GravityGirl 0 #26 December 17, 2006 >>then you need to lift your skirt to see if you have the balls to say it or are just a pussy<< See. I have an issue with this statement. Why do you deem a pussy any less gutsy than balls? Pussy power! .... carry on..... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Peace and Blue Skies! Bonnie ==>Gravity Gear! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #27 December 17, 2006 QuoteMedia: What unit were you stationed with in Iraq? Rebecca: 101st Airborne Where are you stationed now? Ft. Hood, Texas Therefore, the report comes out, "Rebecca--26 years old. 101st Airborne, US Army. Just returned from Iraq. Stationed at Fort Hood, Texas" And, you'll notice "just returned" isn't defined. I know some folks who "just returned" last January. If you think this isn't tenuous, then fine. It certainly wouldn't be the first time that the press got something wrong. QuoteThere could be a myriad of reasons why she's no longer with the 101st and now with some unit at Ft. Hood. Injury, compassion leave, pregnancy, who knows... None of which are more likely than this "article" "report" or whatever it is, from being BS. QuoteRather than just keeping this circular, I think we can agree that 1) whether we agree, disagree or even understand - some members of the military signed a petition, 2) The media apparently didn't investigate well and we both notice they picked "the most persuasive and logical of responders" and seemed to have left out the numbnuts, and 3) If you're not willing to stand on a roof top and shout your full name and opinion; then you need to lift your skirt to see if you have the balls to say it or are just a pussy - in which case one should keep their fucking mouth shut. I understand what you're trying to say. I'm saying that with no source cited, the whole thing is a bunch of hooey. A petition holds no weight without proper identification of those that sign it. Of course, a petition in this case holds no weight in the "system" per se anyway, so it is a fruitless effort. A person is making a bold stand by "saying" something or abiding a course of action that is against their sworn oath to follow orders. I'm not just calling BS on the wrong location, etc., I'm calling BS on what she says as stop-loss figures, etc. It doesn't work that way. Fort Hood's facilities are no different from Fort Campbell's. If she was hurt seriously, she would be at Walter Reed, or Brook Army Medical.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,132 #28 December 17, 2006 >What I find curious is no mention of source. http://www.appealforredress.org/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cudlo 0 #29 December 17, 2006 QuoteI'm calling BS on what she says as stop-loss figures, etc. It doesn't work that way. Exactly, cause you'll never find anyone that was in a company that had 100% stop-loss and called up every inactive reservist they had... oh wait... you will... *raises hand*_________________________________________ "People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid." - Kierkegaard Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,506 #30 December 17, 2006 QuoteWhy do you deem a pussy any less gutsy than balls? Man Law. Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jenfly00 0 #31 December 17, 2006 Quote>>then you need to lift your skirt to see if you have the balls to say it or are just a pussy<< See. I have an issue with this statement. Why do you deem a pussy any less gutsy than balls? Pussy power! .... carry on..... Nature's own most nearly inexhaustable resource. ----------------------- "O brave new world that has such people in it". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #32 December 17, 2006 QuoteExactly, cause you'll never find anyone that was in a company that had 100% stop-loss and called up every inactive reservist they had... oh wait... you will... *raises hand* With all due respect, and with my clarification, I was speaking of active duty components. I really have no idea how the reserves and guard units operate.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChasingBlueSky 0 #33 December 18, 2006 QuoteOnce again someone like you finds the .00000000001% of the population and use it to make a point. Something you learned from the drive by media. good job God forbid the minority should be given a voice._________________________________________ you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me.... I WILL fly again..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #34 December 18, 2006 QuoteI joined up in 2001, still a junior in high school. I felt very patriotic at the end of my US History class. My idea of the Army was that you signed up, they gave you a rifle and you ran off into battle like in some 1950s war movie. The whole idea of boot camp never really entered my head. And they made this guy a Sgt????When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skysurfer_Rob 0 #35 December 18, 2006 This is how I thought the war started...but I thought I was the only one. Thanks for showing me I'm not alone. "Though I Fly Through the Valley of Death, I Shall Fear No Evil...For I am at 80,000 Feet and Climbing." SR-71 hangar entrance sign at Kadena AFB, Japan Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #36 December 18, 2006 QuoteQuoteOnce again someone like you finds the .00000000001% of the population and use it to make a point. Something you learned from the drive by media. good job God forbid the minority should be given a voice. Nice twist rrrreeeeaaaalllll nice"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #37 December 18, 2006 It's nice to see Billvon provide evidence that soldiers that are just a regular cross section of humanity and have varying opinions. It's a nice change to see that instead of the normal tripe portraying them as brainwashed, can't-get-into-college, bloodthirsty, killers like we see from the left on these boards. (or for that matter, the fresh faced, apple pie, all-of-them-are-heros from the other extreme). I wouldn't take anything more than that from the original post. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #38 December 18, 2006 if the comments are true, the following is a very scary statement: Quote think it is safe to say that the majority of soldiers are wondering what this grand scheme is that we keep hearing about from those above us but that is never translating down to the ground level. It must be very hard to fight a war, if you don't know what you are fighting for. In time, I think this will be recognized as one of the greatest failures in this operation. How can you achieve a goal, when nobody knows what the goal is. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #39 December 18, 2006 QuoteIt must be very hard to fight a war, if you don't know what you are fighting for Soldiers know what they are fighting for, and its f**k all to do with politics and everything to do with the man covering your back.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #40 December 18, 2006 QuoteQuoteIt must be very hard to fight a war, if you don't know what you are fighting for Soldiers know what they are fighting for, and its f**k all to do with politics and everything to do with the man covering your back. Yep Jamille, but they will just never understand us. Maybe they just don't want to. I think most soldiers just don't give a shit if they never do, me included. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #41 December 18, 2006 QuoteSoldiers know what they are fighting for, and its f**k all to do with politics and everything to do with the man covering your back. I know they are fighting to stay alive. On top of that, there are generally missions and goals to achieve. As a soldier I would imagine those would be nice to know. And the goal of a mission doesn't have to be political at all, probably generally isn't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #42 December 18, 2006 QuoteQuoteSoldiers know what they are fighting for, and its f**k all to do with politics and everything to do with the man covering your back. I know they are fighting to stay alive. On top of that, there are generally missions and goals to achieve. As a soldier I would imagine those would be nice to know. And the goal of a mission doesn't have to be political at all, probably generally isn't. microcosm / macrocosm = line soldier / generalMike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,132 #43 December 18, 2006 >microcosm / macrocosm = line soldier / general Fair enough. So would it be fair to say that when a soldier on the ground says "I know that we are succeeding in Iraq overall" (or failing in Iraq overall) he is speaking outside his expertise? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #44 December 18, 2006 I'd say he doesn't have the same overall picture as the perfumed princes, but certainly would be able to say whether or not what he's doing is making a difference. I'd also say he's got a DAMN SIGHT MORE credibility than some reporter that won't bestir his ass from the hotel and gets all his info from stringers.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #45 December 18, 2006 QuoteI'd say he doesn't have the same overall picture as the perfumed princes, but certainly would be able to say whether or not what he's doing is making a difference. But wouldn't know if his/her efforts got them any closer to accomplishing a goal, since they don't know what it is.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,132 #46 December 18, 2006 >but certainly would be able to say whether or not what he's doing is >making a difference. Going from what a few other people have said, if you mean "making a difference in covering other people's backs" or "making a difference in stopping people at a checkpoint" I'd agree. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #47 December 18, 2006 Quote>microcosm / macrocosm = line soldier / general Fair enough. So would it be fair to say that when a soldier on the ground says "I know that we are succeeding in Iraq overall" (or failing in Iraq overall) he is speaking outside his expertise? That's a fair question. It really depends on where that soldier/sailor/Marine was in Iraq or Afghanistan. When my platoon leader told me of what they got done while in Ramadi, I can tell you that the improvements were vast, sweeping, having both a tactical and strategic effect in the area. Ramadi is still a dangerous place, dangerous enough that the press doesn't typically hang around (if at all). Everyone that was there knows the score. The people that "sign" this petition, yet choose not to stand by it (even if legit, which I still question), are not shedding any real light: Quote...in late September a buddy in my platoon died from a bullet in the head, I really took a long hard look... Hey buddy, this is war, and people die, and get wounded. They're just complaining because they are actually being tasked with doing the job they've trained for. The only one who made a rational explanation for thier position was Mackoviak. The difference is, he's still doing his job, his honesty is yeilding no backlash on him, and he has a clear mind it seems.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #48 December 19, 2006 Quote>but certainly would be able to say whether or not what he's doing is >making a difference. Going from what a few other people have said, if you mean "making a difference in covering other people's backs" or "making a difference in stopping people at a checkpoint" I'd agree. Yes, of course, Bill... the troops NEVER have any interaction with Iraquis from day to day...only when they've got them on their faces at the checkpoints, frisking them. Why don't you ask Gawain, or matthewcline, or GQjumper about their interactions with the Iraquis from day to day? I'm pretty confident that they're briefed on their mission and what their unit is doing...and how overall operations are going in their area.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,132 #49 December 19, 2006 >Why don't you ask Gawain, or matthewcline, or GQjumper about their > interactions with the Iraquis from day to day? I'm pretty confident > that they're briefed on their mission and what their unit is > doing...and how overall operations are going in their area. And Gavin, and Peter, and Mark . . . yep, they each have insights into what's going on in the area they saw in Iraq/Afghanistan. Some think things are going great, some think we're making slow progress, some think that things could be a LOT better, some think things are a disaster and are getting worse (and were very glad to get out.) In other words, they show the same sort of cross-section we've seen here. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #50 December 19, 2006 Quote>Why don't you ask Gawain, or matthewcline, or GQjumper about their > interactions with the Iraquis from day to day? I'm pretty confident > that they're briefed on their mission and what their unit is > doing...and how overall operations are going in their area. And Gavin, and Peter, and Mark . . . yep, they each have insights into what's going on in the area they saw in Iraq/Afghanistan. Some think things are going great, some think we're making slow progress, some think that things could be a LOT better, some think things are a disaster and are getting worse (and were very glad to get out.) In other words, they show the same sort of cross-section we've seen here. A demonstrated narrow view to make a point.........................again. Yes, all of those view points are out there but you put it in the context that there is no majority view point again, to make YOUR point. nice............"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.thumb.jpg.4bb795e2eaf21b8b300039a5e1ec7f92.jpg)