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QuoteWhy don't we just execute both of them and give the food and shelter to someone else in the world that needs it?
exactly.
some people don't deserve to live...
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QuoteQuoteWhy don't we just execute both of them and give the food and shelter to someone else in the world that needs it?
exactly.
some people don't deserve to live...
I was under the impression that the victim lived - the report didn't say the kid was killed.
Are we now moving to a point in society where the death penalty is an apt sentence for non-fatal attacks?
![[:/]](/uploads/emoticons/dry.png "[:/]"){kind=small}
My wife is hotter than your wife.
Are we now moving to a point in society where the death penalty is an apt sentence for non-fatal attacks?
Quote
Not really trying to give a yes or no answer to your question lawrocket, but take this into consideration when you ask that question. This kid will be in prison for a minimum of 30 years before having the opportunity for parole. It will probably be longer, if this kid acts like this at such a young age imagine what learning life through the prison system will do to him. Now upon his release back into the real world, what will this kid be able to contribute to society, sure prisons have work programs that help you prepare to re-enter the world, but knowing one way, the prison way during some of the most crucial years of ones development, it will take an act from a higher power to have someone like this head out and adapt, most likely he won't be out long before he is back in. So weighing the costs and rewards of keeping this kid in prison as opposed to the death penalty, will this country really gain something out of spending probably upwards of hundreds of thousands after 30+ years. Most likely this kid will spend his entire life behind bars and all we have benefitted from it is ensuring that our tax dollars didn't have the chance to go to some other program that would in some way contribute to the well being of our country.History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
--Dwight D. Eisenhower
Shell666 0
QuoteQuoteQuoteWhy don't we just execute both of them and give the food and shelter to someone else in the world that needs it?
exactly.
some people don't deserve to live...
I was under the impression that the victim lived - the report didn't say the kid was killed.
Are we now moving to a point in society where the death penalty is an apt sentence for non-fatal attacks?
You could always move here where four 18-year olds and one 17 year old (who was one day shy of his 18th birthday) were charged in the November 2005 killing of a 17 year old youth at a house party.
One 18 year old received 4 years on a manslaughter plea. The other three 18 year olds received conditional sentences to be served in the community. The 17 year old (at the time of the offence) hasn't been sentenced yet but he's being charged as a young offender. In my world, that will constitute a slap on the wrist and his record will be sealed. As a young offender, his name can't be released.
Story here
Do those sentences sound about right for the crime??
'Shell
'Shell
QuoteI was under the impression that the victim lived - the report didn't say the kid was killed.
Are we now moving to a point in society where the death penalty is an apt sentence for non-fatal attacks?
The victim *did* live but has undergone several major surgeries and will be going through more.
How would you feel if the victim were 2 years old but still lived?
Walt
Until this year I believe, it was still a hangable offence to rustle cattle in certain states in the USA. There have also been many rape cases that ended in capital punishment.
kallend 2,150
QuoteI wonder who will chime in saying he should be held responsible because "his reasoning abilities are not yet fully developed" or some similar nonsense.
The consensus of our society, encoded into our LAWS, is that those under the age of 18 are not fully responsible for their actions. That is independent of whether or not those actions are heinous. That's the way it is.
I work every day with 18-22 year olds, and have done for the past 30+ years, and I'm inclined to think that age of 21 (as it was back when) makes more sense than the current age of 18. 18 year olds are NOT mature by any stretch of the imagination.
Calling a child "an adult" does not make him one, any more than calling a tail "a leg" gives a dog 5 legs.
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
Lindsey 0
Unfortunately, though, teenagers who lack a conscience and are capable of these heinous acts very rarely develop one during their lifetimes....much less by the time they're 21. This isn't an issue of maturation. A very immature person with a conscience is incapable of this type of violation of another human being. A person who IS capable of this kind of behavior, regardless of his/her age and maturity is highly unlikely to grow into someone whose contributions to society outweigh the damage he inflicts (it would take a helluva huge contribution). And the damage he inflicts is harmful enough, imho, to warrant locking him away for the rest of his life. It's brutal, but certainly no more brutal than he is/was....
linz
linz
--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail
Lucky... 0
QuoteWhy don't we just execute both of them and give the food and shelter to someone else in the world that needs it?
Becuase we can't help but to execute innocent people by, "mistake."
Lucky... 0
QuoteUntil this year I believe, it was still a hangable offence to rustle cattle in certain states in the USA. There have also been many rape cases that ended in capital punishment.
That's old staute. Currently only 1st degree murder and felony murder, same thing are eligible to my knowldege.
Lucky... 0
QuoteQuoteI wonder who will chime in saying he should be held responsible because "his reasoning abilities are not yet fully developed" or some similar nonsense.
The consensus of our society, encoded into our LAWS, is that those under the age of 18 are not fully responsible for their actions. That is independent of whether or not those actions are heinous. That's the way it is.
I work every day with 18-22 year olds, and have done for the past 30+ years, and I'm inclined to think that age of 21 (as it was back when) makes more sense than the current age of 18. 18 year olds are NOT mature by any stretch of the imagination.
Calling a child "an adult" does not make him one, any more than calling a tail "a leg" gives a dog 5 legs.
Until about a year ago we executed 16 & 17 YO's..... Us and like 6 other nations.....
kallend 2,150
Quote
Until about a year ago we executed 16 & 17 YO's..... Us and like 6 other nations.....
People's Republic of China, Democratic Republic of Congo, Iran, Pakistan, Yemen, Nigeria, Saudi Arabia, and the United States. As my mother said, you are known by the company you keep.
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
QuoteHow would you feel if the victim were 2 years old but still lived?
Feel? I "feel" like these adults should rot for a while. If it were MY two year old, I "feel" that I would want to kill them by a penectomy followed by asphyxiation through use of the severed member down their throats.
NEvertheless, I "think" that the most severe crime - murder - should be dealt the harshest penalty. PEople have tried to convince me that lesser offenses like assault, rape, using racial epithets and voting Republican are all crimes worthy of death. I think only one crime is worthy of it.
THat's all I'm saying.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
NEvertheless, I "think" that the most severe crime - murder - should be dealt the harshest penalty. PEople have tried to convince me that lesser offenses like assault, rape, using racial epithets and voting Republican are all crimes worthy of death. I think only one crime is worthy of it.
THat's all I'm saying.
THat's all I'm saying.
Quote
Hey lawrocket, I'm just curious as to what your opinion is on my first post in here about the cost of putting these guys up fr a lifetime versus what we will gain from it. I was just trying to put in a different perspective out of "they did wrong, hang em".
I am on the fence on this one, I don't think we should waste the money for a lifetime of care, but am not sure as to whether they should be executed.History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
--Dwight D. Eisenhower
The societal cost of killing people for lesser crimes is far more than the "societal cost" of keeping them imprisoned.
Hell, good arguments exist for the position that the societal cost of killing people at all for any crime is higher that the "societal cost" of prison.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
Hell, good arguments exist for the position that the societal cost of killing people at all for any crime is higher that the "societal cost" of prison.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
Lawrence Singleton.
He bludgeoned, raped (in every possible way), cut off the arms of a 15 yo girl, and left her for dead. (no arms, no finger prints) She lived. Not murder.
He got 14 years and served half.
His next contribution to society was coming to Florida to live with his sister. (California should have to keep who it releases.)
For a reason that I can't remember, a deputy walked up to the door of his residence and noticed that he had blood dripping down his shirt and a dead prostitute in the living room. (Of course, that is the only one that is known.)
He didn't get out of prison here.
He bludgeoned, raped (in every possible way), cut off the arms of a 15 yo girl, and left her for dead. (no arms, no finger prints) She lived. Not murder.
He got 14 years and served half.
His next contribution to society was coming to Florida to live with his sister. (California should have to keep who it releases.)
For a reason that I can't remember, a deputy walked up to the door of his residence and noticed that he had blood dripping down his shirt and a dead prostitute in the living room. (Of course, that is the only one that is known.)
He didn't get out of prison here.
QuoteLawrence Singleton.
Yes, his sentence was a debacle. It was a debacle that he got out after 7 years. HE should have done life in prison, but at the time the law only allowed 14 years as the maximum sentence.
There's a vast middle ground between death and serving 8 years of a 14 year sentence.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
QuoteI am on the fence on this one, I don't think we should waste the money for a lifetime of care, but am not sure as to whether they should be executed.
Well, let's make a list of some other groups that are an economic drain on society...
Retards
Homeless Bums
Old People
Anti-social children
Welfare mothers
Illegal immigrants
Sure could save some money if we just got rid of the problem groups...
"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian
Ken
Ken
QuoteQuoteI am on the fence on this one, I don't think we should waste the money for a lifetime of care, but am not sure as to whether they should be executed.
Well, let's make a list of some other groups that are an economic drain on society...
Retards
Homeless Bums
Old People
Anti-social children
Welfare mothers
Illegal immigrants
Sure could save some money if we just got rid of the problem groups...
You are equating the impact of the elderly on society with the impact of murderers ? Lacking all reason.
Big problems, little problems. Big problems get big solutions, little problems get other solutions.
There probably won't be executions for speeding if it is not excessive.
Shell666 0
QuoteWell, let's make a list of some other groups that are an economic drain on society...
Retards
Homeless Bums
Old People
Anti-social children
Welfare mothers
Illegal immigrants
Sure could save some money if we just got rid of the problem groups...
My advice to you ... don't get old.
'Shell
QuoteThere probably won't be executions for speeding if it is not excessive.
That's my thought - eventually, even speeding could be considered excessive.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
QuoteQuoteQuoteI am on the fence on this one, I don't think we should waste the money for a lifetime of care, but am not sure as to whether they should be executed.
Well, let's make a list of some other groups that are an economic drain on society...
Retards
Homeless Bums
Old People
Anti-social children
Welfare mothers
Illegal immigrants
Sure could save some money if we just got rid of the problem groups...
You are equating the impact of the elderly on society with the impact of murderers ? Lacking all reason.
Big problems, little problems. Big problems get big solutions, little problems get other solutions.
There probably won't be executions for speeding if it is not excessive.
lemme seee here....
We all know social security will not survive the baby boomer generation. Somehow I'm thinking the cost of covering the entitlements of Social Security and Medicare will affect everyone in the US.
Compared to the 5.6 murders per 100,000 in 2005, help me out here, which one is the bigger economic drain on society?
If we're toasting the criminals to save a few bucks.... There are a few other Modest Proposals we should also consider... That's all I have for a Tuesday.
Ask again tomorrow.
"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian
Ken
Ken
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