What rights?

[mnealtx 0]

That's not answering my question, Jeanne... is it, or is it not equally racist of the Democratic party to imply that minorities cannot succeed in life without the Democrats helping them??

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

I have NEVER seen them declare that as part of the party platform and if the republicans were som magnanomous in righting that wrong.. where is the legislation???



Me.. I think people need to get where they are in life by merit.. not by the fact theri daddy is in Congress or the CIA... or.... shall I go on????

[billvon 3,114]

>is it, or is it not equally racist of the Democratic party to imply that
> minorities cannot succeed in life without the Democrats helping
> them??

Using that sort of inflammatory language - isn't the republican party racist for not acknowledging that blacks were systematically denied rights by the US government as recently as the 1950's?

[mnealtx 0]

Quote

I have NEVER seen them declare that as part of the party platform and if the republicans were som magnanomous in righting that wrong.. where is the legislation???



Me.. I think people need to get where they are in life by merit.. not by the fact theri daddy is in Congress or the CIA... or.... shall I go on????

Or the fact that the President makes set-asides or quotas for them?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

OH OH.. CLINTON did it FIRST


http://www.pfaw.org/pfaw/general/default.aspx?oid=7696


Last year, the White House raised the ire of anti-affirmative action groups by filing a brief with the high court in support of an affirmative action program in federal highway construction projects, though Justice Department officials went out of their way to emphasize the narrow focus of the brief. Lott’s public nostalgia for Strom Thurmond’s segregationist presidential run in 1948 and his subsequent resignation as Senate Majority Leader have raised the stakes of an already important Supreme Court case. Clearly, affirmative action opponents are worried about what a conflicted White House will decide this time around.

In December, Curt Levy, a lawyer with the Center for Individual Rights, the group representing the anti-affirmative action side before the court, told the Los Angeles Times that, "If it were up to Ashcroft and Olson…they would come down on our side. But people in the White House are pushing hard the other way."



?neener neener neener..... the republicans are pandering again...

Say one thing do another....

[mnealtx 0]

I guess maybe the Dems *are* making some progress... maybe in a few more decades they'll get to a point where it truly CAN be about "the content of their character, and not the color of their skin".

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

Gee I have always thought it was about good ole boys who are used to all the predguidice they want to heap on minorities and women and anyone else the deem as less deserving than they are by virtue of their birthright as the power elite in this society.. BUT god forbid if they percieve anyone to be discriminating against them.. then the ole shit hits the ole fan... and man can they whine about the injustice of it all.

[mnealtx 0]

Still no answer, eh?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

asked and answered... the link dahrlin.. and the subsequent post.

[mnealtx 0]

TDIT (they do it too) isn't an answer.... is the policy itself racist or not?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

Quote

TDIT (they do it too) isn't an answer.... is the policy itself racist or not?

Do I believe its racist?

What do YOU consider to be racist.. If it supports your OWN ideas of groups to discriminate against... is that racist...????

To listen to the incessant bleating of the right on this issue you would think there are NO white Males in the workforce or in colleges. According to the way you seem to go on and on about it( and a few others of you) All you should see working in this country are afro americans and women in all the important jobs because of all this discrimination against you personally.


I would prefer that there be a totally colorblind genderblind society in which ANYONE could go after ANY opportunity that they have the education and training and DRIVE to get. Personally I would love to be able to compete on a level playing field based on my own abilities for an education and jobs.

Does that happen in this country right now???? NO


Even in a HUGE corporation like I work in I look around at our group of fairly well paid IT people. With over 135 people in this group there is very little diversity.. and this at a company that prides itself on its very open programs for diversity. The reality is there are no african americans...there are 6 women ...there are several people from India.... and the rest are all white males.

The reality is minorities and women still make up a very small portion of the jobs that these policies were created to redress.
The reality is that women and minorities STILL make less for the same amount of work.

The reality is that the good ole boys created this problem in our society.. and they REALLLY HATE even the small concessions they see as discrimination against them.


So all I see the right doing on this issue is a bunch of "angry white men" running off at the mouth about a very little bit of your birthright priveledge being manadated to be SHARED with others because YOU WOULD not play fair in the first place.


Statiscally women and minorities STILL make only 2/3 or less of comparable jobs that white men make.

http://www.uaw.org/publications/jobs_pay/02/0202/jpe02.html


IS THAT DISCRIMINATION????



WOMEN AND MINORITIES
IN THE LABOR FORCE

http://www.referenceforbusiness.com/management/Tr-Z/Women-and-Minorities-in-Management.html

[mnealtx 0]

Ok, so we can put you down for a "no", then?

My views on it have not changed - if special consideration is being given due to race (regardless of what race it is), then that program or policy is racist.

By all mean, please show how I am racist with that view. I'd love to see how you get to the conclusion.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

Quote

My views on it have not changed - if special consideration is being given due to race (regardless of what race it is), then that program or policy is racist.

You refuse to look at the reality and bitch about the few inroads that women and minorities have offended you by being given a very little help to redress the system you and most of those of you who look just like you have benifited from in a disproportionate way.

Personally I see that as racist as well as sexist.

[mnealtx 0]

Quote

Quote

My views on it have not changed - if special consideration is being given due to race (regardless of what race it is), then that program or policy is racist.

You refuse to look at the reality and bitch about the few inroads that women and minorities have offended you by being given a very little help to redress the system you and most of those of you who look just like you have benifited from in a disproportionate way.

Personally I see that as racist as well as sexist.

How is hiring someone based on race/gender and not qualification for the job racist/sexist? I see it exactly the other way around.

I guess we're still a long way from getting to "content of their character, rather than the color of their skin" (or gender).... sad.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on the issue.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

Quote

How is hiring someone based on race/gender and not qualification for the job racist/sexist? I see it exactly the other way around.

I guess we're still a long way from getting to "content of their character, rather than the color of their skin" (or gender).... sad.

AS I said..... the reality is that it is still not even a level playing filed even here where I work.

Is that my fault??

Is it the fault of the good ole boys who would rather hire another Golf Playing izod shirt...docker wearing good ole boy who is doing the hiring that gives more credence to the job qualifications of some who looks just like him.?


Truthfully when you are on the side of the fence that is actually being discriminated against..... rather than on the side of the fence where its a percieved affront to you because some of your precious birthright is being erroded... you tend to be slapped in the face with the REALITY of this issue.

[skydyvr 0]

Quote

Is it the fault of the good ole boys who would rather hire another Golf Playing izod shirt...

Who are you talking about? The ugly images you conjure are more than a few years out of date.

Well, either that, or your company is out of the mainstream. Or maybe your wierd perceptions are clouded by excessive hatred for the terrible "white male". Gee, could that be it?

. . =(_8^(1)

[Amazon 7]

Gee how many blacks and women do you have in YOUR IT department.....hmmmmmmm

The thing is... the GM of our group even ackhowledged we have a"diversity" issue in his last All Hands Meeting.... so its not so out of date after all... \


and you certainly do percieve EVERYTHING that does not agree with your narrow world view as "HATRED"...... sad.. very very sad



"OH LOOK SHE EDITED IT AGAIN"

[skydyvr 0]

Quote

Gee how many blacks and women do you have in YOUR IT department.....hmmmmmmm

I'm in the middle of the food chain. I report to a hispanic woman. She reports to a woman. That woman reports to a black guy, who is the president of my organization. My dozen or so peers are about half white males. I welcome these conditions, and appreciate the increased diversity.

. . =(_8^(1)

[skydyvr 0]

Quote

"OH LOOK SHE EDITED IT AGAIN"

We need Google caching on your posts so we can go back and see what ban-inducing comments you went and changed . . .

. . =(_8^(1)

[mnealtx 0]

Quote

Gee how many blacks and women do you have in YOUR IT department.....hmmmmmmm

The thing is... the GM of our group even ackhowledged we have a"diversity" issue in his last All Hands Meeting.... so its not so out of date after all... \


and you certainly do percieve EVERYTHING that does not agree with your narrow world view as "HATRED"...... sad.. very very sad



"OH LOOK SHE EDITED IT AGAIN"

The best qualified person for the job should be hired regardless of race, gender or any other consideration - that is *true* equality.

Hiring quotas hurt businesses due to people being hired for jobs they are not qualified for, merely to "fill the blanks".

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Amazon 7]

I wish I could see a bit more diversity here.. like I said out of 135 people in the org.... zero African americans... zero native americans other than me and I do not even claim my 1/8th seminole heritage for HR purposes..... 6 women......... and 3 more admins to the GM level execs.

Neal

Quote

The best qualified person for the job should be hired regardless of race, gender or any other consideration - that is *true* equality.

That would be ideal.. but the reality is far different, and in many places the exact opposite happens because the one doign the hiring SEES the gender or ethnicity as something he is uncomfortable with.

OR on the flip side you you get a good job....and later see your bosses interview notes and he had underlined STACKED on the notes...

[warpedskydiver 0]

Quote

This might be what you are looking for.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/metro/20051101-104932-4054r.htm

On top of being blatantly racist in Maryland, notice the weak attempts to justify their stupidity. To deny the racism involved adds another layer of insult to a fine man like Steele.

Is that considered to be a hate crime since the attacks are racially motivated?

[skydyvr 0]

Quote

I wish I could see a bit more diversity here.. like I said out of 135 people in the org.... zero African americans... zero native americans other than me and I do not even claim my 1/8th seminole heritage for HR purposes..... 6 women......... and 3 more admins to the GM level execs.

Don't be too surprised to know that I support a lot of AA functions simply because they are the ONLY way to bust up the old boy network and get minorities into the mainstream. Someday, maybe AA's job will be done and we'll have equal opportunity for all. More time and effort is needed, but I think AA is working.

Anyway, don't be discouraged -- there are still plenty of ULTRA RIGHTIE views you can slam me for. EEO just isn't one of them.

. . =(_8^(1)

[Lindsey 0]

Here's an example of another, very annoying, side of the issue....

When I was preparing my application for medical school, a friend of mine, a black woman, was doing the same. Her grades weren't too hot because she really wasn't very diligent. She did have a child and was busy being a mom, but so did I. She said to me once (and as it played out she was correct), "I don't have to worry so much about my grades, because as an African American woman with a good vita, I'll get into medical school." She did. I don't think a white man with her scores would have been considered. That's crap, imho.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[Amazon 7]

Quote

Anyway, don't be discouraged -- there are still plenty of ULTRA RIGHTIE views you can slam me for. EEO just isn't one of them.

Well at least on ONE issue then you are the EXCEPTION rather than the all too typical rule.


And Lindsey

And as far as the woman who would not apply herself.. that kind of thing reallly pissses me off. Far too few are actually given the chance even WITH AA.

There are WAY too many women and minorities who do work their butts off and yet will never make it because they do not get as good an education in their high schools as they would if they were in better more well funded school districts.
Their grades may be lower going in to college or med school because of that but if you apply yourself you can overcome that once you get to the school with higher standards and better professors.

Anyone aspiring to a profession like that has got to apply themselves and rise beyond.....