dorbie 0 #51 June 23, 2007 Quote In the matter of priorities, efforts to get innocent people off death row rank far higher than this case. They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. All injustice merits correction within our capacity to call for it. You're not merely spending your time elsewhere on weightier issues but practically advocating that an innocent man be kept in jail, AND spending valuable time doing it whilst pretending that it is your concern for other injustices and not your political bias that's the issue. Clearly this is not only inconsistent but one greater injustice does not justify a lesser one, although the individual consequences for Scooter Libby are something I seriously doubt you could bear with as much dignity as the victim in this case, despite your decision to belittle the destruction of this man. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #52 June 23, 2007 Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote You still choose to ignore the facts presented by Hitchens. It's a shame you want to see an innocent man destroyed rather than correct an injustice. It says a lot about you. Last time I checked, in the USA the JURY is the body that determines fact, not Hitchens. Complain to the JURY, not to us. Did you hear the comments from the left-wing journalist who was on the jury and returned to the leak issue which was not even what the trial was about. When a jury member says "Where was Bush and Cheney" you know something has gone horribly wrong with the trial of a guy being convicted over differing recollections of what he said in a chat with a journalist long after everyone knew the leak came from Armitage, and even after the leak has gone public. I reserve my sympathy for people truly railroaded by prosectors, with faked evidence and confessions obtained by torture. Then you have no genuine interest in justice. or the truth In our system of justice, "truth" is decided by a jury. Not by a columnist. You and Dorbie are the ones calling for the overturning of a jury's verdict, based just on your political preference. Libby had a good lawyer, he got a trial, he got a verdict, he gets to appeal. That is justice.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dorbie 0 #53 June 23, 2007 Quote You know what I really find sad. That those who think what has happened to Libby is good do not realize that most on the right would decrie and deffend Hillary should something like this happen to here. What is right and wrong is getting lost in the flow of what gains political power. Libby was prococuted for political gain, not justice, and that is what bothers me the mostI know these types exist on both sides. They have to be defeated I agree and this is one of the reasons this is a very serious issue that lends additional significance to a just outcome in Libby's case. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dorbie 0 #54 June 23, 2007 Quote Libby had a good lawyer, he got a trial, he got a verdict, he gets to appeal. That is justice. Just SOME of the flaws in the process as it pertains to Libby's case have been enumerated by Hitchens, others include the identity and comments of politically motivated jurors. Shouldn't you be busy freeing death row inmates? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #55 June 23, 2007 QuoteQuote In the matter of priorities, efforts to get innocent people off death row rank far higher than this case. They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. . The jury found him GUILTY. I trust their judgment more than yours, since they sat through the trial and listened to all the evidence. Maybe the conviction will be overturned. Not your decision. Not my decision. Maybe in your quest for justice you should donate some time or money to The Innocence Project.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dorbie 0 #56 June 23, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuote In the matter of priorities, efforts to get innocent people off death row rank far higher than this case. They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. . The jury found him GUILTY. I trust their judgment more than yours, since they sat through the trial and listened to all the evidence. Maybe the conviction will be overturned. Not your decision. Not my decision. Well I've heard a Jury member (a left wing journalist)ask "where was Bush & Cheney" w.r.t. the trial. Clearly there were issues with this jury. Again, shouldn't you be busy overturning Capital cases? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #57 June 23, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote In the matter of priorities, efforts to get innocent people off death row rank far higher than this case. They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. . The jury found him GUILTY. I trust their judgment more than yours, since they sat through the trial and listened to all the evidence. Maybe the conviction will be overturned. Not your decision. Not my decision. Well I've heard a Jury member (a left wing journalist)ask "where was Bush & Cheney" w.r.t. the trial. Clearly there were issues with this jury. Again, shouldn't you be busy overturning Capital cases? Libby has exactly the same opportunity to challenge his conviction as any other convicted criminal. And he has better lawyers than most. You want him to get preferential treatment. How can you call that "justice" and keep a straight face?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #58 June 23, 2007 Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote You still choose to ignore the facts presented by Hitchens. It's a shame you want to see an innocent man destroyed rather than correct an injustice. It says a lot about you. Last time I checked, in the USA the JURY is the body that determines fact, not Hitchens. Complain to the JURY, not to us. Did you hear the comments from the left-wing journalist who was on the jury and returned to the leak issue which was not even what the trial was about. When a jury member says "Where was Bush and Cheney" you know something has gone horribly wrong with the trial of a guy being convicted over differing recollections of what he said in a chat with a journalist long after everyone knew the leak came from Armitage, and even after the leak has gone public. I reserve my sympathy for people truly railroaded by prosectors, with faked evidence and confessions obtained by torture. Then you have no genuine interest in justice. or the truth In our system of justice, "truth" is decided by a jury. Not by a columnist. You and Dorbie are the ones calling for the overturning of a jury's verdict, based just on your political preference. Libby had a good lawyer, he got a trial, he got a verdict, he gets to appeal. That is justice. I know only the facts do not matter to you. It would seem political revenge is what counts. You screem murder of those held at Gitmo yet when a out of control prococuter investigates no crime until he finds a he said she said piece of shit you sit back with no comment other than it was a fair trial. I have terms (that you have used) that fits this crap. Care to name any of them? Uh, don't bother. You cant ever see the hypocrosy in it"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #59 June 23, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuote In the matter of priorities, efforts to get innocent people off death row rank far higher than this case. They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. . The jury found him GUILTY. I trust their judgment more than yours, since they sat through the trial and listened to all the evidence. Maybe the conviction will be overturned. Not your decision. Not my decision. Well I've heard a Jury member (a left wing journalist)ask "where was Bush & Cheney" w.r.t. the trial. Clearly there were issues with this jury. Again, shouldn't you be busy overturning Capital cases? Libby has exactly the same opportunity to challenge his conviction as any other convicted criminal. And he has better lawyers than most. You want him to get preferential treatment. How can you call that "justice" and keep a straight face? Justice is what we should be after. Clearly that is something you care nothing about"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dorbie 0 #60 June 23, 2007 I guess those death row inmates can wait after all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #61 June 23, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuote In the matter of priorities, efforts to get innocent people off death row rank far higher than this case. They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. . The jury found him GUILTY. I trust their judgment more than yours, since they sat through the trial and listened to all the evidence. Maybe the conviction will be overturned. Not your decision. Not my decision. Well I've heard a Jury member (a left wing journalist)ask "where was Bush & Cheney" w.r.t. the trial. Clearly there were issues with this jury. Again, shouldn't you be busy overturning Capital cases? Libby has exactly the same opportunity to challenge his conviction as any other convicted criminal. And he has better lawyers than most. You want him to get preferential treatment. How can you call that "justice" and keep a straight face? Justice is what we should be after. Clearly that is something you care nothing about ROFL. Since trial by jury is clearly something that you do not agree with, what is your suggestion for how the criminal justice system should operate? Imprisonment without trial, according to Bush's wishes?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dorbie 0 #62 June 23, 2007 Quote Since trial by jury is clearly something that you do not agree with, what is your suggestion for how the criminal justice system should operate? Imprisonment without trial, according to Bush's wishes? We know the jury was tainted in this case, we have one of the jurors (incidentally a left wing journalist) saying on video that he and others were asking "Where's Bush & Cheney?" during deliberations. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #63 June 23, 2007 QuoteQuote Since trial by jury is clearly something that you do not agree with, what is your suggestion for how the criminal justice system should operate? Imprisonment without trial, according to Bush's wishes? We know the jury was tainted in this case, we have one of the jurors (incidentally a left wing journalist) saying on video that he and others were asking "Where's Bush & Cheney?" during deliberations. We "know" nothing except what the media has told us. There is a process for appealing a conviction. Stop trying to short circuit it just because Libby is your darling.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #64 June 23, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuote In the matter of priorities, efforts to get innocent people off death row rank far higher than this case. They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. . The jury found him GUILTY. I trust their judgment more than yours, since they sat through the trial and listened to all the evidence. Maybe the conviction will be overturned. Not your decision. Not my decision. Well I've heard a Jury member (a left wing journalist)ask "where was Bush & Cheney" w.r.t. the trial. Clearly there were issues with this jury. Again, shouldn't you be busy overturning Capital cases? Libby has exactly the same opportunity to challenge his conviction as any other convicted criminal. And he has better lawyers than most. You want him to get preferential treatment. How can you call that "justice" and keep a straight face? Justice is what we should be after. Clearly that is something you care nothing about ROFL. Since trial by jury is clearly something that you do not agree with, what is your suggestion for how the criminal justice system should operate? Imprisonment without trial, according to Bush's wishes? Hey, I understand, your hatred for bush alows you to over looke the fact that Fitzgerald should be in the same cell as the Duke prosocuter. But you don't care that the jury was biased and Fitzgerald knew day one who spoke Plames name, day one that Plame was not covert but then went ahead with an investigation that ultimaltey when after a prosocution that was based on different memories between Libby and Rusert on a phone call. Ya, it is very revealing sir"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grue 1 #65 June 23, 2007 I'm against anyone called "Scooter", no matter what the case may be.cavete terrae. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
penniless 0 #66 June 23, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuote In the matter of priorities, efforts to get innocent people off death row rank far higher than this case. They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. . The jury found him GUILTY. I trust their judgment more than yours, since they sat through the trial and listened to all the evidence. Maybe the conviction will be overturned. Not your decision. Not my decision. Well I've heard a Jury member (a left wing journalist)ask "where was Bush & Cheney" w.r.t. the trial. Clearly there were issues with this jury. Again, shouldn't you be busy overturning Capital cases? Libby has exactly the same opportunity to challenge his conviction as any other convicted criminal. And he has better lawyers than most. You want him to get preferential treatment. How can you call that "justice" and keep a straight face? Justice is what we should be after. Clearly that is something you care nothing about ROFL. Since trial by jury is clearly something that you do not agree with, what is your suggestion for how the criminal justice system should operate? Imprisonment without trial, according to Bush's wishes? Hey, I understand, your hatred for bush alows you to over looke the fact that Fitzgerald should be in the same cell as the Duke prosocuter. But you don't care that the jury was biased and Fitzgerald knew day one who spoke Plames name, day one that Plame was not covert but then went ahead with an investigation that ultimaltey when after a prosocution that was based on different memories between Libby and Rusert on a phone call. Ya, it is very revealing sir What is revealing is that when you don't like the verdict of a jury in a trial, you want it overturned without going through the proper process. Special favors for your guy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
akarunway 1 #67 June 23, 2007 Quote Quote This whole situation makes a joke of American justice... . Since you mention lynchings, still there are those who think the American justice system is capable of making correct decisions 100% of the time in death penalty cases. Anybody wonder what REALLY happened to VINCE FOSTER?I hold it true, whate'er befall; I feel it, when I sorrow most; 'Tis better to have loved and lost Than never to have loved at all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #68 June 23, 2007 Quote Anybody wonder what REALLY happened to VINCE FOSTER?[Wink] Ron Brown, James McDougal, etc etc.... Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #69 June 23, 2007 Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote In the matter of priorities, efforts to get innocent people off death row rank far higher than this case. They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. . The jury found him GUILTY. I trust their judgment more than yours, since they sat through the trial and listened to all the evidence. Maybe the conviction will be overturned. Not your decision. Not my decision. Well I've heard a Jury member (a left wing journalist)ask "where was Bush & Cheney" w.r.t. the trial. Clearly there were issues with this jury. Again, shouldn't you be busy overturning Capital cases? Libby has exactly the same opportunity to challenge his conviction as any other convicted criminal. And he has better lawyers than most. You want him to get preferential treatment. How can you call that "justice" and keep a straight face? Justice is what we should be after. Clearly that is something you care nothing about ROFL. Since trial by jury is clearly something that you do not agree with, what is your suggestion for how the criminal justice system should operate? Imprisonment without trial, according to Bush's wishes? Hey, I understand, your hatred for bush alows you to over looke the fact that Fitzgerald should be in the same cell as the Duke prosocuter. But you don't care that the jury was biased and Fitzgerald knew day one who spoke Plames name, day one that Plame was not covert but then went ahead with an investigation that ultimaltey when after a prosocution that was based on different memories between Libby and Rusert on a phone call. Ya, it is very revealing sir What is revealing is that when you don't like the verdict of a jury in a trial, you want it overturned without going through the proper process. Special favors for your guy. No, what I do not like is that the trial began in the first place based on a political vendeta. Then add tot he fact that he was found guilty by a politically motivated jury. The care never should have went to court and I am sure will be overturned by a non-political judge. See, you don't have a clue about me"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #70 June 23, 2007 First day of the investigation Fitzgerald has stated that he found out who gave out Plames name (Armitage) but choose to keep going. Tell me, what was he supposed to be investigating?? Within the first week he learned that no law had been broken because Plames claim (and the left and its medias claim) was false. No law had been broken. If a law had been broken why is it not true that Armitage is being proscouted? Hhhmmmm? Libby was not interview until weeks (maybe months) after Fitzgerald learned all of this!! Add to these facts that the charge is made because of a discrepancy in the words of a phone conversation between Libby and Rusert/ If you think all that counts here is the jurys (and this jury is a whole different thread) then you don't give two squirts of piss about justice. "America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #71 June 23, 2007 Quote First day of the investigation Fitzgerald has stated that he found out who gave out Plames name (Armitage) but choose to keep going. Tell me, what was he supposed to be investigating?? Within the first week he learned that no law had been broken because Plames claim (and the left and its medias claim) was false. No law had been broken. If a law had been broken why is it not true that Armitage is being proscouted? Hhhmmmm? Libby was not interview until weeks (maybe months) after Fitzgerald learned all of this!! Add to these facts that the charge is made because of a discrepancy in the words of a phone conversation between Libby and Rusert/ If you think all that counts here is the jurys (and this jury is a whole different thread) then you don't give two squirts of piss about justice. The defense had every opportunity to challenge the membership of the jury, just like every other criminal defendent has. You want SPECIAL treatment for Libby. I want him treated like any other convicted criminal. I don't believe any of the following rights were denied Scooter: Amendment V No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation. Amendment VI In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense. Amendment VIII Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted. The administration of which he was a part had no hesitation in denying such rights to lots of people.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #72 June 23, 2007 Quote Quote First day of the investigation Fitzgerald has stated that he found out who gave out Plames name (Armitage) but choose to keep going. Tell me, what was he supposed to be investigating?? Within the first week he learned that no law had been broken because Plames claim (and the left and its medias claim) was false. No law had been broken. If a law had been broken why is it not true that Armitage is being proscouted? Hhhmmmm? Libby was not interview until weeks (maybe months) after Fitzgerald learned all of this!! Add to these facts that the charge is made because of a discrepancy in the words of a phone conversation between Libby and Rusert/ If you think all that counts here is the jurys (and this jury is a whole different thread) then you don't give two squirts of piss about justice. The defense had every opportunity to challenge the membership of the jury, just like every other criminal defendent has. You want SPECIAL treatment for Libby. I want him treated like any other convicted criminal. I don't believe any of the following rights were denied Scooter: Amendment V No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation. Amendment VI In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense. Amendment VIII Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted. The administration of which he was a part had no hesitation in denying such rights to lots of people. One more time. Supporting this is being a political pig. You don't give two squirts of piss about justice. Only political gotcha. Dam fucking sickening...."America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #73 June 23, 2007 Quote One more time. Supporting this is being a political pig. You don't give two squirts of piss about justice. Only political gotcha. Dam fucking sickening.... Justice is following due process of law. That was done, and he still has the right of appeal. Scooter has not been denied due process, nor any rights guaranteed by the Constitution.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #74 June 23, 2007 QuoteQuote One more time. Supporting this is being a political pig. You don't give two squirts of piss about justice. Only political gotcha. Dam fucking sickening.... Justice is following due process of law. That was done, and he still has the right of appeal. Scooter has not been denied due process, nor any rights guaranteed by the Constitution. You don't give two squirts of piss about justice. Admit it. Quote this shit all you want cause as long as it is not a D you like it. Dam sad. At least I understand you more now and I don't like what I have learned"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #75 June 23, 2007 Please tell all of us what element of due process of law was denied Scooter.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
