

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How exactly would you know he is complying without checking?

[JohnRich 4]

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And the police mistake is particularly aggregious, since the anti-gun squad didn't even bother to check the firearms licenses to see if the man was legal, before raiding his house.

How exactly would you know he is complying without checking?

Read the story.

You don't conduct an audit by sending in a SWAT team to kick down the front door. You send a cop with a clipboard and checklist, and politely knock on the front door. That latter method is what the inspection team did, everything checked out okay, and his license was renewed. But the SWAT team didn't bother to find any of that out - they just went in "guns blazing" (figuratively), arrested everyone, and confiscated everything.

A request for those of you who voted that he deserved to be prosecuted: Please explain why.

[Scoop 0]

John,

Firstly, we don't have SWAT in the UK.

Secondly, if it is believed someone is an illegal gun trader selling dangerous weapons (albeit incorrectly) you wouldn't walk in with a clipboard and a pen. This is especially funny coming from you, the man who probably wouldn't even go to the grocers without a 12" blade and high powered pistol on your hip.

Stop being suck a fucking hypocrite

[Kennedy 0]

I'm going to take this line by line, because you stopped making sense a while back.

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Firstly, we don't have SWAT in the UK.

Actually, you do.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_Response_Vehicle

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Armed Response Vehicles (ARVs) are the British police's solution to combating armed criminal activity. They are also sometimes used for escorting Category A (high-risk) prisoners during transfers.
...
Weapons include Glock 17 pistols for all officers, and each car also carries two Heckler & Koch MP5 sub-machine guns in a locked gun cupboard. Both weapons are chambered for 9mm rounds, selected for its good stopping power, in particular a statistically high one-shot stop probability.

A rose by any other name...

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Secondly, if it is believed someone is an illegal gun trader selling dangerous weapons (albeit incorrectly) you wouldn't walk in with a clipboard and a pen.

And why exactly would you suspect that when another officer recently went in with a clipboard and discovered that everything is fine? The point is SOME ONE ELSE JUST DID EXACTLY THAT. John is not "taking the piss" talking about a officer with a clipboard. There actually was an officer with a clipboard shortly before the raid.

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This is especially funny coming from you, the man who probably wouldn't even go to the grocers without a 12" blade and high powered pistol on your hip.

(A) Veiled comments about paranoia do nothing to further your case and only make you look silly.

(B) A 12 inch knife really isn't good for all that much. They tend to be much longer or much shorter. I have a very nice folder with about unlimited uses, but the blade is less than 4 inches long, and it is less than 8 inches overall when open.

(C) "High powered pistol." Wow. Statements like that just reek of ignorance. Reminds me of people who called 5.56 rifles 'high powered rifles.'

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[billvon 3,132]

>Stop being suck a fucking hypocrite

Your one warning. No personal attacks.

[Scoop 0]

I guess we got a whole lot of fucked up issues in the UK eh? WHat a troubled country we live in. You would know. Being so close and all

[JohnRich 4]

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I guess we got a whole lot of fucked up issues in the UK eh? WHat a troubled country we live in. You would know. Being so close and all

We're only talking about one police screw-up here.
What other screwed-up issues do you have in the UK?

Do you think that people should not be allowed to comment upon anything outside their own country?

P.S.

I'm still waiting for any anti-gun person to explain why they voted that Mr. Shepherd deserved to be prosecuted...

[Scoop 0]

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I'm still waiting for any anti-gun person to explain why they voted that Mr. Shepherd deserved to be prosecuted...

I'm not anti gun so I can't help you.

[Kennedy 0]

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I guess we got a whole lot of fucked up issues in the UK eh? WHat a troubled country we live in. You would know. Being so close and all

There are a "whole lot of fucked up issues" in just about every country on the globe, but I'd hardly say the UK, or any of its member states, are particularly troubled when compared to others.

Actually, you should know that I have been lucky enough to have traveled quite a bit both inside the USA and around teh globe. Not as much as I'd like, mind you, but quite a bit compared to most others. And just to make it clear, I have been to the UK more than once, and I've enjoyed myself while there. (Edinborough being my favorite spot)

Like John said, this isn't about saying how horrid the UK is, or what a screwed up country it is. It's about police screwing up this time, largely affected by a systemic intolerance of firearms. How right or wrong that position is can be debated elsewhere (and I'm sure it will- again)

And my post was simply to point out how skewed your positions were, and how attacking John for mentioning clipboards was either ignorance of the facts or plain dishonesty. I figured that for you, this time, it was just that you didn't read through the article, so you didn't know that a nice officer with a clipboard had in fact just been there, and didn't feel the need to knock in the door, or be accompanied by a swat team.

I don't know about you, but I think it's scary that a nice guy with a clipboard can clear you, and then a swat team can demostrate a dynamic entry into your home, and that you end up spending time in a cell. Take note, I'm not what you might call anti-authoritarian, but this one made even me sit up and take notice. Anyone not suffering from cranio-rectal inversion can see that the MET are doing a bang up job, but the worst part of this one is not their actions, but that the home-owner still spent time in a cell.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[Kennedy 0]

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I'm still waiting for any anti-gun person to explain why they voted that Mr. Shepherd deserved to be prosecuted...

I'm not anti gun so I can't help you.

OK, you're not anti-gun. Did you vote that he deserved to be prosecuted? If so, why?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[Ian84 0]

From the story I gather it was a screw up on the part of the cops. I wonder why it took so long for the man to be cleared if indeed he had been inspected and cleared not long before. I would hope that it was due to a lack of communication somewhere, because at least that would mean that the error might be avoided in the future.

It would be more unfortunate in my opinion if evidence had been ignored because of someone's personal anti-gun agenda. If that were the case it would be reminiscent of the Duke rape case.

[akarunway 1]

" What other screwed-up issues do you have in the UK?___________________________________________________This one sounds pretty screwed up to me.> http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article2183105.ece

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[Stumpy 284]

And those in glass houses....

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[Lastchance 0]

An unloaded gun is nothing more than a club. If somebody is breaking into my house or has already gotten in, the last thing I want to spend time doing is unlocking my gun cabinet, go to another spot and unlock my ammo and then spend the time to load it. Please note that I have no children in my house.

I may be getting old but I got to see all the cool bands.

[kallend 2,182]

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I guess we got a whole lot of fucked up issues in the UK eh? WHat a troubled country we live in. You would know. Being so close and all

We're only talking about one police screw-up here.
What other screwed-up issues do you have in the UK?

Do you think that people should not be allowed to comment upon anything outside their own country?

P.S.

I'm still waiting for any anti-gun person to explain why they voted that Mr. Shepherd deserved to be prosecuted...

Hey, at least he wasn't sentenced to death based on a false confession obtained by police torture, like happened in Illinois. Or sentenced to death because the prosecution withheld evidence of innocence from the defense, like happened in Illinois. Or shot 41 times by police when he pulled out his ID, like happened in NYC. Or raped with a broomstick by the police, like happened in NYC. Or sentenced to 25 years in prison based on false testimony from the forensic laboratory, like happened in Houston and West Virginia...

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.