Katrina legislation passes

[AggieDave 6]

http://www.katc.com/Global/story.asp?S=5196532

People in their homes after a disaster will be able to defend themselves. This does not override a state's law in any sense, just keeps illegal seizure from happening.

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WASHINGTON -- The House voted Tuesday to prevent law enforcement officers from confiscating legally owned guns during a national disaster or emergency.

Republican Rep. Bobby Jindal, the Louisiana lawmaker who sponsored the bill, said firearms seizures after Hurricane Katrina left residents unable to defend themselves.

"Many of them were sitting in their homes without power, without water, without communication," he said. "It was literally impossible to pick up a phone and call 911."

The House voted 322-99 in support of the bill. Senators voted 84-16 earlier this month to include a similar prohibition in a homeland security funding bill.

The limitation would apply to federal law enforcement or military officers, along with local police that receive federal funds.

Rep. Jerrold Nadler, D-N.Y., repeatedly called the bill "insane."

He and some Democrats said the bill might satisfy the gun lobby, but it would put people into more danger during already perilous disasters.

"The streets of an American city immediately after a disaster are no place to abandon common sense," said Rep. Carolyn McCarthy, D-N.Y.

The Fraternal Order of Police endorsed the measure. In a letter to Jindal, National President Chuck Canterbury said law enforcement officials concentrate on search and rescue during major disasters, and breakdowns in communications and transportation can lengthen police response times to calls.

"A law-abiding citizen who possesses a firearm lawfully represents no danger to law enforcement officers or any other first responder," Canterbury wrote.

The National Rifle Association also supported the bill and has been asking police chiefs and mayors to pledge they will not forcibly disarm law-abiding citizens.

Jindal said the bill does not inhibit police from enforcing gun laws, nor does it overwrite state and local laws prohibiting people from bringing guns into shelters.

Nadler said the bill would prevent police from pickup up guns that could be seized by looters. Police and other law enforcement officials could face a personal lawsuit for picking up guns they later found to be legally owned, he said.

The bill allows the Coast Guard to require that people surrender their weapons before boarding a rescue vehicle.

Edited since John Kallend got confused being that this is a bill to counter a previous piece of legislation and what was done during Katrina. Thus the anti-rights folks failed.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[warpedskydiver 0]

Excellent, now will somebody beat Mayor Daley over the head with this report?

[kallend 2,182]

I don't see how the legislation "fails". It seems to me that it passed.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[AggieDave 6]

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I don't see how the legislation "fails". It seems to me that it passed.

What passed is a counter measure to another piece of legislation that was previously attempted. Thought the readers here could make that leap of imagination and understanding.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[kallend 2,182]

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I don't see how the legislation "fails". It seems to me that it passed.

What passed is a counter measure to another piece of legislation that was previously attempted. Thought the readers here could make that leap of imagination and understanding.

If you described what happened instead of the exact opposite, maybe it would help those of us who don't live in Looking Glass Land..

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[AggieDave 6]

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If you described what happened instead of the exact opposite, maybe it would help those of us who don't live in Looking Glass Land..

Looking Glass Land...never heard of it.

So now that you're done, are you actually going to talk about the article or not?

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Nightingale 0]

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If you described what happened instead of the exact opposite, maybe it would help those of us who don't live in Looking Glass Land..

Looking Glass Land...never heard of it.

So now that you're done, are you actually going to talk about the article or not?

Um... I think the original thread title would've confused me too. I vaguely remembered hearing about the previous legislation, but probably wouldn't have made the connection.

[kallend 2,182]

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If you described what happened instead of the exact opposite, maybe it would help those of us who don't live in Looking Glass Land..

Looking Glass Land...never heard of it.

Well, Disney didn't make a cartoon version of the sequel.
www.literature.org/authors/carroll-lewis/through-the-looking-glass/

Any legislation that keeps government out of the affairs of the people is good.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[AggieDave 6]

Ok, yes, I read the book when I was a child.

Still ignoring the article I see.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[kallend 2,182]

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Ok, yes, I read the book when I was a child.

Still ignoring the article I see.

Anything that keeps government out of the affairs of the people is good.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[AggieDave 6]

Ok, you edited the same time I posted.

Now see, that wasn't so hard, was it?


Illegal seizures, especially those in which at an extreme time of need and known violence that would leave someone defenseless is scary. Then again, previous recent history (past 25 years) from that area shows a LOT about what those in power do when they get a chance.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[kallend 2,182]

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Ok, you edited the same time I posted.

Now see, that wasn't so hard, was it?


Illegal seizures, especially those in which at an extreme time of need and known violence that would leave someone defenseless is scary. Then again, previous recent history (past 25 years) from that area shows a LOT about what those in power do when they get a chance.

No disagreement, but I wouldn't limit it to "that area" or weapons seizures. Those with power have a tendency to abuse it wherever and whenever, and the higher up you go the worse it gets.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[AggieDave 6]

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Those with power have a tendency to abuse it wherever and whenever, and the higher up you go the worse it gets.

Does it happen, yes. Has it happened? Yes. However, most departments are good about removing those who abuse the law from those positions. Most (if not all) states have state laws that prohibite rights violations and there are the obvious federal laws in place as well. There's a reason why a large majority of LEOs record just about everything they do when they're in contact with the public. Obviously it protects them from frivolous accusations but it also protects the public from the "bad apples" as well.

Remember, LEOs are people too, they're not perfect, but there is atleast a system in place to protect the public and the rest of the LEO communities from those "bad apples" as well. There is a lot of case law to show this, especially from the past 30 years.

If you enjoy reading fiction, The Prometheus Deception is a suspense thriller that delves into the extreme side of the spectrum. If you enjoy non-fiction there are an extreme number of books and other writings that cover the topic.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[kallend 2,182]

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Those with power have a tendency to abuse it wherever and whenever, and the higher up you go the worse it gets.

Does it happen, yes. Has it happened? Yes. However, most departments are good about removing those who abuse the law from those positions. Most (if not all) states have state laws that prohibite rights violations and there are the obvious federal laws in place as well. There's a reason why a large majority of LEOs record just about everything they do when they're in contact with the public. Obviously it protects them from frivolous accusations but it also protects the public from the "bad apples" as well.

Remember, LEOs are people too, they're not perfect, but there is atleast a system in place to protect the public and the rest of the LEO communities from those "bad apples" as well. There is a lot of case law to show this, especially from the past 30 years.

If you enjoy reading fiction, The Prometheus Deception is a suspense thriller that delves into the extreme side of the spectrum. If you enjoy non-fiction there are an extreme number of books and other writings that cover the topic.

Read it, and FYI I was a sworn "LEO" from 1968 - 1976. BTW my comments weren't directed specifically at LEOs, but were rather more general in nature concerning abuse of power.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Amazon 7]

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Most (if not all) states have state laws that prohibite rights violations and there are the obvious federal laws in place as well.

I think with the rights there needs to be one thing that is currently missing in MOWST of this country....TRAINING.... the correct and proper use and handling and storage of weapons.

That way they do not get into the hands of people who would use them illegally.
That way they do not get used in such a way that will cause harm to family members or neighbors.

There are WAY too many yahoo's out there that get guns who have no freakin clue about responsible gun ownership.

[AggieDave 6]

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BTW my comments weren't directed specifically at LEOs, but were rather more general in nature concerning abuse of power.

Ok. That's not how I took what you wrote, but can see it now.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[kallend 2,182]

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Most (if not all) states have state laws that prohibite rights violations and there are the obvious federal laws in place as well.

I think with the rights there needs to be one thing that is currently missing in MOWST of this country....TRAINING.... the correct and proper use and handling and storage of weapons.

That way they do not get into the hands of people who would use them illegally.
That way they do not get used in such a way that will cause harm to family members or neighbors.

There are WAY too many yahoo's out there that get guns who have no freakin clue about responsible gun ownership.

You can train people in procedures, but you can't instil good judgment by training. How would you test for it? Surely we as a society implicitly assume that those over the age of 18 (21 for booze) have judgment to participate fully unless they prove otherwise by committing a felony.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Amazon 7]

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Surely we as a society implicitly assume that those over the age of 18 (21 for booze) have judgment to participate fully unless they prove otherwise by committing a felony.

PART of the training needs to be the repercussions of what happens WHEN you use a weapon. With all the legal doo doo you step into just having the thing in your hand in MANY jurisdictions people need to have that.. not just anecdotal stories but include your local LEO's.

[rushmc 23]

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Surely we as a society implicitly assume that those over the age of 18 (21 for booze) have judgment to participate fully unless they prove otherwise by committing a felony.

PART of the training needs to be the repercussions of what happens WHEN you use a weapon. With all the legal doo doo you step into just having the thing in your hand in MANY jurisdictions people need to have that.. not just anecdotal stories but include your local LEO's.

AggieDave may have the numbers (I have forgotten them now) but, over ten years ago when Texas passed thier "shall issue" conceal carry law, 10 of thousands of applications were recieved in the first year. Part of getting that permit required the training you so thoughtfull speak of. Anyway, in that training was included the legal responcibilities of owning and carring a firearm. Many thousands, that passed the training never followed though and puchased the permits because of those implications.

Point? The training in most states is out there.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Amazon 7]

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Point? The training in most states is out there.

CounterPoint....that is for a CONCEALED permit.... I know up here you do not need to get that to buy...and own a weapon for your home/personal protection or for hunting use. My point is you can buy....even if you have to wait the mandatory waiting period...no Permit... no hunting license needed..... AND no training.

Hell if I want to carry a handgun/longgun here all I need do is keep it in plain sight in my truck...although it IS illegal to have it there loaded in or on a vehicle.

[rushmc 23]

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Point? The training in most states is out there.

CounterPoint....that is for a CONCEALED permit.... I know up here you do not need to get that to buy...and own a weapon for your home/personal protection or for hunting use. My point is you can buy....even if you have to wait the mandatory waiting period...no Permit... no hunting license needed..... AND no training.

Hell if I want to carry a handgun/longgun here all I need do is keep it in plain sight in my truck...although it IS illegal to have it there loaded in or on a vehicle.

True, but in a small way I was supporting what you was posting............dam, I need a drink

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Amazon 7]

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True, but in a small way I was supporting what you was posting............dam, I need a drink

I know.. DUDE.. its scary isnt it...

[slug 1]

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Point? The training in most states is out there.

CounterPoint....that is for a CONCEALED permit.... I know up here you do not need to get that to buy...and own a weapon for your home/personal protection or for hunting use. My point is you can buy....even if you have to wait the mandatory waiting period...no Permit... no hunting license needed..... AND no training.

Hell if I want to carry a handgun/longgun here all I need do is keep it in plain sight in my truck...although it IS illegal to have it there loaded in or on a vehicle.

Hi A

We got our CWP without any training. So in this state if you want to carry just pay your $50 for a background check and bingo in 6 weeks it is legal to carry you loaded stuff everywhere except bars, schools, court houses etc.

We got our permit in Tacoma standing in line with dudes wearing red and blue hankies on their head. The guy in front of us did get turned down due to a 20+ yr old felony he forgot about

IMO anyone who messes with you even if you don't have a gun would be . But I said the same thing about Aggie Dave and someone still messed with him

R.I.P.