Skyrad 0 #1 September 5, 2006 Its Snipers have to beg on the internet for equipment! I couldn't belive it when I saw this site. WTF??? http://americansnipers.org/index.htmlWhen an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #2 September 5, 2006 The letters seem to mention the Army isn't outfitting them poorly. This website just makes sure the snipers are getting top shelf equipment.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #3 September 5, 2006 Thats not what they say in AmericanSnipers.org Flash Movie. Every army in the world has squadies getting their own kit from somewhere, I'm just suprised that Sniper units in Iraq and Afghanistan don't in some cases even have rifles!!! (See film and the Snipers letters)When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matthewcline 0 #4 September 5, 2006 I suspect a bit of exaggeration here. We had more sniper rifles than snipers last trip I was on. Well meaning organization, maybe a few years ago and again in a few years they will be needed to help fill a gap in equipment shortages. Wear is the bigger issue if you ask me.An Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #5 September 5, 2006 Based on what I saw in Iraq, I'd have to say that the flash movie you mentioned is a bit misleading at best.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rookie120 0 #6 September 6, 2006 QuoteBased on what I saw in Iraq, I'd have to say that the flash movie you mentioned is a bit misleading at best. Misleading? Is that a polite way of saying BULLSHIT?If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #7 September 6, 2006 I classify this post as a thinly veiled troll. If you REALLY think that video implied that they are poorly equiped I would move to say that you do not have a good grasp on the English language as it clearly states the opposite."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 102 #8 September 6, 2006 The US military is no longer thought of as a paper tiger. UBL actually believed he could defeat us in Afghanistan as they did the Soviets. I remember when the CBS show 60 minutes was alarming the public about how the Abrams tank was so awful and would never work in real battle conditions. That type of assesment of US military capability was common. It has been proven very wrong.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveorino 7 #9 September 6, 2006 QuoteI classify this post as a thinly veiled troll. If you REALLY think that video implied that they are poorly equiped I would move to say that you do not have a good grasp on the English language as it clearly states the opposite. BWAAAHHAAAHHAAA steveOrino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #10 September 6, 2006 QuoteThe US military is no longer thought of as a paper tiger. UBL actually believed he could defeat us in Afghanistan as they did the Soviets. I remember when the CBS show 60 minutes was alarming the public about how the Abrams tank was so awful and would never work in real battle conditions. That type of assesment of US military capability was common. It has been proven very wrong. The Taliban is currently making great strides in Afghanistan. The Canadian CO on the ground is even surprised by how strong and resilient they have been. We are losing fine men their on almost a daily basis from both enemy and friendly fire. It would be helpful if the US spent less time on their toy war in Iraq and more time on something that was important from the beginning. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
miked10270 0 #11 September 6, 2006 I saw it as a "Support-Our-Troops" site. For those who want to help our troops in what they're doing, REGARDLESS of how misguided they think the political direction is, it's a good site. Were there a similar site for British troops, I'd certainly contribute. Mike. Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #12 September 6, 2006 Maybe you watched a different video, I'm going only on the info in the site, have you read the letters from snipers? Like I said all armies soldiers get their own kit as well just this site make the situation sound very badWhen an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #13 September 7, 2006 Quotehave you read the letters from snipers? Yes and I am assuming you have never been in the military as all of those letters suggest the opposite of what you are trying to imply. The reference to not having a sniper section and then standing one up goes into a units MTOE and what they are authorized to have. If its not on the units MTOE, they aren't going to have it and it can be difficult at times to aquire it quickly.But that goes into aspects of the military that most in the military don't undesrstand entirely, if at all. It's like an infantry man saying "Hey I just got back from tank driver school, lets get a tank for the platoon". But the easy to understand and difinitive rebutal to your post is found in one of those letters: "We are sitting pretty well with equipment, but I had the Marines compile a list of personal use items that they could use." Likewise, in the video I watched,the speaker mentioned several times that the guys were well equiped. Again, anyone who has served in any countries military knows that Joe's will always go out and buy extra gear that they personally like or would prefer having and are never happy with what they are issued.There is always something cooler or that they think is better.They also know that no Joe in their right mind is gonna say "no thanks" when someone back home offers them some good old hospitality or asks them what they would like to make life a bit better/easier."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #14 September 7, 2006 QuoteMaybe you watched a different video, I'm going only on the info in the site, have you read the letters from snipers? Like I said all armies soldiers get their own kit as well just this site make the situation sound very bad You did say that "some don't even get a rifle". If there is one thing the US Army has more than enough of, it's guns. Shit, they were giving "designated" marksmen in the line units supressors for their M4s.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Richards 0 #15 September 7, 2006 Which country has a better equipped military than the US? Richards My biggest handicap is that sometimes the hole in the front of my head operates a tad bit faster than the grey matter contained within. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #16 September 7, 2006 QuoteQuoteMaybe you watched a different video, I'm going only on the info in the site, have you read the letters from snipers? Like I said all armies soldiers get their own kit as well just this site make the situation sound very bad You did say that "some don't even get a rifle". If there is one thing the US Army has more than enough of, it's guns. Shit, they were giving "designated" marksmen in the line units supressors for their M4s. Dunno about guns, but according to my son who returned from Iraq earlier this year, quite a few of his unit's vehicles still lacked armor.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #17 September 7, 2006 John, one of the places I went to where they actually fabricate the armor that goes into HUMVEES and other vehicles is cranking out armor plates for installition, 3 shifts a day, 7 days a week. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #18 September 7, 2006 QuoteJohn, one of the places I went to where they actually fabricate the armor that goes into HUMVEES and other vehicles is cranking out armor plates for installition, 3 shifts a day, 7 days a week. Not to mention the fact that you really don't want to up-armor a HMMWV until you have to - they were never designed to be battlefield vehicles and don't handle the extra weight well - which sets up a feedback loop where you have an up-armor HMMWV wear out, it gets replaced by a regular HMMWV and then they have to up-armor THAT one, etc, etc....Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bloody_trauma 2 #19 September 7, 2006 well if your son was what we refer to as a FOBBIT (a person who rarely goes outside the gates, then no his vehicle would have barely any armor on it cuz it just rides around the FOB. on my first deployment here we rode around these streets with not a lick of armor and did jsut fine until the IED's got stronger, i cant say what the armor consists of but it does the job 99% of the time now and every vehicle that leaves the gate with passengers has to have the armor or it goes no where... PERIOD. im not going to go look at that website but if any one wants to give me the names of the soldiers who say they are poorly equiped and ill see if they actually serve in the army or if those are letters someone wrote to get attention and another thing if you want to do extra to help that fine but everyone (almost everyone) in america already does thier part by paying thier taxes, where do you think that money comes from? the goverment keeps us swadled in the best equipment and the latest training available, there may be some stuff that could use improvement and theres a way for us to recommend them, but all in all im satisfied with what the army provides me to accomplish my mission, the way i see it is that if a soldier is complaining about the things he is given hes probably just pissed because he thinks he got a raw deal by joining the army and complains about everything, see it alot with new soldiers coming in after they started softening up basic training, ask a soldier whos taken a bullet to the chest plate and he'll praise the army for giving him the ballistic protection to stop that bullet, you cant safegaud your self from everything, people die regardless of the gear they wear, its a part of war, when its your time to go theres not a damn thing you can do about it except mitigate the risks and be careful and wary of your surroundings, when a new soldier steps onto the battlefield his line of thought is that hes invincible and they cant kill him cuz hes too smart, the line of thinking of an experienced vet is they can kill me and they are going to get me sooner or later but not without a fight god dammit one mroe thing, HMMWV that is uparmored nomenclature M1114/1115's does feel its share of wear and tear from the added weight of the armor, but the vehicles arent replaced, they are serviced to keep them running and in shape, the suspension systems on them are beefed up when the armor is added and strike plates placed below the doors so they dont tear the hinges off, basically any single little piece of the HMMWV that is unservicable or worn out can be replaced from the entire engine down to the last nut and washer, the vehicles are only put out of service when they are a total loss and even then they are torn to peices for part and put into other vehicles, the HMMWV has been in use for well over 20 years now and they are still a kick ass ground stomper, the media always puts a spin on us not having planned for re equipping and aquisitions like our vehicles are getting fcked up in the masses when most of them get fucked up and are fixed in a matter of days and back on the streets with as much attitude as it had before it got messed up, i was in a HMMWV once when it was completely submerged in sewage (we all escaped) we wenched it out towed it home removed the engine and flushed it put it back in and it ran good as new, granted the interior smelled pretty bad but its still going to give us every last drop it has in it before we send it to the scrap yardFly it like you stole it Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #20 September 7, 2006 QuoteQuoteJohn, one of the places I went to where they actually fabricate the armor that goes into HUMVEES and other vehicles is cranking out armor plates for installition, 3 shifts a day, 7 days a week. Not to mention the fact that you really don't want to up-armor a HMMWV until you have to - they were never designed to be battlefield vehicles and don't handle the extra weight well - which sets up a feedback loop where you have an up-armor HMMWV wear out, it gets replaced by a regular HMMWV and then they have to up-armor THAT one, etc, etc.... Well, never designed for the job they are actually doing, and worries about having to spend money on replacements, THOSE are great explanations of how this optional war is being waged. 2659 American boys dead as of this morning. Have a nice day.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,182 #21 September 7, 2006 QuoteJohn, one of the places I went to where they actually fabricate the armor that goes into HUMVEES and other vehicles is cranking out armor plates for installition, 3 shifts a day, 7 days a week. Wow, more than 3 years into an optional war and STILL getting ready for it.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #22 September 7, 2006 I guess you watched another video. And in the snipers letters there are guys saying that they have more trained men than weapons. I'm only going on whats on this site and the fact that at least three other posters have said that the video was either misleading or total bullshit makes me wonder why you are the only one who doesn't see it. As for my service yes I have, as for your reference to trolling and the competen of my language abilities that sounds like a thinly vieled personal attack. Would have expected better from a greenie.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #23 September 7, 2006 The war in Iraq is virtually lost and in Afghanistan the Taliban are making a comeback and are taking and controling ground. UBL is still a free man five years after 9/11 and is still organising and directing (after a fashion) terrorist attacks. The world is a far less stable and more dangerous place not just for Americas but for all. I'd say UBL is doing a bloody good job of spreading his Jihad and that the US has been close to defeated in Iraq. Its just a matter of time and a few hundred/thousand more deaths before the US declare the war won and run for cover, who knows maybe we'll be watching the same images as we did when Saigon fell. Paper Tiger? No, Bleeding Tiger Yes.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #24 September 7, 2006 Quote Again, anyone who has served in any countries military knows that Joe's will always go out and buy extra gear that they personally like or would prefer having and are never happy with what they are issued.There is always something cooler or that they think is better. QuoteEvery army in the world has squadies getting their own kit from somewhere, Maybe you should try reading posts before you comment on them.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bloody_trauma 2 #25 September 7, 2006 Quote2659 American boys dead as of this morning. Have a nice day. WAR TITLE WAR YEARS CASUALTIES Revolutionary War (1775-1783) 4,435 War of 1812 (1812-1815) 2,260 Mexican War (1846-1848) 13,283 Civil War (1861-1865) 623,026 Spanish-American War (1898) 2,446 World War I (1917-1918) 116,708 World War II (1941-1945) 407,316 Korean War (1950-1953) 36,914 Vietnam War (1964-1973) 58,169 Persian Gulf War (1991) 269 Afghanistan (2002-2006) 220+ Operation: Iraqi Freedom (2003-2006) 2,600+ TOTALS 49 years 1,267,846 All things considered i think were doing pretty well. war sucks, people die, its war not a picnic.Fly it like you stole it Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
