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freeflir29

Why we are in Iraq.........or one of 5000 reasons

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If "doing good" to people is all you care about, how about letting african countries purchase AIDS medicines at affordable prices? That is not being done now because the big companies are earning too much money. Can't see how the government should be unable to fix that. This is just one example...



I think you really mean give it away, don't you. Why do they have aids? All they have to do is not have sex. What does that cost.....nothing.



Yes, a culture which does not promote abstinence while enforcing the subsurvience of women can be turned around just like that. :S

Why don't you google "Africa dry sex" for starters.

What a simplistic idea for a very complex problem.
Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

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>
a) originally support said genocide because it's politically convenient
b) later oppose it for political reasons and
c) then start killing people at about the same rate

then you don't really have the moral high horse.



I love this "but we're really hypocrits" argument. We have two extremely polarized political parties which change power on average every 10 years. Yet there is outrage that conflicting policies occur over time (let alone under constantly changing world views).

In practice, it translates to an isolationist policy in the end because things change and we 'wouldn't want do something in conflict with an action from 30 years ago'.

Do nothing, hide in the corner.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

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>In practice, it translates to an isolationist policy . . . .

That's right. I'd be in favor of a military isolationist policy. We should use our military to defend the USA, not to implement policy decisions or try to mold the world into a more favorable shape.

>Do nothing, hide in the corner.

As simplistic as your policy, which (to use your angle) is kill everyone then claim we are the good guys.

(See how fun that is?)

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>
a) originally support said genocide because it's politically convenient
b) later oppose it for political reasons and
c) then start killing people at about the same rate

then you don't really have the moral high horse.



I love this "but we're really hypocrits" argument. We have two extremely polarized political parties which change power on average every 10 years. Yet there is outrage that conflicting policies occur over time (let alone under constantly changing world views).

In practice, it translates to an isolationist policy in the end because things change and we 'wouldn't want do something in conflict with an action from 30 years ago'.

Do nothing, hide in the corner.



Isolationism tends to go with my idea of small federal government. While not practical in today's world, I would like seeing less US military presence in the world. I don't want us to be the police anymore.

mmmm, pipe dreams taste like sasparilla.
Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

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I think you really mean give it away, don't you. Why do they have aids? All they have to do is not have sex. What does that cost.....nothing.



Ohh is that the answer...aesome..so tell me, why do you guys keeping having these discussion about abortion and teen pregnancy? All you have to do is not have sex. Like you said, doesn't even cost anything.

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? All you have to do is not have sex.



Do you really believe this is a feasable solution on a large scale? Humans have a natural tendency to have sexual intercouse. It is an instinctive enjoyment to promote the survival of the species. To believe that everyone in a large sample of any population can repress that instinct is not only naive. Large scale abstinence is a biological impossiblity.

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So your message is? Keep messing around and procreate as bunnies folks!!! Doesn't matter if anyone has kids thay can't feed. People not longer should be held accountable for their actions...:P
"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

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>Why do they have aids? All they have to do is not have sex. What
>does that cost.....nothing.

Now that's out of the box thinking! We could apply that in a lot of places.

Katrina victims? Just don't drown.
Drunk driving? Don't drive drunk. Problem solved.
Obesity epidemic? Don't eat.
Schizophrenia? Stop acting like a freak.
Drive by shootings got you down? Just duck.

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So your message is? Keep messing around and procreate as bunnies folks!!! Doesn't matter if anyone has kids thay can't feed. People not longer should be held accountable for their actions...:P



This conversation is not about too many kids. It is about AIDS.

Apparently, you have NO concept of many African societies and their attitudes on abstinence, sex, protection, and women.

Like I said, google "African dry sex" for just a taste.

Telling them to "stop that" and expecting it to work is like telling Americans to stop driving their cars. Not easily done.
Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

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So your message is? Keep messing around and procreate as bunnies folks!!! Doesn't matter if anyone has kids thay can't feed. People not longer should be held accountable for their actions...:P



This conversation is not about too many kids. It is about AIDS.

Apparently, you have NO concept of many African societies and their attitudes on abstinence, sex, protection, and women.

Like I said, google "African dry sex" for just a taste.

Telling them to "stop that" and expecting it to work is like telling Americans to stop driving their cars. Not easily done.



You must be a mind reader of some sort, as I do not see Africa anywhere in my posts, nor was close in the context to what it was made.

Perhaps you would like to do a google search on "overpopulation" and you will be amazed at the birth rates in the Africa continent.

A whole shitload of attitude worldwide should change, my point of view was strictly in reference to the fact that if you can't support your children, then you shouldn't have a few dozen of them.

So, do you think people should not be accountable/responsible for the choices they make?

Apparently you have no concept of what responsibility means.
"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

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your childish reply tells me one thing: you have no real arguments left...





Nahhh...........it just means that I am well aware that this could be argued until I am dead and gone and never really solved. The fact is.........we are here. About now it makes no difference HOW we got here. We just have to stick it out and fix it as best we can. The world is a crazy place with a lot of bad people and a lot of good. :S For the isolationists out there..........isn't that how we got into WWI and how we had such a hard fight in WWII?

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And you should promote responsibility for one's own actions. Help, yes indeed, but you are dismissing the actual facts that corruption/lack of education/failed aid efforts/scam is one of the problems for the needy to actually get their hands on the relief.

Why are so many children hungry? Promotion of effective means of birth control apparently have failed, also billions of dollars in helping the aids cause, or to attempt to stop the spreading also have failed.

Is it the news, the corrupt governments in those places? something's got to give at some point.
"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

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This conversation is not about too many kids. It is about AIDS.

Apparently, you have NO concept of many African societies and their attitudes on abstinence, sex, protection, and women.

Like I said, google "African dry sex" for just a taste.

Telling them to "stop that" and expecting it to work is like telling Americans to stop driving their cars. Not easily done.



You must be a mind reader of some sort, as I do not see Africa anywhere in my posts, nor was close in the context to what it was made.

Perhaps you would like to do a google search on "overpopulation" and you will be amazed at the birth rates in the Africa continent.

A whole shitload of attitude worldwide should change, my point of view was strictly in reference to the fact that if you can't support your children, then you shouldn't have a few dozen of them.

So, do you think people should not be accountable/responsible for the choices they make?

Apparently you have no concept of what responsibility means.



Funny, because the situation in Africa and AIDS (tha abstinence was about prevention of the disease not children) is EXACTLY what we were talking about. Sorry I was under the asumption that you were following the conversation.

Yes, I believe in personal responsibility. But that does not negate the fact that CULTURAL traditions and ideals ingrained for YEARS in Africa have an effect on practices.

A woman who refuses sex there is often labeled a whore, ostracized, beaten, raped, killed, etc. A woman who wants to use protection is treated in a similar manner. It is a question of the man's manhood. A woman who is married is meant to please her husband and infidelity is common and not as looked down upon when it is done by a man. Now how exactly does a woman go about refusing to have sex when in that situation? The culture denies it.

Of course there is personal responsibility, but the IDEA of personal responsibilty is different depending on culture. And it takes more than just saying "Don't do that" to change a culture's mindset.

Honestly, to think that saying abstinence is the way to a culture such as Africa's is naive.
Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

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>In practice, it translates to an isolationist policy . . . .

That's right. I'd be in favor of a military isolationist policy. We should use our military to defend the USA, not to implement policy decisions or try to mold the world into a more favorable shape.

>Do nothing, hide in the corner.

As simplistic as your policy, which (to use your angle) is kill everyone then claim we are the good guys.

(See how fun that is?)



I agree with your first paragraph. But who defines what constitutes 'defend the USA' versus the other categories?

And it is great fun. Thanks for playing.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

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So in your vast an ample knowledge of the African continent (apparently you know all the countries in there) you state that the population in there, have this culture of raping women as a way of life.

Thank you very much for your blanket statement, I guess your point is that ALL the tribes and cultures over there, is just one, in unison.
"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

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>But who defines what constitutes 'defend the USA' versus the other categories?

Congress, who has the constitutional duty to declare war. In general, an attack against US soil would be followed by defense of said soil.



And many would say that 'defense' is not solely defined as a response to a physical homeland attack.

I like things cut and dried as much as you, but I don't agree with that particular line you draw in the sand.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

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>have this culture of raping women as a way of life.

They don't see it as raping. Heck, look at the US. 150 years ago women were essentially property; men could hit them without fear of reprisal, they weren't allowed to have jobs etc. In 1869 John Stuart Mill had the gall to write "the legal subordination of one sex to the other is wrong...and...one of the chief hindrances to human improvement." He got no end of grief for writing against the moral climate of the day. "In every respect the burden is hard on those who attack an almost universal opinion."

Does that mean that the US had a culture of beating women, made up of brutal misogynistic men? No more so than some African societies have a culture of raping women. It was simply societal norms dictating how people acted. It is essential to understand the culture when talking about what happens within it.

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>And many would say that 'defense' is not solely defined as
>a response to a physical homeland attack.

Right. On the one extreme we have defending ourselves against Pearl Harbor and 9/11, and on the other extreme we have Vietnam and Iraq. Congress is the one that should make that call. I hope they lean more towards the Pearl Harbor side than the Vietnam side in the future.

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So in your vast an ample knowledge of the African continent (apparently you know all the countries in there) you state that the population in there, have this culture of raping women as a way of life.

Thank you very much for your blanket statement, I guess your point is that ALL the tribes and cultures over there, is just one, in unison.



No, I did not say that. I only refer to africa because it is easier than stating every country in the Continent and their specific problems. Generally, people do not discuss AIDS as a problem of Zimbabwe or the Ivory Coast, but of the CONTINENT of Africa.

A poor choice of words perhaps, but you choose to interpret my words into something racist because it does not jive with your idea of "Just say no".

The idea of dominating woman DOES transcend tribal boundaries in many cases.

However, regardless of what you think, one of the common methods of AIDS transference is the subsurvience of women and the resulting lack of protection. The practice of Dry sex increases possibility fo transfer as well because of vaginal bleeding. This is a practice prevailent in sub-Sahara Africa, across cultural and country lines, where the AIDS problem is the greatest.
Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

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Promotion of effective means of birth control apparently have failed, also billions of dollars in helping the aids cause, or to attempt to stop the spreading also have failed.



What effective means are you referring to? I do don't see condoms promoted and made available in high schools in this country.

Much of our African foreign aid has strings attached requiring the promotion of abstinence. People have been having sex since, well, since we've been people (and before). Saying "don't do it" accomplishes nothing.

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