pop 0 #1 February 7, 2006 See the cartoons yourself and think about the last time you or anyone you know would grab a gun, sword, or missile to punish the society and cartoonist who defaced your religious icon in the following manner: http://www.aaronlerner.com/DanishCartoons.html With Arab media coverage such as the following, the hypocrisy over these cartoons is laughable: http://www.honestreporting.com/articles/45884734/critiques/Offensive_Cartoons.asp http://www.memri.org/video/ http://memri.org/antisemitism.html This basically sums up my feelings: http://backspin.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/filibuster.JPG7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pop 0 #2 February 7, 2006 Quote from reuters.com "In a new twist, Iran's best-selling newspaper on Tuesday launched a competition to find the best Holocaust cartoon."7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #3 February 7, 2006 How many Denish people are treated like shit daily or killed by Muslims? How many of their homes have been bulldozed by the Muslims? How many Danish children have been killed because a Muslim president decided there lives have no value? Now change the names around from Danish to Palestinians Muslims and change Muslims to Israeli I acutely think the Nazis are a great comparison to the Israelis. They both treated people of different fait as 2nd class citizens. They both killed indiscriminately the one of different fait. They both have more power and guns then the people they treat as 2nd class citizens. They also stole there homes You can’t see the difference? That basically Somme’s up how I feel about it.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #4 February 7, 2006 QuoteQuote from reuters.com "In a new twist, Iran's best-selling newspaper on Tuesday launched a competition to find the best Holocaust cartoon." When you punch someone can you blaim them for punching back?I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pop 0 #5 February 7, 2006 To compare Israelis to Nazi is pretty ignorant. EVen a true Jew hater wouldnt compare the two.7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #6 February 7, 2006 you know, i've tried having a civilized discussion with you in the past. agreeing not to agree on many things. but this post either shows you either know nothing about history (both the Israeli-palestinian confilict and the holocaust) or that your views are so twisted that you can compare the two. either way i doubt anything i'll say will make you see anything but this twisted view. just do yourself a favor and stop pretending to "take a balanced view and see both sides" as you always claim, because after reading this post, its nothing but absurd. O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Newbie 0 #7 February 7, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuote from reuters.com "In a new twist, Iran's best-selling newspaper on Tuesday launched a competition to find the best Holocaust cartoon." When you punch someone can you blaim them for punching back? Can you explain what jews have to do with the currently fatwah being issues on the heads of Danish people/journalists? How do jews tie into this? Is it because all jews control all the media, everywhere? Or is it because, like Mohamed, a figure who can't be proved, the Holocause likewise cannot be proven to have happened, so seeing as they are both ficticious, they can be ridiculed together? Which is it, i'm curious to know? "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #8 February 7, 2006 I have to say I am not surprised it seems if you say anything no matter how true of the Israeli government you are an anti-Semitic. How about other then giving me some BS answer look at my list and tell if any ANY of them are wrong? If you find any I will gladly post news article from major new groups? I don’t BS anyone, or have anything against Jews. But being Israeli does not exempt you from following basic human rights. Even my comparisons are correct. But usually when people can’t come back with facts they call you a racist. I always make sure to point to the Israelis and couldn’t give a fuck what there religion is. I see them as the murderers they are. Sorry you’re blinded.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #9 February 7, 2006 I know that the holocaust was a horrible and evil event in history and I pray it will never happen again to anyone. But that doesn’t change my comparisons? Do the Israelis treat Muslims differently then Jews? And not just now go back 10-20-30 years and tell me I am wrong. How many Palestinians children have been killed by Israelis fighters solders, and on and on? How many homes have been bulldozed? What kind of job opportunities do Muslims get in Israel? It is easy to call me an anti-Semitic but I know I am not. I also will not deny the facts just because it is the thing to do now. Again if I am wrong on any of my comparisons you show me with facts. And if you like I point to many diaries that were written by Christian reporters on how the Palestinians get treated daily. The whole point is if the Muslims world has a problem with Israel they have valid reasons. I don’t see any of them making fun of Moses, as he is our profit as well. However what did the Muslim world do to the Danish? They probably sell most of there fetha cheese to the Middle East I didn’t now that was a crime. It is too much that no one sees how the Palestinians are treated mainly thanks to the Media. They aren’t genetically crazy as the Media and others would like everyone to believe. They have been treated like shit to put it nicely for more then 50 years. People need to see thing threw there eyes once in a while as well. I have enjoyed are discussions in the past and you have always been able to argue with me by stating facts. Even if we do not agree on them all. I don't hate I just want people to see both views. There are many that offer the Israeli side. I am mostly alone in trying to show the Palestinians side.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #10 February 7, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote from reuters.com "In a new twist, Iran's best-selling newspaper on Tuesday launched a competition to find the best Holocaust cartoon." When you punch someone can you blaim them for punching back? Can you explain what jews have to do with the currently fatwah being issues on the heads of Danish people/journalists? How do jews tie into this? Is it because all jews control all the media, everywhere? Or is it because, like Mohamed, a figure who can't be proved, the Holocause likewise cannot be proven to have happened, so seeing as they are both ficticious, they can be ridiculed together? Which is it, i'm curious to know? I am not for making fun of the holocaust, as I see nothing funny about it. All I am trying to point out is this. That the Danish reporters did something offensive and now the Iranian media is trying to do something equally as offensive. I see both actions as offensive but I do realize that the 2nd offence would not have occurred if the first offence (punch) had not occurred.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #11 February 7, 2006 QuoteBut usually when people can’t come back with facts they call you a racist fine, here you go... Quote I acutely think the Nazis are a great comparison to the Israelis. which shows you are either blind or ignorant. Quote They both treated people of different fait as 2nd class citizens. a. palestinians are not Israeli citizens (beside israeli arabs which have the exact same rights by law). they live in a teritory that was fought on and lost, if anything they were jordanian/egyptian citizens. very different from european jews in the 1930's where they were as german/polish/french etc as any other european. Quote They both killed indiscriminately the one of different fait. i can argue about who is responsible for the killings but lets play it your way and say its ALL israels fault. the difference is that here it is a war zone where two people/cultures/nations fight over the same land. war may be ugly but war over land is pretty much the reason for all wars in history. the Nazi's hunt for jews focused on killing all jews, period. not taking land, not taking property no nothing. the killed the jews in their own country, and in any country they could reach them, there was no advantage to it whatsoever, if anything, it took resources from their already streched war efforts. Quote They both have more power and guns then the people they treat as 2nd class citizens. yeah well, i dont even want to imagine what would happen if you guys could have it your way with us here in Israel. i can take your claim and say "although Israel is much stronger it still uses very precise measures and does almost anything it can to minimize civilian casualties, which is not easy when terrorists fir rockets from back yard" i'm not even going to start the debate of whos land it is and who started pretty much every war there's been here in the last 60 years. oh, and who took every chance to delay and avoid reaching a solution peacefully. if you really can't see the difference between killing a nation just for the sake of killing and people getting hurt in a state of war (even if you stick to "its all Israel's fault" line), then i suggest you think before you open your mouth abouot it O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #12 February 7, 2006 Quotea. palestinians are not Israeli citizens (beside israeli arabs which have the exact same rights by law). they live in a teritory that was fought on and lost, if anything they were jordanian/egyptian citizens. very different from european jews in the 1930's where they were as german/polish/french etc as any other european. So in your point of view kicking people out of their land then killing them is ok? What ever the agenda is for killing Muslims you are still targeting people biased on there religion and race. You know what we have been down this road many times. I am just going stop. I just hope we find peace somehow some way if that is even possible.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #13 February 7, 2006 Quote know that the holocaust was a horrible and evil event yet you compare it to something that is not even in the same area of magnitude (again, even if all of your views about who's the bad guys here are true). QuoteDo the Israelis treat Muslims differently then Jews? are you talking about muslims in general? palestinians? israeli-arabs? israeli arabs are israeli citizens and have the same rights as i do. beside the fact that are not required to serve in the army, we are eual by law. QuoteHow many Palestinians children have been killed by Israelis innocent children or those sent carrying explosives ? innocent civilians are not targeted although they sometimes get hurt. its war and it can be ugly. but civilians are NEVER the target. can you say the same about the palestinian methods? QuoteWhat kind of job opportunities do Muslims get in Israel? pretty much the same job opportunities i have in the EU or the US if i'm not a EU/US citizen. Israeli arabs have the same opportunities as any other israeli and i even have an israeli arab as a project manager in one of my project. pa;estinians do work in israel based on permits but these permits are harder to get when terrorists use them too... QuoteHow many homes have been bulldozed? too many. most because they were used for terrorist operations or did they belong to the family of a suicide bomber. both are valid in my book. QuoteIt is easy to call me an anti-Semitic but I know I am not i dont know what you are and i don't really care. don't try to make the israeli palestinian issue a jewish-muslim issue, its not. O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beowulf 1 #14 February 7, 2006 Just because Muslims are being and have been treated badly doesn't give them free reign to do violence just because someone insulted their religion. Muslims are not justified in their actions anymore then Jews were justified in pushing Palestinians off of their land. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #15 February 7, 2006 Quotedon't try to make the israeli palestinian issue a jewish-muslim issue, its not. There is something we agree on. It is a land dispute and should have been solved as such. I never mentioned Jews I always say Israelis. There is no way I would view people of the Jewish fait like I view the Israeli government. I also make it a point so people know I am specking ONLY of the Israeli government and as mentioned above I could give a fuck what religion they are. Quoteits war and it can be ugly. but civilians are NEVER the target. can you say the same about the palestinian methods? The Palestinian method is the only method they have. They target civilians as the Israeli government and military is very good at protecting them selves. I bet if they were capable of hitting the military they would. However I agree that killing civilians is not a good options. I apologize if it sounds like I am comparing the Holocaust to what the Israeli government does as an exact comparison. I did not intend to say they are the same magnitude. I meant to say that the Israeli government is guilty of some of the crimes that was done against them in WWII by the nazies.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #16 February 7, 2006 QuoteI never mentioned Jews I always say Israelis that's exaclty my point. you compared the hunt for jews (being polish, russina or algerian) to a dispute between israel as a nation to the palestinians as a nation. no israeli is looking for the extermination of palestinians/muslims or anyone else. QuoteThe Palestinian method is the only method they have. i'm sorry, that excuse/reason is unacceptable. besides, the days of rocks and sticks are long gone, today its AK47, RPG and rockets. the difference? Israel has the ability to destroy everything and everyone, but it doesn't. can you say the same about the newly elected Hamas? and back to the subject, i don't think these cartoons were funny, nor smart (although i support their right to publish them). i just think that the arab world should take a look at their own media before accusing others. O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pop 0 #17 February 7, 2006 Quotei just think that the arab world should take a look at their own media before accusing others. that was exactly my point7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #18 February 7, 2006 QuoteIsrael has the ability to destroy everything and everyone, but it doesn't. can you say the same about the newly elected Hamas? Israel might have the physical capability to destroy everyone but they know the world would not stand for an all out mascara. Right now most of the world is on Israeli side and the Israeli government is very smart (not honest) but smart they know what to say and not to say. I remember a few years ago when the Israeli bombers killed 9 children knowing they would kill inocent people in the area. At first Sharon said it was collateral damage and he was happy with the operation. Only after the world showed outrage of his comments he retracted his previous statement. However that doesn’t make his 2nd statement true. Quote i'm sorry, that excuse/reason is unacceptable. How do you suggest they fight back with the capabilities they have? Considering their enemy has killed inocent Palestinians many times.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pop 0 #19 February 7, 2006 This is good... Moscow museum to exhibit Mohammed cartoons MOSCOW, Feb. 7 (UPI) -- A Moscow museum has announced it will exhibit the entire series of cartoons of Mohammed that have caused riots throughout the Islamic world. Yury Samodurov, director of the Sakharov Museum and Public Center, said on Russian television that the center was ready to organize a public exhibition of the cartoons satirizing the founder of Islam that originally were published in a Danish newspaper, Pravda.ru reported Monday. "We must show the whole world that Russia goes along with Europe, that the freedom of expression is much more important for us than the dogmas of religious fanatics," Samodurov said. The exhibition reportedly will open in March. Lawyer Yury Shmidt has said he will invite French philosopher Andre Glucksmann and French novelist Michel Houellebecq to the opening ceremony to read lectures about the threat of Islamic fundamentalism. In 2003 the Sakharov Museum outraged many Russian Orthodox believers with the art exhibit "Be Careful -- Religion," which many felt was insulting to their beliefs.7 ounce wonders, music and dogs that are not into beer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #20 February 7, 2006 Quotebut they know the world would not stand for an all out mascara. No they wouldn't!! Look at the outcry over the Tammy Faye Baker debacle! (i'm sorry...I know I'm an asshole....) Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #21 February 7, 2006 QuoteIsrael might have the physical capability to destroy everyone but they know the world would not stand for an all out mascara. or... maybe Israel actually doesnt want to kill just anyone and everyone. QuoteHow do you suggest they fight back with the capabilities they have? here's a new idea, try not fighting for a while and see what will happen. up until now every round of peace talks ended when the palestinians resorted back to violence the moment they didnt get everything they wanted. you can't sit and talk and keep waving a gun. O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tcnelson 1 #22 February 7, 2006 i love this forum! ...an all out mascara...brilliant! "Don't talk to me like that assface...I don't work for you yet." - Fletch NBFT, Deseoso Rodriguez RB#1329 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #23 February 7, 2006 yea dude i know my writing skills suck the big oneI'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #24 February 7, 2006 QuoteOslo Dead? Violence toward end of 2000The end of September and October, 2000, has seen a series of violent events unfold that probably unofficially mark the end of the Oslo accords. The 1993 Oslo Accord, whereby Israel recognized the PLO and gave them limited autonomy in return for peace and an end to Palestinian claims on Israeli territory, has been largely criticized as a one-sided accord, that benefits only Israel, not the Palestinian people. A former Israeli military general, Ariel Sharon, (accompanied by 1000 soldiers) visited a holy Muslim site, called the Temple Mount by the Israelis, and Haram al Sharif (Noble Sanctuary) by the Muslims and proclaimed it as eternal Israeli territory. Sharon had been accused of massacres in his military days and is well known to all. He is very right wing and against the peace process. This infuriated Palestinians, and led to a series of protests and violence. There are many reasons why the peace talks have failed. You can't only blame the PalestiniansI'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #25 February 7, 2006 Quote"But for all the failings of the Arafat administration, the central responsibility for the Palestinians' problems rests with Israel's failure to abide by the Oslo and Wye agreements over free movement of people within the Palestinian Territories, and its failure to curb settlement building that continues to deepen already appalling social and economic problems. These disappointments at the lack of the fruits of peace were the backdrop to attempts to settle the final status for a putative Palestinian State. It was the stalled issue of the future of Arab east Jerusalem as capital of that state that sparked the latest wave of violence and which remains non-negotiable for Barak." by Peter Beaumont, the Guardian Newspaper (UK), October 15, 2000 Again who do you blame?I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
