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DaVinci 0
QuoteI like those little lousiville slugger baseball bats - you can swing them with one hand.
You are a big guy....That would work for you. A small woman it may not work as well. The thing with weapons is they require some training to use. A small stick can be a great weapon in the hands of someone that knows how to use it. But in a high stress situation training is required to use any weapon and some weapons are easier to effectively use than others.
If I have a short time to train someone for defense I pick an easy to use weapon that will still be effective.
In my house (No children) I have a loaded S&W model 65 "Lady Smith" (Means small grips) http://shooterssupply.org/gundetail.aspx?gunid=122 Mine has the enclosed internal hammer (Bodyguard). Making it a good carry weapon since the hammer cannot catch on anything. It is double action only which means a higher trigger pull force, but not enough to matter.
Simple and easy to use. No safety, but the only way to fire it is with a good amount of trigger pull. Chambered with .38 hollow point it has stopping power, but little risk of over penetration.
That being said, the rule in my house is that the door gets locked to the bedroom, the gun and PHONE are grabbed and run into the bathroom. Lock the bathroom door, call 911 get into the tub and point the gun at the door.
Not a big fan of pistols as they are not accurate even under the best of circumstances unless you practice regularly (combat shooting not target). Unless you are a police officer, military (in some capacity that trains you for close quarter fighting), you may find that a pistol is surprisingly inaccurate when your heart is racing, hands shaking, and you are generally shitting your pants in fear. As a backup for a point blank scenario it would be fine but I would go for the shotgun first. In fairness I do not have that kind of training so I may be projecting my own limitations on you.
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One of the reasons I would agree with the laser for a person with little time to train on the weapon, it makes instinctive shooting much more attainable for the untrained, as long as you heed the warning I laid out earlier, if there's a little red dot coming around the corner it broadcasts your location
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You do however need to train
Agreed, and don't ever underestimate the usefulness of taking an unloaded wepaon and spending an hour flipping the safety with your eyes closed and cycling the weapon. If you have to look to find a switch or button, you've taken your eyes off the threat which means he now has freedom of movment.QuoteA final issue is penetration. At close range smaller shot can be devastating yet it has less likelyhood of going through a wall if you miss and killing your neighbors kid in his home. That would be the other concern with the 1911.
I have a Remington 870 Express and I am quite happy with it. Many will disagree but I have had no problems with it and it was reasonably cheap.
On the penetration issue, go to Home Depot and buy a solid core door(or whatever type of door you have in your house) and a couple sheets of sheet rock and shoot them at different ranges to see how it affects the shot group/penetration. My team was playing with some no.9 bird shot one time looking at shot patterns and were amazed at how quickly its ability to penetrate even a hollow core door dissipated at 10 meters. We check penetration on everything, we've seen how effective it would be to try and put rounds through walls, car doors(yes a few of them were rental cars) gas-tanks, and no they don't explode like in the movies. There's no better way to find out then to really do it.
As for theRemington 870, I'm about to buy me one too, love em, reliable and easy to operate, not to mention a sturdy barrell, so if you wanted to say put it up t a door to gain entry or put a round through the intruder on the other side you won't risk blowing out the barrelHistory does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
--Dwight D. Eisenhower
mnealtx 0
Quote>Children should be taught to shoot. That way they don't think of
>them as magical and want to play with them.
?? They should be taught they are dangerous and how to NOT misuse them. That's the important part.
Would you teach your 10 year old how to use a circular saw? An arc welder? A parachute? (After all, unless they learn to skydive, they might want to jump off the roof!)
I learned how to use a circular saw and welder when I was a youngun...what's wrong with that?
To get to your main point - I agree, familiarization is the key. It's much more effective to "gun-proof the child" than it is to "child-proof the gun".
Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
Skyrad 0
Agreed
When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca
Lucius Annaeus Seneca
QuoteI've got a winchester defender 20ga. I picked up the 12ga, but it just didn't feel right. It was heavier and more difficult to handle. The difference between a 12ga and a 20ga in a home defense situation is pretty minimal.
If recoil and weight are an issue, consider a nice semi-auto shotgun like the Benelli.
http://www.benelliusa.com/firearms/ultraLight.tpl
QuoteOn October 20th 2004 in Murfreesboro, Tennessee, did the unbelievable, shooting 10 clay targets out of the air in 2.2 seconds with a Benelli M2 Field with ComforTech™
"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian
Ken
Ken
377 22
A ferociously loyal and protective dog is the best bet in my book. Self aiming, on guard even if you are at work, usually non lethal but effective, and good deterrent value. Local perps often dont know if you have guns but they usually know if you have a Doberman or Pit Bull. I used to work defending criminals in Oakland CA, a town with lots of junkies and therefore also a major burglary problem. These guys were usually more afraid of dogs than any other home defense system. In fact, they targeted houses where they knew there were guns because they could sell them so easily. I am not anti gun, but you have to look at the risks. Homeowners have shot family members by mistake, cops have shot armed homeowners by mistake, kids find guns and get hurt, etc etc. The gun owners never thought it could happen but it did. I own guns but I don't keep them at home. My dog calls the shots on home defense. Woof Woof.
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
QuoteWrong. You can only use force to defend yourself until the threat is stopped. If you go beyond that, as you imply, you are still liable for commiting a criminal assault.
The charge for shooting someone: Aggrivated Assault.
The charge for beating someone with a baseball bat: Aggrivated Assault.
In either case, if the person dies: Murder.
Not saying that is what someone would be charged with in a self defense situation, but just saying that it doesn't matter with similar outcomes. I couldn't imagine the civil liability for beating someone to that degree with a baseball bat, even if they are in your home. There's a certain amount of civil understanding in shooting someone that's in your home...atleast in most places in America.
--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."
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If recoil and weight are an issue, consider a nice semi-auto shotgun like the Benelli.
http://www.benelliusa.com/firearms/ultraLight.tpl
It wasn't so much of a recoil/weight issue, it was that the 20ga fit my body better. It felt so much more comfortable. The weight was part of it, but it just felt different. I'm really happy with it, and I've put a few hundred rounds through it so far.
These threads are always so comical!
All the macho Billy Bobs comparing bullet speed and weight vs. choke patterns~
~and drywall resiliency.
Some from half-baked heroes that shit their pants at the thought of jumping at night or without an AAD.
Gunfighting is a skill that is learned and constantly practiced. Most combat (civilian) encounters take place at seven yards or less. That's 21 feet. Now try this little exercise, on a dark night hang a silhouette target and back up 21 feet, park your car there and lay your super bad-guy killer handgun on the hood.
Run around the car two or three times to get your heart going as it would be in an encounter, then grab your gun, make it ready to fire and start walking toward the target while shooting. When the smoke clears, turn on the headlights and wonder where all the rounds ended up downrange!
Try it again with a shotgun, and there is nothing wrong with a .20 gauge and bird-shot for home defence, at seven yards it has more kinetic energy than any sidearm. If you can hit with it, use it.
In ANY case the use of deadly force is a last resort measure because if it's gotten to that point to begin with, you haven't been paying attention to possible threats in your environment at all, you must be living in condition red and out of ignorance, acting like it's green.
Locks, alarms, lights and a dog should be items of your first line of defence. If you aren't concerned enough to at least take those measures, you sure as heck aren't concerned enough to get the type and amount of training you actually need to be combat proficient with a sidearm.
If the "last resort" is your "first line" of defense, you probably deserve what happens.
Cracks me up!
~ "Pack Fast, Pull Low... and Date Your Riggers WIFE!" ~
All the macho Billy Bobs comparing bullet speed and weight vs. choke patterns~
~and drywall resiliency.
Some from half-baked heroes that shit their pants at the thought of jumping at night or without an AAD.
Gunfighting is a skill that is learned and constantly practiced. Most combat (civilian) encounters take place at seven yards or less. That's 21 feet. Now try this little exercise, on a dark night hang a silhouette target and back up 21 feet, park your car there and lay your super bad-guy killer handgun on the hood.
Run around the car two or three times to get your heart going as it would be in an encounter, then grab your gun, make it ready to fire and start walking toward the target while shooting. When the smoke clears, turn on the headlights and wonder where all the rounds ended up downrange!
Try it again with a shotgun, and there is nothing wrong with a .20 gauge and bird-shot for home defence, at seven yards it has more kinetic energy than any sidearm. If you can hit with it, use it.
In ANY case the use of deadly force is a last resort measure because if it's gotten to that point to begin with, you haven't been paying attention to possible threats in your environment at all, you must be living in condition red and out of ignorance, acting like it's green.
Locks, alarms, lights and a dog should be items of your first line of defence. If you aren't concerned enough to at least take those measures, you sure as heck aren't concerned enough to get the type and amount of training you actually need to be combat proficient with a sidearm.
If the "last resort" is your "first line" of defense, you probably deserve what happens.
Cracks me up!
~ "Pack Fast, Pull Low... and Date Your Riggers WIFE!" ~
QuoteGunfighting is a skill that is learned and constantly practiced. Most combat (civilian) encounters take place at seven yards or less. That's 21 feet. Now try this little exercise, on a dark night hang a silhouette target and back up 21 feet, park your car there and lay your super bad-guy killer handgun on the hood.
Run around the car two or three times to get your heart going as it would be in an encounter, then grab your gun, make it ready to fire and start walking toward the target while shooting.
Huh, I've done quite a few drills like that with long guns and handguns. Good and fun training.
--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."
All the macho Billy Bobs comparing bullet speed and weight vs. choke patterns~~and drywall resiliency.
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You knock everyone in this forum that's made a suggestion as to what would help the original poster, and then talk as if you are better trained and tougher than every one of them. You know more than anyone ese in these forums why?
And as for your bird shot from a 20 ga. suggestion, I've tested shot patterns and penetration of bird shot at ranges closer than 7 yards with a 12 ga. and found it to be basically useless against anything but, well.......birds. Especially if your intruder is on something that would get them amped up and keep them from feeling the pain of a bird shot.History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
--Dwight D. Eisenhower
QuoteYou know more than anyone ese in these forums why?
***
Crime Scene Technician for the City of Detroit, Michigan for 11 years before becoming an instructor.
Testified in over 200 criminal court hearings regarding firearms usage.
You sound like you have training and or are involved in Law Enforcement, comments were not directed to you. Laws in different states vary about self defence shootings in the home. May or may not be charged with a crime. May or may not be found guilty.
On the other hand, civil cases and the investigation and suits that follow against the homeowner will possibly bring out in court, all of the "This is what I plan to kill with and why" boasting, especially on a public Internet forum. Not Smart!
~ "Pack Fast, Pull Low... and Date Your Riggers WIFE!" ~
I would recomend a 12gage , unles you shoot a lot and know that you can perform under stress in the dark and various shooting positions, Pluss just waking up add another element where a pistole might not be the best choice.
Also get a light on that thing make it bright. Blinding some one and getting a good look may mean the difference between an intruder or a some one you know getting a blast from a shotgun. also alows you more time to react to the situation while the intruder in tempoarly blinded.
I also recomend a shot gun as a 9mm will pass through drywall like it's nothing and being in a duplex you dont want to have to worry where the shot is going and weather it will hurt some one eilse.
Put an alarm system in the house and put a solid core door on a bedroom or bathroom door with a dead bolt. If you have other family members thats where they should go and stay! while you investagate. This dose a few things one they can call 911 if it is indeed an intruder and two you know exactly where they are as you clear the aera.
Also get a light on that thing make it bright. Blinding some one and getting a good look may mean the difference between an intruder or a some one you know getting a blast from a shotgun. also alows you more time to react to the situation while the intruder in tempoarly blinded.
I also recomend a shot gun as a 9mm will pass through drywall like it's nothing and being in a duplex you dont want to have to worry where the shot is going and weather it will hurt some one eilse.
Put an alarm system in the house and put a solid core door on a bedroom or bathroom door with a dead bolt. If you have other family members thats where they should go and stay! while you investagate. This dose a few things one they can call 911 if it is indeed an intruder and two you know exactly where they are as you clear the aera.
SO this one time at band camp.....
"Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the most."
"Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the most."
rehmwa 2
QuoteI also recomend a shot gun as a 9mm will pass through drywall like it's nothing.
We used to own a 9mm 'shotgun'. We had to send to Italy for the ammo. It was pretty cool.
...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.
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