Cory Maye

[RhondaLea 4]

Now that Tookie is dead, let's talk about a guy who shouldn't be on death row.

http://www.theagitator.com/archives/025962.php#025962

Sometime in late 2001, Officer Ron Jones collected a tip from an anonymous informant that Jamie Smith, who lived opposite Maye in a duplex, was selling drugs out of his home. Jones passed the tip to the Pearl River Basin Narcotics Task Force, a regional police agency in charge of carrying out drug raids in four surrounding counties. The task force asked Jones if he'd like to come along on the raid they'd be conducting as the result of his tip. He obliged.

On the night of December 26, the task force donned paramilitary gear, and conducted a drug raid on Smith's house. Unfortunately, they hadn't done their homework. The team didn't realize that the house was a duplex, and that Maye -- who had no relationship with Smith,-- rented out the other side with his girlfirend and 1-year-old daughter.

As the raid on Smith commenced, some officers - including Jones -- went around to what they thought was a side door to Smith's residence, looking for a larger stash of drugs. (Note added on 12/12: This is Maye's first attorney's account of the raid. Police did have a warrant to both residences, though Maye wasn't named in either) The door was actually a door to Maye's home. Maye was home alone with his young daughter, and asleep, when one member of the SWAT team broke down the outside door. Jones, who hadn't drawn his gun charged in, and made his way to Maye's bedroom. Police did not announce themselves. (Note added on 12/09/05: Police said at trial that they did announce themselves before entering Maye's apartment -- Maye and his attorney say otherwise. I'm inclined to believe Maye, for reasons outlined in this post. However, even if they did, announcing seconds before bursting in just before midnight, isn't much better than not announcing at all. An innocent person on the other end of the raid, particularly if still asleep, has every reason to fear for his life.). Maye, fearing for his life and the safety of his daughter, fired at Jones, hitting him in the abdomen, just below his bulletproof vest. Jones died a short time later.

Maye had no criminal record, and wasn't the target of the search warrant. Police initially concluded they had found no drugs in Maye's side of the duplex. Then, mysteriously, police later announced they'd found "traces" of marijuana. I talked to the attorney who represented Maye at trial. She said that to her knowledge, police had found one smoked marijuana cigarette in Maye's apartment. Regardless, since Maye wasn't the subject of the search, whether or not he had misdemeanor amounts of drugs in his possession isn't really relevant. What's relevant is whether or not he reasonably believed his life was in danger. Seems pretty clear to me that that would be a reasonable assumption.

It apparently wasn't so clear to Mississippi's criminal justice system. In January of last year, Maye was convicted of capital murder for the shooting of Officer Jones. He was sentenced to death by lethal injection.

Let's summarize: Cops mistakenly break down the door of a sleeping man, late at night, as part of drug raid. Turns out, the man wasn't named in the warrant, and wasn't a suspect. The man, frigthened for himself and his 18-month old daughter, fires at an intruder who jumps into his bedroom after the door's been kicked in. Turns out that the man, who is black, has killed the white son of the town's police chief. He's later convicted and sentenced to death by a white jury. The man has no criminal record, and police rather tellingly changed their story about drugs (rather, traces of drugs) in his possession at the time of the raid.

The story gets more bizarre from there.

-continued-


rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[BillyVance 35]

That is soooo fucked up...

It does seem like it was self defense in panic mode. Many people with a gun by their bedside might do the same thing.

Sounds like he got railroaded...

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[Botellines 0]

But you are still in favour of capital punishment, right?

I hope someone realizes how fucked up this is before his heart stops beating.

[RhondaLea 4]

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But you are still in favour of capital punishment, right?

Yes, I am.

I am not in favor of punishing Cory Maye by any means at all. He did not commit a crime. He doesn't belong in jail, much less on death row.

In this case it isn't that the particular punishment is wrong, it's that any punishment is wrong.

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I hope someone realizes how fucked up this is before his heart stops beating.

So do I.

More info and links

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[Botellines 0]

But you cannot have it both ways.
Let´s have this straight, you are willing to put Cory Maye to death even considering he is innocent of any crime rather than showing the "mercy" to lock a murderer like Williams in jail for life.

All is fine and dandy until that unjustice is commited against you or you beloved ones.

[RhondaLea 4]

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But you cannot have it both ways.
Let´s have this straight, you are willing to put Cory Maye to death even considering he is innocent of any crime rather than showing the "mercy" to lock a murderer like Williams in jail for life.

All is fine and dandy until that unjustice is commited against you or you beloved ones.

I can't make what you wrote make sense no matter how many times I read it.

I'm not willing to have Cory Maye punished at all. It's not the method of punishment that I object to here. It's that he's being punished, period. What part of that don't you understand?

Would this situation be okay with you if he were sentenced to life in prison instead of receiving the death penalty? It's not okay with me.

I posted this because I find a great deal of irony in the fact that there has been a huge public outcry on behalf of a man who murdered four people in cold blood, but there has been little done about an obvious miscarriage of justice. I have also posted (in two other threads) links to three websites that detail the results of a fouled legal system.

A major overhaul of how we handle justice in this country is certainly in order. It may even be that we will be required to call a halt to executions until that is accomplished. But as far as I'm concerned, it's not the death penalty that's the problem, but the way we currently administer justice in this country.

Again, what part of that don't you understand?

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[kallend 2,151]

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But as far as I'm concerned, it's not the death penalty that's the problem,

Is the part I don't understand. The death penalty symbolizes ALL that is wrong with the criminal justice system.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Guest]

He'll probably get justice at about the same time Randy Weaver does.

"Every Knee Shall Bow".

edit to add URL

mh

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"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat."

[RhondaLea 4]

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But as far as I'm concerned, it's not the death penalty that's the problem,

Is the part I don't understand. The death penalty symbolizes ALL that is wrong with the criminal justice system.

To you, John, not to me.

If you had said "the improper implementation of the death penalty," I'd have agreed with you.

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[RhondaLea 4]

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He'll probably get justice at about the same time Randy Weaver does.

http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig3/conger3.html

When the jury came back with its not-guilty verdict, Randy Weaver turned to his lawyer, Gerry Spence. "I’ve learned something about the system," he told Spence. "This is a good system. This system will work."

I don't even know what to think about that.

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[mr2mk1g 10]

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Maye's family terminated his trial attorney after he was convicted. In her place, they hired a guy from California with no legal experience who convinced them that he'd had bad representation (given his lawyer's closing argument, he was probably on to something). The new fellow has since failed on several occasions to file the proper appeals.

This is a classic example of where the US legal system is letting itself down by only providing a bare minimum of legal representation to those in society accused of the most serious crimes.

If you want to have the death penalty you really must ensure the defendant has at least a competent lawyer. How else can there be any confidence in the verdict whatsoever?

At present, the US is a world wide charity case receiving aid in the form of legal assistance from across the globe for death row inmates such as this individual, who are unable to obtain competent domestic legal advice because the system will ruin their career.

It should be a national shame. Visit http://www.amicus-alj.org/ for information on how you can ensure individuals such as this man can be provided with at least competent legal representation when their case is heard.

[EricTheRed 0]

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Is the part I don't understand. The death penalty symbolizes ALL that is wrong with the criminal justice system.

If we accept that as a postulate, how does removing the symbol of error fix the error?

illegible usually

[kallend 2,151]

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Is the part I don't understand. The death penalty symbolizes ALL that is wrong with the criminal justice system.

If we accept that as a postulate, how does removing the symbol of error fix the error?

So you think we should allow a faulty system to keep killing people as it makes a good symbol for reform?

Illinois has studied this in more detail than any other state, and two governors now have declined to allow any executions. The American death penalty system is beyond fixing.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 2,151]

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But as far as I'm concerned, it's not the death penalty that's the problem,

Is the part I don't understand. The death penalty symbolizes ALL that is wrong with the criminal justice system.

To you, John, not to me.

If you had said "the improper implementation of the death penalty," I'd have agreed with you.

rl

How would you fix the system, RL?

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[RhondaLea 4]

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How would you fix the system, RL?

I'd rewrite the law from scratch. I would throw out all the laws that relate to victimless and other non-crimes, which would take a lot of pressure off the system. I'd throw out the drug laws and replace them with stiffer penalties for DUI. I would not make a lot of exceptions during the penalty phase for prior quality of life. I don't care what kind of childhood someone had; it doesn't justify them doing harm to others.

The sociopathic killers would go straight to death row...but only for a very brief time. For all other crimes, restitution would be mandatory.

I would also insist that the law recognize that a mental illness is no different than a physical illness and that psychiatrists start acting like members of the medical profession instead flakes. Many of the problems with mental health today stem from the manipulation of diagnoses for the benefit of the legal system. We're well beyond the point of lumping bi-polars with schizophrenics and we should be beyond the point of characterizing freely elected warped behavior as mental illness. A personality disorder is not a free pass. A mental illness needs treatment. I don't really know what to do with the dually-diagnosed, but I guess we'll figure something out.

We have so many exceptions and loopholes that the whole thing has become no more than a game between all the members of the legal system. It has nothing to do with the truth, it has nothing to do with justice. And someone who is charged with a crime doesn't get their life back just because they're found innocent.

If I thought there were a prayer in the world that someone would listen to me, I'd work it out a whole lot more completely and submit it somewhere. What we have right now is broken.

rl

Edited to add: We have the technology to ensure that the innocent will not be put to death. We just have to use it. And we also have to see to it that local prejudices do not influence convictions in the absence of good evidence. We're going to have to fire a lot of judges. Not all, but a lot.

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[kallend 2,151]

OK, but what if a really heinous crime is committed and the evidence of guilt is adjudged to be "beyond reasonable doubt" but not "beyond all doubt" because technology doesn't always provide the data. And the key eyewitnesses gave testimony in exchange for a plea bargain. What then?

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[AlexCrowley 0]

Save the sociopath!

TV's got them images, TV's got them all, nothing's shocking.

[RhondaLea 4]

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OK, but what if a really heinous crime is committed and the evidence of guilt is adjudged to be "beyond reasonable doubt" but not "beyond all doubt" because technology doesn't always provide the data. And the key eyewitnesses gave testimony in exchange for a plea bargain. What then?

If we can't really be sure that someone committed the crime, John, I don't see how we can kill him. You're going to have to be a little more specific, because if we can't kill him, we can't very well lock him up either.

On the other hand, in my new courtrooms there will be no plea bargains in exchange for eyewitness testimony.

Eyewitness testimony is one of the least compelling forms of evidence there is.

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[RhondaLea 4]

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Save the sociopath!

Put a lid on it, Alex.

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[rehmwa 2]

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Save the sociopath!

Put a lid on it, Alex.

Yes, put lids on ALL the sociopaths!!

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[kallend 2,151]

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OK, but what if a really heinous crime is committed and the evidence of guilt is adjudged to be "beyond reasonable doubt" but not "beyond all doubt" because technology doesn't always provide the data. And the key eyewitnesses gave testimony in exchange for a plea bargain. What then?

If we can't really be sure that someone committed the crime, John, I don't see how we can kill him. You're going to have to be a little more specific, because if we can't kill him, we can't very well lock him up either.

On the other hand, in my new courtrooms there will be no plea bargains in exchange for eyewitness testimony.

Eyewitness testimony is one of the least compelling forms of evidence there is.

rl

That, of course, means that a lot of actually guilty parties will go free just so you can execute those that are guilty beyond all doubt.

I think it better to keep the current standard of proof, and give life imprisonment. Then if contrary evidence comes along the sentence is reversible.

My position is this:

It is immoral and unethical to execute someone unless guilty beyond ALL doubt.

Applying that standard of proof is and always will be impractical except in a tiny handful of cases. Even a confession is not proof, as we have seen in many instances. So a lot of the most heinous would have to be released or adjudicated according to a lower standard where CP is not an option.

Having a different sentences according to the quality of the evidence rather than the nature of the crime is clearly unconstitutional.

Raising the standard of proof would put a lot more murderers back on the streets - not exactly a great social goal.

It's because of issues like this that 2 successive IL governors have declared a moratorium.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[artistcalledian 0]

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That is soooo fucked up...

It does seem like it was self defense in panic mode. Many people with a gun by their bedside might do the same thing.

Sounds like he got railroaded...

if he hadn't had a gun beside his bed, then this wouldn't have happened... nice gun culture

________________________________________
drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police

[Gravitymaster 0]

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This is a classic example of where the US legal system is letting itself down by only providing a bare minimum of legal representation to those in society accused of the most serious crimes.

Then perhaps the solution is to raise the standards for a legal degree or the standards to pass the Bar Exam. Too many lawyers in the US as it is. This would alleviate 2 problems.

[AlexCrowley 0]

shut up Ian. Studies have proved that having a gun and shooting someone with it is no different than not having a gun and not shooting someone with it.

TV's got them images, TV's got them all, nothing's shocking.

[RhondaLea 4]

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I think it better to keep the current standard of proof, and give life imprisonment. Then if contrary evidence comes along the sentence is reversible.

I think some of us take comfort in the idea that imprisonment is reversible, whereas death is not.

I don't think that locking up the innocent is any better than putting them to death. In some ways, it may be worse.

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My position is this:

It is immoral and unethical to execute someone unless guilty beyond ALL doubt.

It is immoral and unethical to punish someone unless they are guilty beyond all doubt.

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Applying that standard of proof is and always will be impractical except in a tiny handful of cases.

Not anymore. And if we stop prosecuting the non-crimes, we'll have the resources to devote to the true crimes.

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Raising the standard of proof would put a lot more murderers back on the streets - not exactly a great social goal.

What you're really saying is that you want to have your cake and eat it too. "We're not convinced that you're guilty enough to kill, but we don't want to take the chance that you might be and let you loose. If we find out you are innocent later, we'll let you out, and fuck all for the carnage we have made of your life."

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It's because of issues like this that 2 successive IL governors have declared a moratorium.

Bully for them. As a practical matter, it's meaningful, because it has consequences. As an ethical matter, it's just crap.

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb