lawrocket 3 #1 October 25, 2006 Sometimes you see things that have political slants that can be read into it. It's ironic that usually the best social and political commentary comes not from documentaries or lice action film, but from animated programs and features. The Simpsons, for example, offers some profound social commentary (well, it used to - it lost its edge several years ago). "Finding Nemo" is my example of Libertarian versus Liberal thought. Nemo was born with a gimpy fin and was being raised by his father after his mother and 100 siblings were eaten by what appeared to be a barracuda. Yep, a bad situation. Marlin (Nemo's Dad) coddled and overly protected Nemo through his whole life. "You think you can do these things but you just can't, Nemo." Marlin is the screen equivalent of the liberal bleeding heart poverty pimp. As a modern political figure, he would be the one to say, "You think that you can get ahead in this society but you just can't." These are the folks that say, "So I'll help you and support you by making sure that the 'haves' in society help you by paying for it. If they disagree, they are cold and heartless. No, don't go to the drop-off - something bad might happen. Go play in the sponge beds." Of course, Nemo tried to do things to prove to himself and his father that he could, and got himself into big trouble. Point made - shit happens, and there are consequences for your choices. He ended up in a fish tank. The fish tank is a secure environment, free from attack and where everything is provided for the residents. It's a pretty tank, too, but it's still a tank! Now, Gil, the leader of the fish in the tank, thought Nemo was perfectly useful in escape plans. Why would he want to escape the cushy environs of the tank? Because "fish aren't meant to be in a box, kid. It does things to ya." When Nemo got caught in a vaccum, Nemo cried for help, sayign he couldn't get out because he has a bad fin. Gil told the other fish to leave him alone and encouraged him to get out of the vacuum on his own, which Nemo DID with what amounted to marginal effort. Gil is the cold and heartless libertarian. He tried and failed to escape many times but never gave up. He wouldn't let others give up, either. To some vocal portions of the Left, it would seem that Gil was cold, heartless and lacked compassion - making Nemo do it himself? But Nemo had a disability! But Nemo did it. Crush the Turtle was also a tough love guy. His kid wiped out and fell out of the East Australian Current. When Marlin the Liberal immediately started to try to aid young Squirt, Crush said, "Whoa. Kill the motor, dude. Let us see what Squirt does flying solo." And Squirt did just fine. Now, the Liberal would suggest that Gil was heartless and lacked compassion. Crush lacked compassion, too. Or did they? After all, Gil DID jump in to assist when Nemo was obviously over his head and needed help. Gil DID tell Nemo that "All drains lead to the oean." In the end, Marlin didn't help Nemo grow. In fact, Nemo had to again convince Marlin "I can do this." We can bring up others. Dory? "Just keep swimming. Just keep swimming. What do we do? We swim, swim." She trusted in others and got ahead using her ingenuity. Marlin thought he knew better and about got her killed. The seagulls? "Mine." "Mine." How would they be characterized? Wanting what something else worked for. Probably the best example of the self-righteous "desire to help" that was in fact destructive was the Dentist. Much like the thought of many of the Left and Right who think that something needs saving, he said of Nemo: "Beauty, isn't he? I found that guy struggling for life out on the reef and I saved him." He could feel good about himself for saving what he thought was poor, helpless Nemo. Obviously, Nemo had a gimpy fin and needed to be saved. Instead, his plan would have been a death sentence. Give the sick fish to Darla (government health care). I thought that finding Nemo was a fantastic example of libertarian thought. Self-reliance was romanticized in the film. The others thought Gil was mean when he was, in fact, kind. Marlin thought that Squirt needed help, when Squirt didn't. Marlin thought that Nemo couldn't do things, when he could. The dentist thought Nemo needed saving, when he didn't. Gil wouldn't let Nemo think that he couldn't. Crush (another apparently single father) let Squirt learn and trusted him. And despite her problems, Dory just kept swimming. Who was more caring? Marlin or Crush? The Dentist or Gil? They all seemed to care the same. Marlin clearly loved and cared about his son, but held Nemo back to protect him. The Dentist genuinely thought he was doing Nemo a favor in saving him - he kept the fish tank clean and kept the fish fed. He provided for the fish - everything he thought they needed. Would you rather take your chances and provide for yourself on the reef knowing that "birds gotta eat?" Or would you rather have the security of everything you need provided for you, but restricted in a tank? The tank is a cushy place, a secure homeland free from the terror of sharks and barracuda (think Patriot Act). It's also a place where food and cleanliness are provided (think socialism). And a place where Marlin wants to try to ensure that nothing bad ever happens. I'd rather be on the reef. I'd rather be Crush. My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rebecca 0 #2 October 25, 2006 Dude. Nicely done. Question: What about the sharks? "Fish are our friends, not food!" until there's blood in the water... you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel loquacious?' -- well do you, punk? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #3 October 25, 2006 Interesting post. I will have to see the film now. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #4 October 25, 2006 QuoteWhat about the sharks? "Fish are our friends, not food!" until there's blood in the water I wasn't sure how to group them. While the thought that they are like the dogma of sociologists of "nature versus nurture" was initially compelling, it didn't quite work. A shark is gonna be a shark. At the smell of blood, nature takes over. I think it also fits in with self-imposed guilt. Others are scared of sharks so they feel unloved. To counteract, they try to act like other fish. They feel bad because they are sharks, when they shouldn't. After all, they ARE sharks! They are so many things, I just can't peg them. My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #5 October 25, 2006 QuoteDude. Nicely done. Question: What about the sharks? "Fish are our friends, not food!" until there's blood in the water... Sharks(R) Trying to appear as something their not but their true personality comes to the surface when there's a feeding frenzy to be had. Anybody's fair game. But one point on Marlin. While he certainly had some well founded phobias, he never once asked anybody for anything. He was more of a leave me alone/self sufficient go getter. Lived within his means and wasn't afraid to go after what he valued, his family, without exploiting anyone. Damn near Jeffersonian if you ask me (except for that slave thing). Also, I'd say that the seagulls represented the lobbyists. Dangle a little legislation in front of them and they're on it with earmarks like a flock of gulls on a sack of salteens. They really have nothing to offer yet consume massive resources. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallRate 0 #6 October 26, 2006 It may not be the case, but I'm guessing that this all occurred to you during an umpteenth viewing of Finding Nemo with your son or daughter. FallRate Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #7 October 26, 2006 I'd say on roughly time 130. By about viewing 200 it solidified. It's amazing that after seeing it over and over again, I had to find something else about it to hold some interest. If I hear Faline say "Bambi" one more time... My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallRate 0 #8 October 26, 2006 QuoteIf I hear Faline say "Bambi" one more time... Ehh, just take it as a sign that you are a good Daddy. FallRate Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #9 October 26, 2006 QuoteI'd say on roughly time 130. By about viewing 200 it solidified. It's amazing that after seeing it over and over again, I had to find something else about it to hold some interest. If I hear Faline say "Bambi" one more time... My saving grace has been the eight or so IMAX films that I got on Amazon.com. My 2yr old loves them, as does daddy. I'm thinking that Pixar has something though. Nemo can be watched numerous times but my son would rather read Curious George than to watch the movie. Haven't tried Bambi yet. We'll probably have to discuss the second amendment before we watch that one. "See son.....this is why the Framers wanted us to have guns.......Protein!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Royd 0 #10 October 26, 2006 I just thought it was another brightly colored film that is used to hypnotise small children. I didn't watch it closely, but I thought that I saw the typical," man is evil, animals are good." message that radical animal rights people are always trying to shove down our throats. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kbordson 8 #11 October 26, 2006 Well done.... nicely presented. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites lurch 0 #12 October 27, 2006 You just put waaay too much thought into that, man.Live and learn... or die, and teach by example. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,182 #13 October 27, 2006 QuoteQuoteWhat about the sharks? "Fish are our friends, not food!" until there's blood in the water I wasn't sure how to group them. While the thought that they are like the dogma of sociologists of "nature versus nurture" was initially compelling, it didn't quite work. A shark is gonna be a shark. At the smell of blood, nature takes over. I think it also fits in with self-imposed guilt. Others are scared of sharks so they feel unloved. To counteract, they try to act like other fish. They feel bad because they are sharks, when they shouldn't. After all, they ARE sharks! They are so many things, I just can't peg them. Surely the sharks are the Lays/Skillings/Ebbers.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rehmwa 2 #14 October 27, 2006 QuoteSharks(R) Trying to appear as something their not but their true personality comes to the surface when there's a feeding frenzy to be had. Anybody's fair game. This would be a good analogy for corporate and hollywood do-gooders (cosmetic only) if they were pretending to reform their nature. But the movie shows they are definitely sincere in their attempts...... Sharks represent liberal guilt. Their basic nature is nothing wrong, but still feel compelled to go against their nature and become weak and judgmental as a result. When it finally 'pops' loose as it must, the response is an overcorrection of violence way out of proportion caused by denying their real nature. They are a mockery of liberal guilt and it's resulting impotence and the sharks end up looking like idiots. However, at the end, they are integrated in society (with extreme caution) - so moderation of strong instinctive behavior via conscience is much better than excessive and undeserved guilt. I think, in the end, the sharks would be considered the most pathethic characters of the movie. And the reasons are clear. Edit: this is one of the few animated movies that I like to watch with my daughter. I think it has a good message. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites idrankwhat 0 #15 October 27, 2006 Quote When it finally 'pops' loose as it must, the response is an overcorrection of violence way out of proportion caused by denying their real nature. Well this certainly explains the feeding frenzy that the R's are enjoying at the expense of the Treasury. Denied for so long, when they smell the blood they just can't control themselves. Oh yea, Jesus was a liberal. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rehmwa 2 #16 October 27, 2006 Let's get back on topic. You're starting to post like L.... and A..... This is serious, it's Pixar animation ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
lurch 0 #12 October 27, 2006 You just put waaay too much thought into that, man.Live and learn... or die, and teach by example. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #13 October 27, 2006 QuoteQuoteWhat about the sharks? "Fish are our friends, not food!" until there's blood in the water I wasn't sure how to group them. While the thought that they are like the dogma of sociologists of "nature versus nurture" was initially compelling, it didn't quite work. A shark is gonna be a shark. At the smell of blood, nature takes over. I think it also fits in with self-imposed guilt. Others are scared of sharks so they feel unloved. To counteract, they try to act like other fish. They feel bad because they are sharks, when they shouldn't. After all, they ARE sharks! They are so many things, I just can't peg them. Surely the sharks are the Lays/Skillings/Ebbers.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #14 October 27, 2006 QuoteSharks(R) Trying to appear as something their not but their true personality comes to the surface when there's a feeding frenzy to be had. Anybody's fair game. This would be a good analogy for corporate and hollywood do-gooders (cosmetic only) if they were pretending to reform their nature. But the movie shows they are definitely sincere in their attempts...... Sharks represent liberal guilt. Their basic nature is nothing wrong, but still feel compelled to go against their nature and become weak and judgmental as a result. When it finally 'pops' loose as it must, the response is an overcorrection of violence way out of proportion caused by denying their real nature. They are a mockery of liberal guilt and it's resulting impotence and the sharks end up looking like idiots. However, at the end, they are integrated in society (with extreme caution) - so moderation of strong instinctive behavior via conscience is much better than excessive and undeserved guilt. I think, in the end, the sharks would be considered the most pathethic characters of the movie. And the reasons are clear. Edit: this is one of the few animated movies that I like to watch with my daughter. I think it has a good message. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #15 October 27, 2006 Quote When it finally 'pops' loose as it must, the response is an overcorrection of violence way out of proportion caused by denying their real nature. Well this certainly explains the feeding frenzy that the R's are enjoying at the expense of the Treasury. Denied for so long, when they smell the blood they just can't control themselves. Oh yea, Jesus was a liberal. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #16 October 27, 2006 Let's get back on topic. You're starting to post like L.... and A..... This is serious, it's Pixar animation ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites