If you had the call would you bomb them

[bodypilot90 0]

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By LOLITA C. BALDOR, Associated Press Writer
Wed Sep 13, 9:36 PM ET



WASHINGTON - The U.S. military acknowledged Wednesday that it considered bombing a group of more than 100 Taliban insurgents in southern Afghanistan but decided not to after determining they were on the grounds of a cemetery.



The decision came to light after an NBC News correspondent's blog carried a photograph of the insurgents. Defense department officials first tried to block further publication of the photo, then struggled to explain what it depicted.

NBC News claimed U.S. Army officers wanted to attack the ceremony with missiles carried by an unmanned Predator drone but were prevented under rules of battlefield engagement that bar attacks on cemeteries.

In a statement released Wednesday, the U.S. military in Afghanistan said the picture — a grainy black-and-white photo taken in July — was given to a journalist to show that Taliban insurgents were congregating in large groups. The statement said U.S. forces considered attacking.

"During the observation of the group over a significant period of time, it was determined that the group was located on the grounds of (the) cemetery and were likely conducting a funeral for Taliban insurgents killed in a coalition operation nearby earlier in the day," the statement said. "A decision was made not to strike this group of insurgents at that specific location and time."

While not giving a reason for the decision, the military concluded the statement saying that while Taliban forces have killed innocent civilians during a funeral, coalition forces "hold themselves to a higher moral and ethical standard than their enemies."

The photo shows what NBC News says are 190 Taliban militants standing in several rows near a vehicle in an open area of land. Gunsight-like brackets were positioned over the group in the photo.

The photo appeared on NBC News correspondent Kerry Sanders' blog. Initially military officials called it an unauthorized release, but they later said it was given to the journalist.

NBC News had quoted one Army officer who was involved with the spy mission as saying "we were so excited" that the group had been spotted and was in the sights of a U.S. drone. But the network quoted the officer, who was not identified, as saying that frustration soon set in after the officers realized they couldn't bomb the funeral under the military's rules of engagement.

Defense Department officials have said repeatedly that while they try to be mindful of religious and cultural sensitivities, they make no promises that such sites can always be avoided in battle because militants often seek cover in those and other civilian sites.

[billvon 3,132]

If they were reasonably sure it was an all-Taliban gathering - then yes. While protecting innocent lives should be a high priority for us, protecting the resting site of dead people shouldn't be.

[Tink1717 2]

They held fire because of the possibility of offending religious sensibilities. This is absurd given that the war is religious in nature.

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[bodypilot90 0]

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protecting the resting site of dead people shouldn't be.

Well it is kind of convenient to get bombed in a grave yard. Saves on transport

[TheAnvil 0]

Take the war to the enemy wherever possible or cease hostilities.

Bomb the bastards.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[Andy9o8 3]

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They held fire because of the possibility of offending religious sensibilities. This is absurd given that the war is religious in nature.

I agree it may be absurd from a strictly tactical standpoint, but what about from a strategic standpoint? By that, I mean, having indigenous Afghans on our side is pretty important - the Soviets learned that lesson the hard way. Bombing the cemetery might have been a short-term tactical victory but a long-term loss of the hearts and minds of the people. The Afghans are very devout, traditional Muslims, and many of them not very sophisticated. Muslim anger at affronts to Islam, real or perceived, is something we're all aware of. Sometimes when you kill 100 enemy today, the means by which you do so can create 10,000 angry enemy tomorrow.

Just to be clear, my point is not one of ethics, but strictly one of utility: strategic considerations.

[billvon 3,132]

>Bombing the cemetery might have been a short-term tactical victory
>but a long-term loss of the hearts and minds of the people.

That's definitely a consideration, but if the choice is to bomb them when they're in a cemetary or bomb them when they're in a market or a mosque, I think you do less damage to our image/goals overall if you get them while they're in the cemetary. (Ideally, of course, you get them while they're in the middle of the desert, but that's not always possible.)

[livetofall 0]

Why not? The clinton regime lost there chances for the close to the same reason..now look how we paid.
Who cares if it was a graveyard..you think they buried the innocent dead they killed?

www.911missinglinks.com the definitive truth of 9/11..the who and why, not how

You can handle the TRUTH www.theforbiddentruth.net

[RMURRAY 1]

I think it was the right decision...if there is going to be and end to this thing you need the people who happen to live there on-side.

rm

[Skyrad 0]

I agree, thes alot of talk about how the US holds the moral high ground and many examples of how that is simply not true. This is an example of both a sound strategic decision as well as a honourable one. I'm sure people would be calling foul if the Taliban or Al Q set of bombs at the funeral of US service personel.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[miked10270 0]

I think it was the right call.

The absolute key to winning a war of occupation is the co-operation of the people. This is something which is extremely hard to win, bit piss-easy to lose.

Also, there's an intelligence value in tracking their movements after the burial for future target selection!

Or did Y'All think the Brits didn't shoot up IRA funerals out of the goodness of their hearts?

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[Lindsey 0]

but were prevented under rules of battlefield engagement that bar attacks on cemeteries.


I think it's important to fight by the rules....even if it means losing a good opportunity.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[billvon 3,132]

> The clinton regime . . .

Nine posts this time! The Clinton legacy will outlast anything Bush does at this rate.

[kallend 2,182]

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> The clinton regime . . .

Nine posts this time! The Clinton legacy will outlast anything Bush does at this rate.

Well, lying about a BJ is clearly more heinous than a lie that sends 2,680 young men to their deaths in a foreign land.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Skyrad 0]

Actally its 2913 men and women, its not just Americans dieing out there, the others wouldn't be there if it wasn't for him.

http://icasualties.org/oif/

Not to mention the approximatly 350 contractors. (and thats before ANY Iraqis are counted)

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[pirana 0]

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protecting the resting site of dead people shouldn't be.

Well it is kind of convenient to get bombed in a grave yard. Saves on transport

And labor costs too what with there already being a big hole in the ground.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[CanuckInUSA 0]

I saw the pictures on the news the other day before this thread was even started and there were hundreds of these enemy supporters standing there in a close group. They should have bombed them.

The western powers (most of the time) play by the rules while the Islamic extremist side purposely breaks the rules of war all the time. Plus the Islamic side breaks the rules on purpose just to infuriate the other side even more. Sometimes I think this is all a game to the Islamic extremists who are in charge over there. They have an endless supply of people willing to die for their cause and they know the western world doesn't have the stomache to fight them in a war of attrition. So what's the solution? The west should get out of Islamic countries and (this isn't going to be very popular) maybe the West should deport anyone who sides with Islamic extremists while living in the western world.

WTF was the military thinking? They should have bombed them. This is war ... rules are broken all the time in war. Have we forgotten how nasty WWII was already? Lots of people broke the rules on all sides and they needed to do this if they wanted to win.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[Amazon 7]

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If they were reasonably sure it was an all-Taliban gathering - then yes. While protecting innocent lives should be a high priority for us, protecting the resting site of dead people shouldn't be.

With eveyone condeming the Israeli's for war crimes I have yet to figure out why the hell they DONT bomb the shit out of the funerals of suicide bombers where thousands of green headband wearing would be suicide bombers show up brandishing bombs and Kalshnakovs..... and rows of would be masked/ already trained Shahids{sp} in white with bombs on them..

[Skyrad 0]

How do you know they were enemy and Taliban? considering that pretty much everyone over there carrys a weapon.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Skyrad 0]

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I saw the pictures on the news the other day before this thread was even started and there were hundreds of these enemy supporters standing there in a close group. They should have bombed them.

The western powers (most of the time) play by the rules while the Islamic extremist side purposely breaks the rules of war all the time. Plus the Islamic side breaks the rules on purpose just to infuriate the other side even more. Sometimes I think this is all a game to the Islamic extremists who are in charge over there. They have an endless supply of people willing to die for their cause and they know the western world doesn't have the stomache to fight them in a war of attrition. So what's the solution? The west should get out of Islamic countries and (this isn't going to be very popular) maybe the West should deport anyone who sides with Islamic extremists while living in the western world.

WTF was the military thinking? They should have bombed them. This is war ... rules are broken all the time in war. Have we forgotten how nasty WWII was already? Lots of people broke the rules on all sides and they needed to do this if they wanted to win.

So seeing as how UBL had already declared war on the US and its ok to break the rules, I guess you'd feel that 9/11 was a justifiable attack on his enemies economic and intelligence apparatus.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[shropshire 0]

Counter point : We (in the west) have kids in uniform too....

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[mirage62 0]

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The clinton regime . . .

Nine posts this time! The Clinton legacy will outlast anything Bush does at this rate.

Sad, really. When a man of Bill's knowledge, capacity and intellect is reduced to counting post.

A shadow of his former witty and in depth responses.

Kallend I can understand....I mean just look at him

Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little

[CanuckInUSA 0]

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So seeing as how UBL had already declared war on the US and its ok to break the rules, I guess you'd feel that 9/11 was a justifiable attack on his enemies economic and intelligence apparatus.

Where the #### did I say 9/11 was justifiable? Do you feel better when you put words into other people's mouth's? WTF?

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[rickjump1 0]

Get down and get dirty. There ain't no such thing as limited warfare. The only way to beat these people is at their own game. This never stopped us before so why now? Television? Do you think they care if it's Sunday when they display the heads of their victims? We need to exploit every opportunity we get to kill them. Let them know there is no place to hide. Letting these guys go will cost innocent lives in the end.

Do your part for global warming: ban beans and hold all popcorn farts.

[CanuckInUSA 0]

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How do you know they were enemy and Taliban?

These pictures were taken with a Predator drone aircraft. Predator drones appear to be the best intelligence gather tool the West has in Afghanistan and they do a damn good job at what they are tasked to do compared to the lack of intelligence that can be gathered or counted on from the Afgan locals. Anyway, this funeral took place in a Taliban regional strong hold. If it looks like a dog, barks and wags it's tail like a dog. Then I guess it's a dog.

Personally I'm beginning to think that the West needs to get the #### out of the Muslim world and guess what? Muslims need to get the #### out of the Western world. We clearly can't live together. Muslims want to kill all non-believers and well Muslims are pretty ####ed in the head when it comes to their religous beliefs. But then again I think anyone who follows a man-made religion in today's world is pretty ####ed up since we know so much more about physics and the universe we live in. The "Burble" (both new and old Testicle versions) as well as the "Holy Kaboom" are all fiction. Math and physics are reality.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over