Those kookie Iranians...

[shropshire 0]

Then, please kindly explain why the emphasis is on a preceived (really low risk - in many respects) problem instead of the much more costly in terms of deaths caused?
If our governments carried out policies truely based upon cost/benefit analysis they would ignore terrorism and go after the Really Big problems in the world.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[IanHarrop 43]

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It's silly to assume that the Islam supports terrorism because fringe elements, or even whole nations, do so in its name.

I didn't assume, I asked a question in a previous post relating to a statement he made about Islam and he chose not to answer it. I was simply pointing out that he had not answered the question.

For reference, here is the original question.

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If we take what you say as true, that Islam accepts all religions, then where did this martyr thing come from? Does it have roots in Islamic teaching or not?

"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy

[Mike111 0]

Smoking has been around for years and years - people are used to tis effects and we see people smoek all the time - pubs restaurants etc etc so it appears normal.

Getting attacked by a terrorist bomb is London is rather unusual and not an everyday occurrence so appears more drastic, hence why the more panic over it.

The media to - smoknig isn't really that much of a story say to a bomb blast - thast why.

That is probably why the government does it - (a) cheaper, (b) satisfies the public more.

[SudsyFist 0]

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I didn't assume,

My bad. I was focusing on the "...at this time it only appears to be Islam that promotes it."

[Mike111 0]

All i can help you on that is that martydom isn't a recent thing i don't think, maybe the times of the crusades or something but not modern.

[shropshire 0]

<>

wow you must be young
and it was around on the UK Mainland way before the Americans took any interesting it at all

Terrorism has been around WAY longer than smoking!!


and the cluster-fuck (a great American saying) is (a) Not Cheap (b) the polls would suggest that the UK public is NOT at all satified... but yet Tone and the Monkey man still follow their own (and their bezzy corporate mates) agenda(s).

Regards,

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[Darius11 12]

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I still don't understand the martyr thing and at this time it only appears to be Islam that promotes it. Something about a bunch of virgins waiting for martyrs in heaven. (Doesn't say much about Islam's value of women either but that's another discussion)

It is hard to generalize all suicide bombers in the same category.


As I have said before I don’t see the difference between when an Israeli fighter jet bombs and kills children and inocent civilians and when a suicide bomber blows up a bus. They are both using the weapons that are available to them. Islam talks about martyrs if you are a martyr you will go to heaven, and in Heaven you have all the things you would want. They also believe there are men (think chip and dales but tan) for woman in heaven as well.


Islam and Mohammed were considered feminist for their time and in Iran woman have most of the rights as men do. Woman can drive, vote, hold office, and more then 50% of university students are Woman. They are freer then all other Islamic states not nearly as free as woman in the United States or Europe.

As for the treatment of woman. The woman I have talked to family and friends (we are not a very religious family) most do not envy the woman in America, and if they have to choose between wearing a scarf to cover there hair then being objectified like the woman here most will choose the scarf.

I think the biggest problem we have in America is we tend to think every one in the world wants to be like us and have the life we have, the truth is that is not the case. Many of the women believe in Islam and want to follow its teachings. It is a different culture. Here it is considered funny and hot when a girl flashes her boobs for extra altitude in Iran it will not be viewed that way. It is viewed as being objectified and being cheep. Being able to use your sexuality is not considered a talent using your mind and soul is.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[Mike111 0]

With the IRA yer, but this is differerent in some way.Sorry i should have made that clear.

It is differnet because it has the potential to much worse - 9/11? thousands dead. Iraw - only 30 generally at a time - thats still a terrible loss of life but after 9/11 i think it has more weight than say the IRA bombs.

The Al Aqadea terrorists are more ruthless at the mometn ti appears, although I could very well be wrong.

least we agree on the labour govt is shit - well most polls shows dissatiffiaction but not the extent to which they are discontented.

[shropshire 0]

Yeah... this is different this ntime cuz it affects the Americans.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[artistcalledian 0]

Quote

<>

wow you must be young
and it was around on the UK Mainland way before the Americans took any interesting it at all

Terrorism has been around WAY longer than smoking!!


and the cluster-fuck (a great American saying) is (a) Not Cheap (b) the polls would suggest that the UK public is NOT at all satified... but yet Tone and the Monkey man still follow their own (and their bezzy corporate mates) agenda(s).

Regards,

i'm old enough to remember the IRA and their bombing campaign on mainland England.... and i also remember America allowing the irish in New York to make collections for the IRA through Noraid... America conveniently forgets about that, but as soon as they get atacked themselves on home soil, a futile, and unwinable gesture has to be made, and a war on terror is announced

why the fuck did they allow the paddys in new york to fund the IRA during the seventies and early eighties? two faced or what !

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drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police

[shropshire 0]

<11/9 i think it has more weight than say the IRA bombs. >> - unless you were in, say the Birmingham pubs...... But my argument still stands - the actual danger for a terrorist attack in miniscule in real terms.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[shropshire 0]

Ian, I cannt really answer that .... but one guess... Politics ( the so called Irish vote is big and any politician would be mad too upset that particular apple-cart!)

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[Mike111 0]

agreed its miniscule. definately.
Which is a good thing!!!

lol we are never gonna win on this one!!!

[artistcalledian 0]

over 2,400 people lost their lives due to the troubles in Northern Ireland.... even American servicemen who just flew over northern ireland got a medal for it, as they classed it as a war zone (typical of the yanks)

so, to me.. ireland and its problems is just as important as what happened on 9/11. except the Americans allowed the Irish to send money back to Ireland.

During the 70's, the IRA bought most of its weapons from American arms dealers...with money raised in America

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drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police

[Mike111 0]

Don't get me wrong, im not slagging Islam off at all. There are many valuable points in it which we can take examples from and follow and set a standard. Many, many points, its just IMHo, covering women up whether they want it or not is backward.

But if they wanna follow it, that is their choice.

[shropshire 0]

As you so rightly say, we're never going to win this one..... whilst we're trying to! It's not that kind of fight...... Also, maybe we're facing the wrong way.. looking out when we should be looking in (perhaps).

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[kelpdiver 2]

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America is one of the msot fundamentalist Christian countries, wouldn't you agree?

in what way at all is America a fundamentalist Christian nation, nevermind one of the most in the world?

the greatest extent religion appears to play in our policy is that when a Republican is in the white house, we tend to discourage birth control/abortion programs in the third world.

Iraq certainly wasn't invaded because of religion. And it wasn't attack 4 years ago because of religion either.

[Mike111 0]

Ok set aside from this matter, which govt would you vote for instead of labour?

Please dont say BNP!!!!

"lets agree to disagree"

[shropshire 0]

Haaaa << Please dont say BNP!!!! >> Jezz no, not them nutters.

My voting follows U.K center lines (fence sitting? wasteful? pehaps for now)

TaRah,

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[artistcalledian 0]

BNP

they are the only party who will tackle the problem of immigration in this country

In blackburn, the asian population is 74%, in bradford its similar... in leicester, its 65 % you can feel like a stranger in your home land. it would be ok, if the incoming minorities integrated, or at least wanted to integrate, but they don't

they set up their own little ghettos and show racism to the whites of this country. they demand we alter out laws to accomodate their religeon, and generally mess up the economy

its about time this governemnt stopped the world and his dog coming into this country, before its too late

yes, in a perfect wrold we would all live in harmoney, but stop dreaming and face reality, its never going to happen because of attitude from all races

we need to stop pandering to the pink shirted liberals, and get tough on immigration

________________________________________
drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police

[shropshire 0]

Ian.... behave yourself

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[Mike111 0]

Agreed there are problems with the immigration, bu the BNP are just mad.

Absolte fucking nutters. Thats one flaw with democrayc - allowing people like them into politics!

[artistcalledian 0]

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Ian.... behave yourself

i see too many people on here who post views that are conforming to how the majority of posters on here post. Almost as if the liberal, suedo intelligent members dictate how the rest have to be politically correct all the time

fuck them, i call a spade, a spade... what i say is often true, but the pc brigade on here don't like it because i don't dress it up in a skirt to make it more palletable

________________________________________
drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police

[shropshire 0]

Hi,

It's a perception, based upon a lot of news articles... Most other Christian countries do not seem to bang on about it quite as much as the US does (recently).

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[kelpdiver 2]

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It's a perception, based upon a lot of news articles... Most other Christian countries do not seem to bang on about it quite as much as the US does (recently).

I actually live here and I'm still not sure what you're talking about. Current Administration makes a lot of references to god, but that has little to do with fundamentalism. The very word tends to imply a particular sect, whereas Christianity emcompasses a rather diverse lot. The Mormons might be the only relevent body that could qualify as fundamentalist as they spend their efforts lobbying for gay marriage bans.