mr2mk1g 10 #26 September 6, 2006 QuoteThe us will continue to buy oil on the world maket as long as it's less expensive than producing our own. I agree that's more likely - but the suggestion above that I was addressing was that the US should stop buying overseas oil and rely on it's own as a foreign policy tool, notwithstanding that price difference which you would normally expect to drive such a change. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,120 #27 September 6, 2006 >One side of the equation that hasn't been addressed is the shortage > of refineing capacity in the US. Unless we start the the > permitting/construction process now, we'll still take it in the shorts > everytime there's a interuption in the refining process regardless of > where we get the raw product. I think the lack of refinery capacity is a good thing overall. It sets an artificial limit on our consumption of gasoline (and other refined oil products) and thus protects us from some degree from supply interruptions/reductions. The more refined oil we use, the harder the crash will be when production starts to drop off. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Channman 2 #28 September 6, 2006 > All each of us can do is what we can do. Whining about it won't help a whole lot more. Wendy W. Spoken like a true conservitiveHope your having an awsome afternoon. Cheers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GTAVercetti 0 #29 September 6, 2006 QuoteWe import more from Vensuela then from the Mideast. I'd be more worried about what Chavez is doing then OPEC. Did Venezuela leave OPEC or something?Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 102 #30 September 6, 2006 QuoteThe us will continue to buy oil on the world maket as long as it's less expensive than producing our own. We spend Billions on waging war with the military. Why not consider an oil boycott as a weapon even if it does mean we're paying more for oil? A strange sort of economic sanction, but we would lead the world in R&D for new technologies.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 102 #31 September 6, 2006 QuoteQuoteWe import more from Vensuela then from the Mideast. I'd be more worried about what Chavez is doing then OPEC. Did Venezuela leave OPEC or something? No, don't think so.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #32 September 6, 2006 QuoteQuote I disagree. They should suck it dry. I want my cheap gas now!! Screw the future generations. I don't plan on having any kids myself so its not my concern. oddly enough I agree with this sentiment. The faster we use all of our oil, the faster we'll be forced to come up with an alternative energy source. I'd rather suck the rest of the world dry, then come up with our alternates, then sell our oil at 100X the price to the rest of the world. Thus ending China's short term position on top of the world. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,120 #33 September 6, 2006 >I'd rather suck the rest of the world dry, then come up with our >alternates, then sell our oil at 100X the price to the rest of the world. Probably better than the alternatives. I hope that in 50 years we're the ones with the remaining oil supply. To be dependent on Iran and Venezuela for the oil we need to run our military would be bad. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #34 September 6, 2006 QuoteThus ending China's short term position on top of the world. Depends on your point of view... historically China has consistently been at the "top of the world" for literally millennia... except for the extremely short anomalous blip of the last 200 years after we Brits forced them to buy all our opium… Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stayhigh 2 #35 September 6, 2006 I think that there is better means of power other then oil, but selling oil is multi-billion dollar industry, they will lobby the gov't, car maker, and even scientist to shut their mouth on global warming, people say I who cares about couple degree but, if you jump in perris or elsinore during summer couple degree matters. I do not like sweating in twin otter crammped with 20 other people when it is 1000 degree out side.Bernie Sanders for President 2016 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #36 September 7, 2006 Quote Be prepared to be at the mercy of Canadia, Only while oil is >$60/bbl. Sand oil is very expensive to process. Ever try to run sand through a compressor? It doesn't go very far with gravity flow alone.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #37 September 7, 2006 Quote I think the lack of refinery capacity is a good thing overall. The US govt legislated oil refineries out of business, in practical terms. That's why we haven't had any new refineries built in the US for a very long time.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #38 September 7, 2006 Quote ...when it is 1000 degree out side. Step away from the bong...We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #39 September 7, 2006 Quote To be dependent on Iran and Venezuela for the oil we need to run our military would be bad. We would own the oil in that scenario. Hands down.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Misternatural 0 #40 September 7, 2006 QuoteAll each of us can do is what we can do. Whining about it won't help a whole lot more. Wendy, I hear ya... Last month I made my first batch of Biodiesel....its easyer that I thought. Next I am researching building an ethanol column still using jerusalem artichokes as a feedstock.. BATF willing. oil(petroleum) has so many other uses as a natural resource than simply to burn for transportation and home heating, it is a truly universal building block chemical provided it is responsibly handled. I hope this recent discovery wont derail the alternative fuel momentum that the Washington pundits are currently pushing for. if anyone here is interested in making fuel, check out http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html[url]Beware of the collateralizing and monetization of your desires. D S #3.1415 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kelpdiver 2 #41 September 7, 2006 QuoteQuoteThus ending China's short term position on top of the world. Depends on your point of view... historically China has consistently been at the "top of the world" for literally millennia... except for the extremely short anomalous blip of the last 200 years after we Brits forced them to buy all our opium… With the current trends (and 1.3B cheap workers), China should challenge for top spot...save the fact that they're about 30 years late. I don't think the natural resources exist to get them there. Not cheaply, at least. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Remster 30 #42 September 7, 2006 QuoteQuote Be prepared to be at the mercy of Canadia, Only while oil is >$60/bbl. Sand oil is very expensive to process Want to guess again? "Better yet, recent improvements in mining and extraction techniques have cut heavy oil production costs nearly in half since the 1980s, to about $10 per barrel" http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.07/oil.html "Oil sands production costs are currently estimated at just over $15 per barrel, and overall operations are profitable as long as world oil prices remain above $30 a barrel. " http://www.fool.com/news/commentary/2005/commentary05101904.htmRemster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites StreetScooby 5 #43 September 7, 2006 Quote "Better yet, recent improvements in mining and extraction techniques have cut heavy oil production costs nearly in half since the 1980s, to about $10 per barrel" http://www.wired.com/...chive/12.07/oil.html Thanks, Remi. That was a good read. Early in my life, I worked as a Chemical Engineer for Chevron. Spent 6 months in Salt Lake City at a prototype shale oil refinery. Nasty shit. At that time, economics called for at least $70/bbl for the technology to make money. Nice to see progress has been made. Come to think of it, Canada is much easier to invade than any Middle East country I know of We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #44 September 7, 2006 QuoteWe would own the oil in that scenario. Hands down. really? With the oil needed to keep China going, I am not so sure you will easily win an all out war against China. You seem to be having trouble enough (and Canada similar in Afghanistan) with a limited number of guerilla fighters. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Remster 30 #45 September 7, 2006 QuoteCanada is much easier to invade than any Middle East country I know of Thats what we want you to think.... Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites StreetScooby 5 #46 September 7, 2006 Quote really? With the oil needed to keep China going, I am not so sure you will easily win an all out war against China. You seem to be having trouble enough (and Canada similar in Afghanistan) with a limited number of guerilla fighters. If the US military ever takes their gloves off, no one will stand toe-to-toe with us.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SpeedRacer 1 #47 September 7, 2006 QuoteIf the US military ever takes their gloves off, no one will stand toe-to-toe with us. that's funny, it seems like no one wants to stand with us now. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,120 #48 September 7, 2006 >If the US military ever takes their gloves off . . . . . . the rest of the world will unite against us. We can barely win in Afghanistan and Iraq; you really want to try to invade China? Rome thought they would stand forever too. They were the biggest, baddest motherfuckers on the planet. Then a few things happened, including a government that became corrupt, an economy that became grossly overextended (and was artificially propped up by diluted currency) and a very successful campaign to get the best and brightest to "go and die for your country." They fell pretty quickly (or more accurately evolved into something completely different than the Holy Roman Empire.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites StreetScooby 5 #49 September 7, 2006 Quote We can barely win in Afghanistan and Iraq; We're fighting with both hands tied behind our back in those countries. Quote . . . the rest of the world will unite against us. As long as we can stand the body punches for the first few weeks, they won't stand our body punches when we get to them. Quote you really want to try to invade China? No. Quote Rome thought they would stand forever too. I'm not talking about forever. I'm talking about right here, right now.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,120 #50 September 7, 2006 >As long as we can stand the body punches for the first few weeks, >they won't stand our body punches when we get to them. Nuclear weapons would destroy our infrastructure and collapse our economy. They will eviscerate our ability to even feed ourselves. On the other hand, they won't do much to rice farmers armed with knives. We'd be trying to kill wasps with a steamroller. >I'm not talking about forever. I'm talking about right here, right now. Oh, well then no problem. Right here, right now, we're fine. But some of us worry about tomorrow, and the day after that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 2 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. 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kelpdiver 2 #41 September 7, 2006 QuoteQuoteThus ending China's short term position on top of the world. Depends on your point of view... historically China has consistently been at the "top of the world" for literally millennia... except for the extremely short anomalous blip of the last 200 years after we Brits forced them to buy all our opium… With the current trends (and 1.3B cheap workers), China should challenge for top spot...save the fact that they're about 30 years late. I don't think the natural resources exist to get them there. Not cheaply, at least. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 30 #42 September 7, 2006 QuoteQuote Be prepared to be at the mercy of Canadia, Only while oil is >$60/bbl. Sand oil is very expensive to process Want to guess again? "Better yet, recent improvements in mining and extraction techniques have cut heavy oil production costs nearly in half since the 1980s, to about $10 per barrel" http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.07/oil.html "Oil sands production costs are currently estimated at just over $15 per barrel, and overall operations are profitable as long as world oil prices remain above $30 a barrel. " http://www.fool.com/news/commentary/2005/commentary05101904.htmRemster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #43 September 7, 2006 Quote "Better yet, recent improvements in mining and extraction techniques have cut heavy oil production costs nearly in half since the 1980s, to about $10 per barrel" http://www.wired.com/...chive/12.07/oil.html Thanks, Remi. That was a good read. Early in my life, I worked as a Chemical Engineer for Chevron. Spent 6 months in Salt Lake City at a prototype shale oil refinery. Nasty shit. At that time, economics called for at least $70/bbl for the technology to make money. Nice to see progress has been made. Come to think of it, Canada is much easier to invade than any Middle East country I know of We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #44 September 7, 2006 QuoteWe would own the oil in that scenario. Hands down. really? With the oil needed to keep China going, I am not so sure you will easily win an all out war against China. You seem to be having trouble enough (and Canada similar in Afghanistan) with a limited number of guerilla fighters. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 30 #45 September 7, 2006 QuoteCanada is much easier to invade than any Middle East country I know of Thats what we want you to think.... Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #46 September 7, 2006 Quote really? With the oil needed to keep China going, I am not so sure you will easily win an all out war against China. You seem to be having trouble enough (and Canada similar in Afghanistan) with a limited number of guerilla fighters. If the US military ever takes their gloves off, no one will stand toe-to-toe with us.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #47 September 7, 2006 QuoteIf the US military ever takes their gloves off, no one will stand toe-to-toe with us. that's funny, it seems like no one wants to stand with us now. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,120 #48 September 7, 2006 >If the US military ever takes their gloves off . . . . . . the rest of the world will unite against us. We can barely win in Afghanistan and Iraq; you really want to try to invade China? Rome thought they would stand forever too. They were the biggest, baddest motherfuckers on the planet. Then a few things happened, including a government that became corrupt, an economy that became grossly overextended (and was artificially propped up by diluted currency) and a very successful campaign to get the best and brightest to "go and die for your country." They fell pretty quickly (or more accurately evolved into something completely different than the Holy Roman Empire.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #49 September 7, 2006 Quote We can barely win in Afghanistan and Iraq; We're fighting with both hands tied behind our back in those countries. Quote . . . the rest of the world will unite against us. As long as we can stand the body punches for the first few weeks, they won't stand our body punches when we get to them. Quote you really want to try to invade China? No. Quote Rome thought they would stand forever too. I'm not talking about forever. I'm talking about right here, right now.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,120 #50 September 7, 2006 >As long as we can stand the body punches for the first few weeks, >they won't stand our body punches when we get to them. Nuclear weapons would destroy our infrastructure and collapse our economy. They will eviscerate our ability to even feed ourselves. On the other hand, they won't do much to rice farmers armed with knives. We'd be trying to kill wasps with a steamroller. >I'm not talking about forever. I'm talking about right here, right now. Oh, well then no problem. Right here, right now, we're fine. But some of us worry about tomorrow, and the day after that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
