warpedskydiver 0 #1 March 5, 2006 Priests Purify Shrine After Bush Visit By Associated Press Sun Mar 5, 5:27 AM A U.S. security personnel inspects near the eternal flame ... NEW DELHI - Hindu priests who look after the memorial of Indian independence leader Mohandas Gandhi conducted a purification ceremony at the shrine after a visit from President Bush. But it wasn't the president who offended them, it was the sniffer-dogs who scoured the area ahead of his visit. After the dog visit, the memorial was cleansed with water brought from the Ganges river, which Hindus consider holy, the Hindustan Times newspaper reported Sunday. Bush visited the memorial on Thursday during his three day visit to India. The site, where pacifist icon Gandhi was cremated, is considered sacred and all visitors, including Bush and his wife Laura, removed their shoes before going in. The dogs, flown in from the U.S., were part of the intense security surrounding the president, but the Hindu priests believe they tainted the site. Letting dogs into the memorial also drew sharp protest from Hindu politicians and Gandhi's great grandson, Tushar Gandhi, who called the incident a "national shame," the Press Trust of India news agency reported. Quote I have nothing at all against the Hindu's and yet they seemed to take offense at the dogs being there...hmmmm the Ganges is one of the most polluted rivers in that area of the world and Humans actually defacate right into it... there is farm runoff, animal feces and industrial waste, That is purification? besides those dogs live in cleaner conditions than most of India's vast population. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites CanuckInUSA 0 #2 March 5, 2006 We know why the dogs were brought in. To ensure that no explosives were there and as much as some of us don't like GWB, he has the right to NOT worry about being blown up by bombs when he visits some place. But why are you getting your panties in a bind over a culture which is different from your own? If they want to hold some sort of religious ritual after GWB's visit to cleanse themselves from what they believe. Let them do it. It's not like they denied the dogs access to do their jobs in the first place. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites warpedskydiver 0 #3 March 5, 2006 QuoteWe know why the dogs were brought in. To ensure that no explosives were there and as much as some of us don't like GWB, he has the right to NOT worry about being blown up by bombs when he visits some place. But why are you getting your panties in a bind over a culture which is different from your own? If they want to hold some sort of religious ritual after GWB's visit to cleanse themselves from what they believe. Let them do it. It's not like they denied the dogs access to do their jobs in the first place. Who said anything about having panties in a bind?... I was merely pointing out that Hindus revere animals and yet purified it...that's cool too, but with Ganges water?...I hope they boiled it first Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livendive 8 #4 March 5, 2006 QuoteI was merely pointing out that Hindus revere animals and yet purified it...that's cool too, but with Ganges water?...I hope they boiled it first It's a religious thing. Logic is strongly discouraged. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #5 March 6, 2006 QuoteTo ensure that no explosives were there and as much as some of us don't like GWB, he has the right to NOT worry about being blown up by bombs when he visits some place. Now off course, he also is free to be sensitive and not go to a place where they are offended by the dogs that pre-amble the visit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rehmwa 2 #6 March 6, 2006 Quotehe also is free to be sensitive and not go to a place See the Headline? "GWB Refuses to Visit Hindu Shrine" Apparently his religious overlords won't allow him to enter any religious place. As the Antichrist, religious places cause him great pain. Can't win, don't try. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #7 March 6, 2006 QuoteSee the Headline? "GWB Refuses to Visit Hindu Shrine" Apparently his religious overlords won't allow him to enter any religious place. As the Antichrist, religious places cause him great pain. I didn't realize he was invited to attend the shrine. If that is teh case I retract my statement. However, he decided it was a place he wanted to visit. or if his handlers told him it would look good on film, well then the statement stands. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Andy9o8 2 #8 March 6, 2006 QuoteQuoteSee the Headline? "GWB Refuses to Visit Hindu Shrine" Apparently his religious overlords won't allow him to enter any religious place. As the Antichrist, religious places cause him great pain. I didn't realize he was invited to attend the shrine. If that is teh case I retract my statement. However, he decided it was a place he wanted to visit. or if his handlers told him it would look good on film, well then the statement stands. The Americans did what they had to do. If there was any breach of protocol, it was strictly on the part of the Indians. Whether visiting this venue was an Indian idea or an American one is irrelevant. The security professionals in the Indian government are not a bunch of rubes. Presidential logistics and security advance teams travel to foreign locations well ahead of time. Certainly enough people in the Indian government knew, or should have known, that appropriate security would be in place at every venue visited by the President. Using bomb-sniffing dogs is S.O.P. Logically, the best experts on Indian culture and domestic politics are the Indians themselves. If this security measure would have caused problems of sensitivity, the Indians should have anticipated it and seen to it in advance that it was avoided. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mr2mk1g 10 #9 March 6, 2006 "Purity" in a spiritual sense is not at all the same thing as "purity" in the clinical or sanitary sense. Same word; two very different meanings. You're simply applying the wrong one, that's all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #10 March 6, 2006 ahh yes, the we are ignorant and big enough to not care defence. To me, when I am thie visitor, I do some homework in advance, not rely on my hosts to tell me when I am offending them, but try to not offend them to begin with. QuoteThe Americans did what they had to do. If there was any breach of protocol, it was strictly on the part of the Indians. I think this sentence about sums it up.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Andy9o8 2 #11 March 6, 2006 Quoteahh yes, the we are ignorant and big enough to not care defence. Sighh. You're missing my point, and twisting my words and intent. And not like I feel the need to defend myself, but those who know me know that I am far, far from the "ugly American" type. Nor am I going to get sucked into The Semantics Game. Anyhow, the point being, that not only do security teams meet in advance, so do protocol teams. The security teams need to communicate with the protocol teams. So is protocol a mutual responsibility? Yes. But I think it's probable that when the American advance teams met with their Indian counterparts, they reviewed security procedures and informed the Indians that bomb-sniffing dogs would be used at every venue visited. And since the Indians are the experts on their own culture and politics, they were in the best position to recognize this as a protocol problem. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,150 #12 March 7, 2006 QuoteQuotehe also is free to be sensitive and not go to a place See the Headline? "GWB Refuses to Visit Hindu Shrine" Apparently his religious overlords won't allow him to enter any religious place. As the Antichrist, religious places cause him great pain. Can't win, don't try. An individual that believes military force is the answer to problems has no business at Ghandi's shrine.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. 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CanuckInUSA 0 #2 March 5, 2006 We know why the dogs were brought in. To ensure that no explosives were there and as much as some of us don't like GWB, he has the right to NOT worry about being blown up by bombs when he visits some place. But why are you getting your panties in a bind over a culture which is different from your own? If they want to hold some sort of religious ritual after GWB's visit to cleanse themselves from what they believe. Let them do it. It's not like they denied the dogs access to do their jobs in the first place. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #3 March 5, 2006 QuoteWe know why the dogs were brought in. To ensure that no explosives were there and as much as some of us don't like GWB, he has the right to NOT worry about being blown up by bombs when he visits some place. But why are you getting your panties in a bind over a culture which is different from your own? If they want to hold some sort of religious ritual after GWB's visit to cleanse themselves from what they believe. Let them do it. It's not like they denied the dogs access to do their jobs in the first place. Who said anything about having panties in a bind?... I was merely pointing out that Hindus revere animals and yet purified it...that's cool too, but with Ganges water?...I hope they boiled it first Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livendive 8 #4 March 5, 2006 QuoteI was merely pointing out that Hindus revere animals and yet purified it...that's cool too, but with Ganges water?...I hope they boiled it first It's a religious thing. Logic is strongly discouraged. Blues, Dave"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #5 March 6, 2006 QuoteTo ensure that no explosives were there and as much as some of us don't like GWB, he has the right to NOT worry about being blown up by bombs when he visits some place. Now off course, he also is free to be sensitive and not go to a place where they are offended by the dogs that pre-amble the visit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #6 March 6, 2006 Quotehe also is free to be sensitive and not go to a place See the Headline? "GWB Refuses to Visit Hindu Shrine" Apparently his religious overlords won't allow him to enter any religious place. As the Antichrist, religious places cause him great pain. Can't win, don't try. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #7 March 6, 2006 QuoteSee the Headline? "GWB Refuses to Visit Hindu Shrine" Apparently his religious overlords won't allow him to enter any religious place. As the Antichrist, religious places cause him great pain. I didn't realize he was invited to attend the shrine. If that is teh case I retract my statement. However, he decided it was a place he wanted to visit. or if his handlers told him it would look good on film, well then the statement stands. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #8 March 6, 2006 QuoteQuoteSee the Headline? "GWB Refuses to Visit Hindu Shrine" Apparently his religious overlords won't allow him to enter any religious place. As the Antichrist, religious places cause him great pain. I didn't realize he was invited to attend the shrine. If that is teh case I retract my statement. However, he decided it was a place he wanted to visit. or if his handlers told him it would look good on film, well then the statement stands. The Americans did what they had to do. If there was any breach of protocol, it was strictly on the part of the Indians. Whether visiting this venue was an Indian idea or an American one is irrelevant. The security professionals in the Indian government are not a bunch of rubes. Presidential logistics and security advance teams travel to foreign locations well ahead of time. Certainly enough people in the Indian government knew, or should have known, that appropriate security would be in place at every venue visited by the President. Using bomb-sniffing dogs is S.O.P. Logically, the best experts on Indian culture and domestic politics are the Indians themselves. If this security measure would have caused problems of sensitivity, the Indians should have anticipated it and seen to it in advance that it was avoided. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #9 March 6, 2006 "Purity" in a spiritual sense is not at all the same thing as "purity" in the clinical or sanitary sense. Same word; two very different meanings. You're simply applying the wrong one, that's all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #10 March 6, 2006 ahh yes, the we are ignorant and big enough to not care defence. To me, when I am thie visitor, I do some homework in advance, not rely on my hosts to tell me when I am offending them, but try to not offend them to begin with. QuoteThe Americans did what they had to do. If there was any breach of protocol, it was strictly on the part of the Indians. I think this sentence about sums it up.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #11 March 6, 2006 Quoteahh yes, the we are ignorant and big enough to not care defence. Sighh. You're missing my point, and twisting my words and intent. And not like I feel the need to defend myself, but those who know me know that I am far, far from the "ugly American" type. Nor am I going to get sucked into The Semantics Game. Anyhow, the point being, that not only do security teams meet in advance, so do protocol teams. The security teams need to communicate with the protocol teams. So is protocol a mutual responsibility? Yes. But I think it's probable that when the American advance teams met with their Indian counterparts, they reviewed security procedures and informed the Indians that bomb-sniffing dogs would be used at every venue visited. And since the Indians are the experts on their own culture and politics, they were in the best position to recognize this as a protocol problem. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,150 #12 March 7, 2006 QuoteQuotehe also is free to be sensitive and not go to a place See the Headline? "GWB Refuses to Visit Hindu Shrine" Apparently his religious overlords won't allow him to enter any religious place. As the Antichrist, religious places cause him great pain. Can't win, don't try. An individual that believes military force is the answer to problems has no business at Ghandi's shrine.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
