Only The Rich Pay Taxes....

[rushmc 23]

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my question was along those lines. I wonder how many republicans would still suport the war if it meant that they had to pay a war tax.

Since some of you think the sun shines from Mr. Bush's ass...why would you not send him more money to satisfy his blood lust?

We would have plenty of money if we would remove 1/2 of the social give away programs the left buys votes with that create a dependant class......

And why are looking at Bush's ass??

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rehmwa 2]

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We would have plenty of money if we would remove 1/2 of the social give away programs the left buys votes with that create a dependant class

Yeah, the left is guilty of the social bribing and their programs are VERY obtuse, but you can say the same of the right. (prescription drug program comes to mind).

POLITICS is all about creating a dependent class. Both teams play that strategy.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rushmc 23]

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We would have plenty of money if we would remove 1/2 of the social give away programs the left buys votes with that create a dependant class

Yeah, the left is guilty of the social bribing and their programs are VERY obtuse, but you can say the same of the right. (prescription drug program comes to mind).

POLITICS is all about creating a dependent class. Both teams play that strategy.

Can't argue with that!

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rehmwa 2]

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Can't argue with that!

Then the obvious response is to take a personal crack at me. When you are short of ideas, then pick at my grammer or spelling.

If that doesn't feel right, then just warm up a bit by randomly going off on some tangent about one or another political figure.

What's wrong with you? Haven't you been paying attention?

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rushmc 23]

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Can't argue with that!

Then the obvious response is to take a personal crack at me. When you are short of ideas, then pick at my grammer or spelling.

If that doesn't feel right, then just warm up a bit by randomly going off on some tangent about one or another political figure.

What's wrong with you? Haven't you been paying attention?

I am too tired to put myself into a situation where I may need to duck!!

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[wmw999 2,589]

You're ugly and your mother grammer dresses you funny. And sock puppets are only scary because you're a wimp

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[rehmwa 2]

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I am too tired to put myself into a situation where I may need to duck!!

I highly recommend you pay attention to Wendy.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[billvon 3,120]

>We would have plenty of money if we would remove 1/2 of the
>social give away programs the left buys votes with that create a
>dependant class......

What, specifically, would you cut? Education? Emergency assistance to disaster areas? The CDC? Air Traffic Control? Medicare?

[kallend 2,150]

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Can't argue with that!

Then the obvious response is to take a personal crack at me. When you are short of ideas, then pick at my grammer or spelling.

If that doesn't feel right, then just warm up a bit by randomly going off on some tangent about one or another political figure.

What's wrong with you? Haven't you been paying attention?

It's "grammar"! Are you happy now?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[rehmwa 2]

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It's "grammar"! Are you happy now?

it's "Gramma"

I feel sorry for your students

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Samurai136 0]

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my question was along those lines. I wonder how many republicans would still suport the war if it meant that they had to pay a war tax.

Since some of you think the sun shines from Mr. Bush's ass...why would you not send him more money to satisfy his blood lust?

We would have plenty of money if we would remove 1/2 of the social give away programs the left buys votes with that create a dependant class......

And why are looking at Bush's ass??

What votes are the Left Buying? The bottom 50% of income earners.... who have no free capital for political contributions to begin with? Probably not since we all know politics is bought with money!

Wake up, Dude!

The top 3% make 85% of the political contributions... think.

--------------------+





Onto my Modest proposal....


Ironic that the rich on DZ.com would bitch about paying 3% more in taxes for the working 50% income earners of america. If you picked up that 3%, the government could get rid of certain entitlements because the working class could afford a home!

Simple math!

What is $5k to someone who earns $200k+ per year vs someone who makes $30k or less per year?

p.s. you're not buying them a house, you're allowing them to afford a mortgage for a home. Big difference. I'd think the wealthy would understand some basic business/ home financing but that has obviously been proven false.

"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian
Ken

[rushmc 23]

< What is $5k to someone who earns $200k+ per year vs someone who makes $30k or less per year? >


The difference can be wether or not a new business is started giving 3 lower income people and new chance at a better job.

Want to stop a behavior? Tax it. Want to get something started? Remove the tax. Now that is simple!!

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Channman 2]

> (prescription drug program comes to mind).

I'm for eliminating the prescription drug program. Currently running 4X's the estimated cost. Was not a happy camper when Bush signed it into law. The education bill, is a big joke, and currently the government is spending about $1.75 to get .10 cents into a contractors hands to rebuild N. O.

Revamp Social Security, to allow for personal savings. A 25 year old could accumulate a great deal of money with $50.00 a month in a Roth IRA, it grows tax deffered as well as distributions at retirement are tax free.

Although some future congressman will figure this out and change the law.

[billvon 3,120]

>Want to stop a behavior? Tax it. Want to get something started?
>Remove the tax. Now that is simple!!

If your theory were valid, then fewer and fewer people would have very high incomes in the US (to avoid those taxes) and more and more people would move towards the middle and lower ends to reap the benefits. The opposite is happening; the gulf between the richest and poorest people in the US is still widening rapidly. So you may need a new theory, since it doesn't describe what happens in the real world (although it is certainly a valid one to discuss.)

What the evidence DOES show is that if you give lower income people a tax break, the money goes back into circulation almost immediately. If you give Warren Buffet a tax break, the money goes into his bank account. (He admits this.)

Now, not using taxes for social purposes is surely a valid point, one that has often been brought up here. But to try to encourage wealth by arranging a tax structure is every bit as much social engineering as trying to give tax breaks to low income people.

Every tax structure - from a flat tax to a consumption tax to a progressive tax - is founded in social engineering. It's unavoidable. Republicans generally try to engineer the structure to benefit businesses; democrats generally try to favor lower income people. Both have pluses and minuses, but both are using taxes to drive society to a desired outcome (via different means of course.)

[Gravitymaster 0]

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If you give Warren Buffet a tax break, the money goes into his bank account.

Please tell me you don't believe this. Do you honestly think someone as Market savvy as Buffet just puts his money in a savings account at 4.1%?

[ExAFO 0]

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...Our infrastructure (rail, highways, air) are pretty good...Yes there is traffic in cities but the interstate sys is bad ass...

Shit, I wish we had a good rail system like the Euros have... Flexibility of airlines with lower cost and more locations.

Illinois needs a CCW Law. NOW.

[rushmc 23]

Republicans "engineer" taxes to benifit everyone. Can't call it a theory when reducing taxes has worked all 3 times it has been tryed.

Saying Repulican tax cuts only favor the rich is a piece of polical crap the Dems use to promote the tool that has worked the best for them for decades. Class evny.

The tax cuts in the current case have done what they were supposed to do but a spend drunk congress has over spent. And a veto scared President has not stood up to them!
Add that to the natural disaster spending and the war, spending over shadows the good the tax cuts created. (Have you seen the GAO reports of the money coming in?)

Another oportunity wasted in my opinion

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kallend 2,150]

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If you give Warren Buffet a tax break, the money goes into his bank account.

Please tell me you don't believe this. Do you honestly think someone as Market savvy as Buffet just puts his money in a savings account at 4.1%?

No, he gives it to Grinnell College, his alma mater.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 2,150]

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Republicans "engineer" taxes to benifit everyone. Can't call it a theory when reducing taxes has worked all 3 times it has been tryed.

Saying Repulican tax cuts only favor the rich is a piece of polical crap the Dems use to promote the tool that has worked the best for them for decades. Class evny.

The tax cuts in the current case have done what they were supposed to do but a spend drunk congress has over spent. And a veto scared President has not stood up to them!
Add that to the natural disaster spending and the war, spending over shadows the good the tax cuts created. (Have you seen the GAO reports of the money coming in?)

Another oportunity wasted in my opinion

Reagan cut taxes, and more than doubled the nation's debt. Bush cut taxes and is well on his way to doubling the nation's debt. Where is your proof that Republican fiscal policy works?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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If you give Warren Buffet a tax break, the money goes into his bank account.

Please tell me you don't believe this. Do you honestly think someone as Market savvy as Buffet just puts his money in a savings account at 4.1%?

No, he gives it to Grinnell College, his alma mater.

Which benefits the college. Not exactly doing nothing is it? I wonder why some people believe that the wealthy put their money in some underground vault, taking it out of circulation.

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[kallend 2,150]

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If you give Warren Buffet a tax break, the money goes into his bank account.

Please tell me you don't believe this. Do you honestly think someone as Market savvy as Buffet just puts his money in a savings account at 4.1%?

No, he gives it to Grinnell College, his alma mater.

Which benefits the college. Not exactly doing nothing is it? I wonder why some people believe that the wealthy put their money in some underground vault, taking it out of circulation.

-

Right now the College is just sitting on it, so it's just in a different hole in the ground. Grinnell still has astronomical tuition so the students aren't seeing much benefit.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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If you give Warren Buffet a tax break, the money goes into his bank account.

Please tell me you don't believe this. Do you honestly think someone as Market savvy as Buffet just puts his money in a savings account at 4.1%?

No, he gives it to Grinnell College, his alma mater.

Which benefits the college. Not exactly doing nothing is it? I wonder why some people believe that the wealthy put their money in some underground vault, taking it out of circulation.

-

Right now the College is just sitting on it, so it's just in a different hole in the ground. Grinnell still has astronomical tuition so the students aren't seeing much benefit.

The College can do whatever they choose with the money, I'm sure it isn't in a 4% Savings Account. But we are getting off the subject here. The original claim was that Buffet would simply put his tax cut into his bank. I think we both can agree, that's not true.

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[rehmwa 2]

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>If you give ...a tax break, the money goes into his bank account.

And then the bank invests it. Money circulates unless it's stuffed in a mattress or buried in your back yard.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[CanuckInUSA 0]

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Bush cut taxes and is well on his way to doubling the nation's debt. Where is your proof that Republican fiscal policy works?

If I could I would send some of you guys to the penalty box for politicizing everything around here. Bush's tax cuts could have worked had he not decided to start his own little war. But Bush is an idiot ... need we say more. Time to move on (well at least let's hope there is something to move on in 2008).

Taxation is here to stay, but it reaches far wider than just on the federal level. Taxation is at the federal, provincial/state level, municipal and consumption level and personally I think it's out of control at too many levels. The government is no different than you or me when it comes to the need to controlling ones spending. Remember it's not how much you make, it's how much you keep after you factor in your income versus your expenses. Unfortunately this message is lost on too many government beurocrates. When they need money, instead of looking at what fat they can trim out of their services, they just raises taxes. Obviously running a government is not a trivial affair, but what pisses me off almost as much as a government running a deficit is when the government boasts that they have a record surplus in a given year and start patting themselves on their backs. What they did was over tax their jurisdiction in the first place. Obviously it's very rare nowadays, but seeing a government budget come in on target not too high not too low is what we should strive for. But it's not only the government’s responsibility. Able bodied people need to take responsibility for themselves and stop acting like victims of society. That way the governments can take care of those who truly are in need. If someone feels that they are only 5k away in income from being able to afford a home, well I'm sorry the government does not owe you shit. Get out there are figure out either where you can cut some of your spending to make up that 5k, or better yet do what you need to do to earn more income. Stop being a victim and start taking control of your fiscal lives. This way there will be less need for certain government services and maybe taxation can be brought under control. Awe who am I kidding, taxation under control? I might as well start believing in the easter bunny.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[billvon 3,120]

>Republicans "engineer" taxes to benifit everyone.

According to them. According to democrats, their cuts do the same thing. Their theory:

Give a tax cut to Warren Buffet and he just puts the extra money in his savings. You don't need another two accountants to manage another three million dollars. Give a tax cut to a carpenter in New Orleans, and he takes that money and puts new brakes on his car. Money goes to the brake shop, local mechanics and a local businessman. Businessman does better; hires more mechanics (even though he's not paying any more or less in taxes.)

Both theories sound good. Both are social engineering.