Hillary Rips Climbers Who Left Dying Man

[beowulf 1]

I have no idea what I would do and that is all I can say. Any speculation would be totally unreliable, because I have never been any situation remotely similar to that.

[bch7773 0]

its pretty simple. the 40 people going to the summit spent a lot of time and money to climb everest... they didn't want to give that up to render aid to a dying man.

very coldblooded by them.

however, i can't say what i would do until i was put in that situation. I'd like to say I would have given up climbing everest in order to help him, but thats easy to say when i'm sitting on the ground, with full oxygen, warm, and healthy.

MB 3528, RB 1182

[idrankwhat 0]

More perspective on the incident. Sounds like he was solo.

http://www.everestnews.com/everest2006/sharpeverest05172006.htm

[beowulf 1]

I seriously doubt that it was that simple.

We really can't see the full context to put this in. The only way to really understand is to do it. Kind of like skydiving. It can't be explained it can only be experienced.

[downwardspiral 0]

How exactly would anyone "render assistance" at 28,000 feet? I can't possibly see how his life could have been saved given the circumstances.

I know exactly what that level of hypoxia feels like due to a very pleasurable experience in an altitude chamber ascending to 29,000 feet. If any of you were up there I don't doubt your desire to not be "cold blooded", I doubt your ability.

www.FourWheelerHB.com

[miked10270 0]

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How exactly would anyone "render assistance" at 28,000 feet? I can't possibly see how his life could have been saved given the circumstances.

I know exactly what that level of hypoxia feels like due to a very pleasurable experience in an altitude chamber ascending to 29,000 feet. If any of you were up there I don't doubt your desire to not be "cold blooded", I doubt your ability.

Add to that freezing cold, no chance of a warmer than tepid drink, blinding white decor, and the fact you haven't had any proper sleep for at least the last week...

Co-incidentally, the British Army had an experienced, very fit and well kitted expedition going up Everest. They've just decided to pull the plug on it and descend because it would be too risky to continue and they didn't have the supplies to stay put.

http://www.armyoneverest.mod.uk/

Good call. Knowing when to quit and quitting when you know is what keeps you alive on extreme expeditions.

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[billvon 3,119]

>very coldblooded by them.

I am reminded of a whuffo comment I once heard about someone going in under a reserve mal. "And no one flew over to help him? Why not? Couldn't you fly over and have him grab on?" Cold-blooded of us, I must say!

[beowulf 1]

Now that is a good comparison.

[shropshire 0]

Sorry, but I dont agree that it's about the money per se.

It's called the Dead Zone for a very good reason.. everyone who enters it knows it. It's far too easy for people here to claim that they would perform super human acts to help... but, from what I have read, there really is very little that anyone can do for anyone else at that altitude..... You are on your own and it's your choice.

I agree with Kallend, insomuch that I couldn't just walk on by (if I saw some life), but I hope that I would stay to provide some comfort... but for how long? The longer that you stay, the more difficult it would be to leave and the more dead I would be.


Regards,

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[shropshire 0]

Too many people been watching Sly in Cliff Hanger?

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[miked10270 0]

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Too many people been watching Sly in Cliff Hanger?

Yeah... And where the hell was Chuck Norris while this was happening. Him & Sly could have swum the Atlantic, around the Cape, up the Indian Ocean, caught a train to Nepal (to get their breath back after the swim), and jogged up with a scoop-stretcher & some SCUBA bottles. Frostbite?.. They could pull the stretchered guy down with their teeth!

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[shropshire 0]

A train? Chuck wouldn't use the train... he'd let Sly do that and he'd run along side.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[miked10270 0]

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A train? Chuck wouldn't use the train... he'd let Sly do that and he'd run along side.

Yeah... and then Roundhouse-Kick everest down to a height of 5 feet while Sly was getting the stretcher off the train!

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[kelpdiver 2]

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I know exactly what that level of hypoxia feels like due to a very pleasurable experience in an altitude chamber ascending to 29,000 feet. If any of you were up there I don't doubt your desire to not be "cold blooded", I doubt your ability.

These climbers spent weeks, not minutes getting to 29,000, so it's really not the same at all. It's got to be lousy in its own ways.

Now as for help - if the problem for the guy was the oxygen system, someone going up certainly could help him out, with a likely cost of having to turn back.

[miked10270 0]

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These climbers spent weeks, not minutes getting to 29,000, so it's really not the same at all. It's got to be lousy in its own ways.

Now as for help - if the problem for the guy was the oxygen system, someone going up certainly could help him out, with a likely cost of having to turn back.

Acclimatisation doesn't cure or prevent Soroche. It alleviates it to a small extent. Too little oxygen is still too little oxygen. It's just too shitty an environment to adapt to.

As for help - lacing your own boots counts as a major achievement!.. One you'd save for after your morning O2 hit. Going to help just doesn't happen - this isn't wandering over to your neighbour tinkering under the bonnet of his car! It's just too much effort with too little higher brain function.

Mike.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[downwardspiral 0]

Have you ever been in an altitude chamber?

I remember being in a Caravan at 15k realizing that not only was I hypoxic, everyone on the load was. Having the ability to recognize hypoxia and its effects is invaluable. Especially in skydiving.

www.FourWheelerHB.com

[warpedskydiver 0]

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These climbers spent weeks, not minutes getting to 29,000, so it's really not the same at all. It's got to be lousy in its own ways.

Now as for help - if the problem for the guy was the oxygen system, someone going up certainly could help him out, with a likely cost of having to turn back.

Acclimatisation doesn't cure or prevent Soroche. It alleviates it to a small extent. Too little oxygen is still too little oxygen. It's just too shitty an environment to adapt to.

As for help - lacing your own boots counts as a major achievement!.. One you'd save for after your morning O2 hit. Going to help just doesn't happen - this isn't wandering over to your neighbour tinkering under the bonnet of his car! It's just too much effort with too little higher brain function.

Mike.

But still enough to walk by and continue to climbe more than 1000 feet to the summit and then descend sucessfully?


To me summiting would be of no joy whatsoever if I continued on, instead of trying to do something such as descend with him or stay with him until sherpas could render assistance.

Does anyone truly enjoy going on the next load after someone goes in?...

[kelpdiver 2]

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Have you ever been in an altitude chamber?

I remember being in a Caravan at 15k realizing that not only was I hypoxic, everyone on the load was. Having the ability to recognize hypoxia and its effects is invaluable. Especially in skydiving.

nope, no chamber. A good number of hours at 12-14.5k on multiple occasions, though.

My point is that the sensations you get are different in the chamber. You suffer from a dramatic loss of O2. They're suffering from a long term shortage of O2.

You'll quickly pass out on a chamber ride simultating 24k - 4 minutes of useful time as I recall. And that's exactly how it felt when I rode a plane to that height. 5 minutes before exit we removed the O2 mask to fix our helmets and goggles and that was quiet a sensation. Had we climbed up to there over 2 weeks, not nearly so dramatic.

[tbrown 26]

One of the main reasons I use a cypres for AFF (and why I think it's a good idea for everyone who does AFF) is that I know I would have trouble abandoning someone like that. I once saw a video of a good friend of mine getting knocked out during an AFF level 1 - and I know I couldn't have 'given up' on her. It would be a huge mistake, of course, and I know at an intellectual level that I should break off the chase at 2000 feet. But I don't think I could make myself do it. A cypres might make turn that into a non-fatal mistake.

[cloudseeker2001 0]

After reading about 12 climbing books in the past 3 months, this guy killed himself. He should have turned around the second anything went wrong. And too, climbing solo is an extraordinary accomplishment, he knew the dangers. After a certain altitude, if you even as much as sit down, you will never get back up.....it would be almost impossible to save someone at 28K.

A really great climbing read is Blind Corners......great book!

"Some call it heavenly in it's brilliance,
others mean and rueful of the western dream"

[Richards 0]

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Welcome to the "me" generation...

That is unfortunately all too true. I do however find myself pleasantly surprised when I see or read about the occasional selfless act.

Richards

My biggest handicap is that sometimes the hole in the front of my head operates a tad bit faster than the grey matter contained within.

[skymedic 0]

sorry but when you are on an 8,000+ meter peak, the life support equipment you have up there is for you...and you alone. when you are on the Lhotse face , South Col or higher you are in the death zone. it is that simple. it is bad that this guy died...but he was unguided and solo. He made some errors in judgement caused by his hypoxia for sure. unfortunately that's one of the possibilities of an 8000 meter peak. and just like skydiving, you know those risks before you go that high.

Marc
otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman....

[Zipp0 1]

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After reading about 12 climbing books in the past 3 months, this guy killed himself. He should have turned around the second anything went wrong. And too, climbing solo is an extraordinary accomplishment, he knew the dangers. After a certain altitude, if you even as much as sit down, you will never get back up.....it would be almost impossible to save someone at 28K.

A really great climbing read is Blind Corners......great book!

Also try "The White Spider" - about the first successful ascent of the Eigerwand.

It may have been impossible to save the climber, but did anyone even attempt to get him to his feet and moving down? After everyone had summitted, who was the last person to walk by this dying man, and was he conscious?

There have been people brought down from 8000 , meter peaks when they bonked on the way up. Simply getting him down to the next camp probably would have saved his life. A concerted effort by all the climbers would have saved his life. Descending just a few hundred feet will help someone with cerebral or pulmony edema.

When a climber was critically injured at Seneca Rocks, WV, a few years ago(head injury from fall) every climber on the mountain came to assist in the rescue. Now, Seneca is no Everest, but you can die there if you are careless, or unlucky.

Everest hasn't been a climber's mountain for some time now.

Zipp0

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Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

[PhreeZone 20]

WV is a picnic compared to Everest. Its not often that you are wearing 02 in WV and crampons for weeks straight

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[Zipp0 1]

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WV is a picnic compared to Everest. Its not often that you are wearing 02 in WV and crampons for weeks straight

Physically and logistically yes, technically, no. Seneca is a small mountain, but it is dead vertical. Everest is mostly a steep hike, for a month, in the snow. (the standard route, anyway)

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Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.