JohnRich 4 #1 June 12, 2006 News:Gun register is 'not fit for purpose' The National Firearms Register promised by the Government in the aftermath of the Dunblane massacre has been condemned as "fundamentally flawed and not fit for purpose". An internal police report describes the database, intended to carry information on everybody who has applied for a gun licence, as unworkable. But a report by Lancashire Police reveals that the current system is so riddled with problems that its officers had to abandon a pilot scheme for the National Firearms Licensing Management System (NFLMS) last year. In a letter from Lancashire police to the Association of Chief Police Officers' firearms working group, the system is described as having "persistent and immense problems" and "delays of a magnitude which could not be reasonably expected". The seven-page letter, which details dozens of other "significant problems", says: "Lancashire Constabulary felt unable to complete the NFLMS pilot at this present time. It is fundamentally flawed and not fit for purpose."Source: Telegraph If they can't make it work properly in 10 years, then there is no point in wasting any more money on it. This is just another example, along with Canada, of the total failure of the idea of gun registration, and it's applicability to reducing crime. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #2 June 12, 2006 So what would you suggest John?When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #3 June 12, 2006 Bwahahahaha... The Lonesome Rider's on the road again, giving his best to convince every single breathing human beeing that only a (hand) gun hanging down the hip will solve all problems. I'm in tears gasp gasp - how I love men fighting for their conviction! dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #4 June 12, 2006 I dont have enough knowledge on the subject to vote. But I'd welcome your input please. . (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justinb138 0 #5 June 12, 2006 Quote The Lonesome Rider's on the road again, giving his best to convince every single breathing human beeing that only a (hand) gun hanging down the hip will solve all problems. Actually, he's not saying that. His point is that trying to keep track and ban all of them isn't solving anybody's problems. Nice try. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #6 June 12, 2006 So I repeat my question, what does he suggest in this situation. John when responding please remember to take in to consideration that 'Tis ain't Kansas Toto!'When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lefty 0 #7 June 12, 2006 QuoteSo what would you suggest John? Well, I'm not John, but it's hard to come up with a solution to something (law-abiding citizens owning guns without registering them) that isn't a problem in the first place.Provoking a reaction isn't the same thing as saying something meaningful. -Calvin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydyvr 0 #8 June 13, 2006 QuoteThe Lonesome Rider's on the road again, giving his best to convince every single breathing human beeing that only a (hand) gun hanging down the hip will solve all problems. That's a lie. Do you have anything that isn't a lie? . . =(_8^(1) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #9 June 13, 2006 QuoteSo what would you suggest John? Old fashioned police work. Get out from behind the computer and get out on the street. Making neat little lists of guns owned by the law-abiding, sure as heck doesn't help. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #10 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuotechristelsabine: The Lonesome Rider's on the road again, giving his best to convince every single breathing human beeing that only a (hand) gun hanging down the hip will solve all problems. Actually, he's not saying that. His point is that trying to keep track and ban all of them isn't solving anybody's problems. Nice try. Thank you for covering that for me. christelsabine has a very active imagination. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #11 June 13, 2006 Because the bad chaps certainly wont bother to register anyway. I think I agree with you. It's like these knife/gun amneties that they have.. where they leave a big bin somewhere and let people throw stuff away... who would do that? Moms that find little Johnies 45 or Samerai sword under his bed? Certainly noone who ever wanted to use one in a crime.... Like the lists, it's just a PR exercise. . (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CornishChris 5 #12 June 13, 2006 QuoteMaking neat little lists of guns owned by the law-abiding, sure as heck doesn't help. You're right. It's best not to know who has the guns. CJP Gods don't kill people. People with Gods kill people Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydyvr 0 #13 June 13, 2006 QuoteYou're right. It's best not to know who has the guns. Nice way to ignore the point of the argument. Gun registration laws can only document which Law Abiding Citizens have them. What good is that? . . =(_8^(1) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red_Skydiver 0 #14 June 13, 2006 QuoteBecause the bad chaps certainly wont bother to register anyway. I think I agree with you. It's like these knife/gun amneties that they have.. . The idea behind the amnesty is to get weapons off the streets..... or rather to remove them from sheds, garages, under beds, cupboards under the stairs etc. Nobody is suggesting that hardened criminals will hand theirs in but it does remove a lot of unwanted weapons. Weapons that have been removed can no longer be found by burglars and taken for use in another crime for instance. A fathers weapon which he picked up some years ago and no longer wants will not be so readily available to his teenage son if he hands it in. A knife amnesty will not stop knife crime happening but it may prevent a few incidents from happening that would otherwise have proven fatal. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red_Skydiver 0 #15 June 13, 2006 QuoteNews:Gun register is 'not fit for purpose' Not fit for purpose? What is in this country(UK)? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Red_Skydiver 0 #16 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteSo what would you suggest John? Old fashioned police work. Get out from behind the computer and get out on the street. Wow.... I agree with JohnRich on something I'll have to lie down ... I feel unwell... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites warpedskydiver 0 #17 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteYou're right. It's best not to know who has the guns. Nice way to ignore the point of the argument. Gun registration laws can only document which Law Abiding Citizens have them. What good is that? Well then they know who to confiscate them from!!! The crazy thing is that people believe that is ok!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Skyrad 0 #18 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteSo what would you suggest John? Old fashioned police work. Get out from behind the computer and get out on the street. Making neat little lists of guns owned by the law-abiding, sure as heck doesn't help. Ok, I agree to a point and am willing to be swayed. But if there is no registration of firearms then what would distinguish between the legal owners and the illegal owners except when they're breaking the law? Would you advocate the scraping of all firearms laws? If not then what laws would you keep or introduce?When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites justinb138 0 #19 June 13, 2006 Quote Ok, I agree to a point and am willing to be swayed. But if there is no registration of firearms then what would distinguish between the legal owners and the illegal owners except when they're breaking the law? You just answered your own question. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Skyrad 0 #20 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuote Ok, I agree to a point and am willing to be swayed. But if there is no registration of firearms then what would distinguish between the legal owners and the illegal owners except when they're breaking the law? You just answered your own question. Do you do Johns social diary as well? So you'd advocate criminals legaly owning firearms? (Justin or John, hell anyone who wants to answer)When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnealtx 0 #21 June 13, 2006 IF they've done their time, they're no longer a criminal and should have their rights restored...Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites justinb138 0 #22 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuote Ok, I agree to a point and am willing to be swayed. But if there is no registration of firearms then what would distinguish between the legal owners and the illegal owners except when they're breaking the law? You just answered your own question. So you'd advocate criminals legaly owning firearms? (Justin or John, hell anyone who wants to answer) No, I don't advocate criminals legally owning firearms. You just don't get it do you? Edit: I don't advocate violent criminals legally owning firearms. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Skyrad 0 #23 June 13, 2006 So even violent career criminals and paedophiles should be allowed to own firearms???When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites justinb138 0 #24 June 13, 2006 QuoteSo even violent career criminals and paedophiles should be allowed to own firearms??? Both should be in prison for long enough that owning a firearm isn't even a possibility, but thats for another thread. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Skyrad 0 #25 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteSo even violent career criminals and paedophiles should be allowed to own firearms??? Both should be in prison for long enough that owning a firearm isn't even a possibility, but thats for another thread. Yes I agree but that is in a utopian society not the one I live in unfortunatly so would you like to address the question set in the real world?When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. 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Red_Skydiver 0 #16 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteSo what would you suggest John? Old fashioned police work. Get out from behind the computer and get out on the street. Wow.... I agree with JohnRich on something I'll have to lie down ... I feel unwell... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #17 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteYou're right. It's best not to know who has the guns. Nice way to ignore the point of the argument. Gun registration laws can only document which Law Abiding Citizens have them. What good is that? Well then they know who to confiscate them from!!! The crazy thing is that people believe that is ok!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #18 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteSo what would you suggest John? Old fashioned police work. Get out from behind the computer and get out on the street. Making neat little lists of guns owned by the law-abiding, sure as heck doesn't help. Ok, I agree to a point and am willing to be swayed. But if there is no registration of firearms then what would distinguish between the legal owners and the illegal owners except when they're breaking the law? Would you advocate the scraping of all firearms laws? If not then what laws would you keep or introduce?When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justinb138 0 #19 June 13, 2006 Quote Ok, I agree to a point and am willing to be swayed. But if there is no registration of firearms then what would distinguish between the legal owners and the illegal owners except when they're breaking the law? You just answered your own question. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #20 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuote Ok, I agree to a point and am willing to be swayed. But if there is no registration of firearms then what would distinguish between the legal owners and the illegal owners except when they're breaking the law? You just answered your own question. Do you do Johns social diary as well? So you'd advocate criminals legaly owning firearms? (Justin or John, hell anyone who wants to answer)When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #21 June 13, 2006 IF they've done their time, they're no longer a criminal and should have their rights restored...Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justinb138 0 #22 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuote Ok, I agree to a point and am willing to be swayed. But if there is no registration of firearms then what would distinguish between the legal owners and the illegal owners except when they're breaking the law? You just answered your own question. So you'd advocate criminals legaly owning firearms? (Justin or John, hell anyone who wants to answer) No, I don't advocate criminals legally owning firearms. You just don't get it do you? Edit: I don't advocate violent criminals legally owning firearms. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #23 June 13, 2006 So even violent career criminals and paedophiles should be allowed to own firearms???When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justinb138 0 #24 June 13, 2006 QuoteSo even violent career criminals and paedophiles should be allowed to own firearms??? Both should be in prison for long enough that owning a firearm isn't even a possibility, but thats for another thread. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #25 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteSo even violent career criminals and paedophiles should be allowed to own firearms??? Both should be in prison for long enough that owning a firearm isn't even a possibility, but thats for another thread. Yes I agree but that is in a utopian society not the one I live in unfortunatly so would you like to address the question set in the real world?When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
