artistcalledian 0 #1 December 9, 2005 who do you think would have won a contest if Ali had fought Tyson, both of them at their prime? Ali to me, was not only the best fighter to have ever boxed, he was also one of the most influential black activists of the 60's. The man was a true ledgend________________________________________ drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BillyVance 35 #2 December 9, 2005 I believe Ali would have at least "outlasted" Tyson. Tyson had a helluva knockout punch, but many of his fights never lasted more than a few rounds so I don't think he had the stamina to go 15... Ali did, and he'd do it better than anybody."Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
artistcalledian 0 #3 December 9, 2005 i agree, i've watched all of tysons early fights 86 - 90 and he could just walk through his opponents and then knock then out with a single punch.... if plan A failed, he was stuck... which showed in some of his later fighst, he had no plan B to fall back on. Anything after round 5 was new territory for him... he was lost if they were still on their feet in the second half of a fight________________________________________ drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #4 December 9, 2005 Not sure but Tyson is an animal, hide's pain really well But maybe the young Ali was more skilful. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BillyVance 35 #5 December 9, 2005 QuoteBut maybe the young Ali was more skilful. Yup! "Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee" nobody did it better"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #6 December 9, 2005 Ali all the way. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,150 #7 December 10, 2005 Ali, just like he destroyed Sonny Liston, another thug.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 7 #8 December 10, 2005 Quote Ali, just like he destroyed Sonny Liston, another thug. *** Phantom Punch? ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BillyVance 35 #9 December 10, 2005 QuoteQuote Ali, just like he destroyed Sonny Liston, another thug. *** Phantom Punch? I wonder if Sonny is the one that quit? Did he just spit out his mouthpiece before the next round? I can't remember, just trying to visualize what the movie "Ali" showed..."Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveorino 7 #10 December 10, 2005 Not sure of the movie, but in reallife there were two fights. In the first (phantom punch) fight Ali knocked him down. I believe he connected, but that is just my opinion. In the second fight Liston could not answer the bell in a later round. Ali vs Tyson? A young Ali all the way!! He outlasted big punchers like a Foreman in his prime and Liston. He took punches well too (remember all the Frazier fights) steveOrino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likearock 2 #11 December 10, 2005 Quote Ali vs Tyson? A young Ali all the way!! He outlasted big punchers like a Foreman in his prime and Liston. He took punches well too (remember all the Frazier fights) Actually, when Ali fought Foreman I'd say Ali was past his prime. No one really can be sure just how much he lost after his 3-year Vietnam War suspension. But let me be the one person to suggest that Tyson might win. Everyone points to Foreman and Liston as similar examples because of their power and agression. However, Tyson had something else that they did not have - incredible hand speed. And since Ali relied so much on his own speed (both hand and foot ), he might not have been able to overcome Tyson's assault as easily as he did with Foreman. But I do agree that in order for Tyson to have won that fantasy fight, he'd have to do it by early knockout. Endurance was never his strong suit, even in his prime. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
artistcalledian 0 #12 December 10, 2005 I've watched some of Ali's early fights (when he was Cassius Clay) and his footwork was out of this world. I think the only time he looked in trouble and almost lost it was to Henry Cooper in 1966. To me, Ali was the greatest showman of all time, he had the confidence than never turned to arrogance. I could listen to him speaking all day I don't think Tyson raped Desiree Washington either, just what the hell did that stupid woman think she was going up to his room for? tea and biscuits? i think she willingly shagged him and then cried rape to get some money and fame. OK, Tyson isn't Albert Einstein, but he's no rapist either. The biggest wanker in boxing is Don King, the man is a murderer ________________________________________ drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 7 #13 December 10, 2005 But I do agree that in order for Tyson to have won that fantasy fight, he'd have to do it by early knockout. Endurance was never his strong suit, even in his prime. *** I think you have it there... In HIS prime NO ONE could stand toe to toe with Tyson... And it would be a matter of whether Ali's footwork could keep him away for 5-6 rounds. Ail, definitely the 'smarter' fighter... ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BillyVance 35 #14 December 11, 2005 QuoteThe biggest wanker in boxing is Don King, the man is a murderer And I will cheer the day that SOB dies... "Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Richards 0 #15 December 19, 2005 Both were actaully over-rated. In his pre-ban career Ali fought guys like Floyd Patterson who was over the hill and Archie Moore (WHO WAS 50). With the exception of liston and zora folley he did not really challenge himself. Henry Cooper (a brit) almost beat cassius clay but for some crafty corner work by angelo dundee. Tyson fought nobody important (trevor berbick, tony tubbs, an over the hill Larry holmes and an overblown light heavy(micheal spinks)). Therefore it is hard to say howevr Ali did show more ability to handle adversity than Tyson so in apinch Ali would be better prepared to overcome an ugly fight where tyson might crumble psychologically. Ali by KO in round 11. Richards My biggest handicap is that sometimes the hole in the front of my head operates a tad bit faster than the grey matter contained within. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #16 December 19, 2005 Each in their primes? Ali. Tyson in his prime used to win the same way Foreman in his prime used to win: overwhelm and mug them with sheer brute force. That's how Foreman beat Frazier & took the title from him, to everyone's shock, at the time. But remember (or for the younger of you, do you know of) the "rope-a-dope" Ali used to beat Foreman and take the title (back) from him? He let Foreman punch himself exhausted for several rounds, and then, finally, moved in for the kill. Ali in his prime would have done the same thing to Tyson. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
funks 1 #17 December 19, 2005 Ali's daughter would fuck them both up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RossDagley 0 #18 December 20, 2005 Quote Ail, definitely the 'smarter' fighter... Personally, I wouldn't describe calling Frazier (during the early 70's) "Uncle Tom", or in his public workouts portraying Frazier as a gorilla desperately seeking lost bananas, or dressing in a rubber gorilla suit as particually 'smart'. Ali tried to play the whole 'race' card with Frazier describing him as a 'poor mans negro' etc. Hes no angel... To quote Floyd Patterson - "Cassius Clay is disgracing himself and the Negro race. No decent person can look up to a champion whose credo is "hate whites." Equally, raping teenagers isn't all that smart, granted. Right Mike? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
artistcalledian 0 #19 December 20, 2005 QuoteEqually, raping teenagers isn't all that smart, granted. Right Mike? i don't believe he raped her, what did she think she was going to do in the bedroom of the current undisputed world heavy weight boxing champion? play chess? she probably had consentual sex and then decided to cash in and cry rape________________________________________ drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RossDagley 0 #20 December 20, 2005 Quoteshe probably had consentual sex and then decided to cash in and cry rape Although technically he was charged with rape, I totally agree with you - I was just using that to counter my 'boxers aren't angels' arguement Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
