bodypilot90 0 #101 September 7, 2005 QuoteThey wouldn't come - you're not "the government"... LOL could be You know after the 2ed hurricane in central florida the men on our street went to each house seeing if everyone was ok, seeing if anyone needed anything. Chain saws were fired up and we cleared our street and the ones around it. All of that with out a single tax dollar. You take care of yourself, family and the "hood" All this with out anyone looting or shooting. what was it JFK said? "Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #102 September 7, 2005 Quotethen is it the uspa's fault? NO it's the dzo and the sta. Yup; there's a lot of blame to go round. There's even a good deal of blame for those jumpers with rigs. I just don't see it all the fault of the jumpers without rigs for not choosing to jump outa a plane without a parachute. Now I think we've fully exhausted that analogy... reality is far less confusing. BTW you do realise there's a lot of people on this board who would have shot you for "looting" a school bus right? Besides, at the time you're supposed to be stealing the bus, the storms not hit and nothing's flooded yet. I'd bet some of the people shooting at you wouldn't have thought the storm was going to be as bad as predicted and just think they're taking out some punk ass looter. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #103 September 7, 2005 QuoteQuotePlease define "they." city, parish and state Gov'ts The city and the parish and the state are closest and responsible for first response. It's like complaining about the uspa not doing anything about bad spots and a off student status skydiver getting killed for a off landing and finding out the gps was turned off. If the USPA had a systemin place, funded by skydivers, dessigned specifically to deal with bad spots, your metaphor would fit. As it is, it doesn't come close. Even though local gov'ts have (in some cases) dropped the ball, that is not justification for FEMA to screw up as badly as they did. I'm not quite sure why so many Bush supporters feel the hurricane/flood victims that were unable to get out are second class citizens unworthy of the same help that anyone else would get. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #104 September 7, 2005 QuoteThat's funny. I see images in my head now of a war room, generals hunkered down over a map decieding what to attack... One General says "I think one thing that you fail to grasp is that we do not have a long and storied history of dropping troops and equipment into 20 feet of water. Must be a dry place. No water or a very, very small likelyhood of water..." Dude delivering the coffee says, "Like a desert?" Yes! A Desert! Iraq here we come! Now that's funny! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #105 September 7, 2005 QuoteYup; there's a lot of blame to go round. There's even a good deal of blame for those jumpers with rigs. we agree for once QuoteNow I think we've fully exhausted that analogy not by a long shot, but go on QuoteBTW you do realise there's a lot of people on this board who would have shot you for "looting" a school bus right? Besides, at the time you're supposed to be stealing the bus, the storms not hit and nothing's flooded yet. I'd bet some of the people shooting at you wouldn't have thought the storm was going to be as bad as predicted and just think they're taking out some punk ass looter. not by a long shot, however if the bus was full of plasma tv's vcrs and jeans that might be different. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #106 September 7, 2005 Quotenot by a long shot, however if the bus was full of plasma tv's vcrs and jeans that might be different I would have put a lot of money down if anyone asked me to bet before the hurricane if people would have considered your suggestion theft. [not that it would have been terribly appropriate of course]. Imagine the scene: A NO resident is sat in his yard opposite the kiddies bus depo. He watches a guy wander over to a bus, smash in the door with a crow-bar and start to hotwire the thing. NO resident challenges the would-be-thief: "what in the hell do you think you're doing there boy?". "I gotta steal this bus - I got no car and the mayor says to get outa town". "too bad boy, should have thought about that before you were poor. Aint no one going to steel no kiddies bus from behind my yard [cocks shotgun]". "but I got no other form of transport, I'll die here in the floods". "too bad boy, better get on walking outta town now before the winds come" [thief tries to drive off anyway and promptly gets one twelfth of a pound of lead in his side] Cops turn up and congratulate the citizen for preventing a thief from steeling city property. Taking a bus might not seem too bad an idea in hindsight. At the time I bet there would have been plenty of people willing to shoot you dead for attempting to thieve from the city during an impending emergency. Even now with the benefit of hindsight there are people posting here who have stated they would shoot looters on sight, be they taking water, plasma TV’s or even busses. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #107 September 7, 2005 QuoteIf the USPA had a systemin place, funded by skydivers, dessigned specifically to deal with bad spots, your metaphor would fit. As it is, it doesn't come close The USPA has handled it with it in the SIM. If the DZO or the STA did not understand the SIM all they would have done is ask for help. The USPA (the fed) even called to ask if they needed help with spotting and was told "we need to think about it" QuoteI'm not quite sure why so many Bush supporters feel the hurricane/flood victims that were unable to get out are second class citizens unworthy of the same help that anyone else would get. Let me clear it up for you..... the people with out a ride are not to blame other thank perhaps a lack of creativity to "find" a way out. The mayor and the governor are much less innocent Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #108 September 7, 2005 QuoteThe USPA has handled it with it in the SIM So as long as lip service is paid then it's okay? Don't forget, skydivers that can spot without GPS are the exception these days. The USPA has done a whole lot to change that. If lip service is enough, as you imply, the city officials did enough by merely calling for the citizens to evacuate. I didagree, but that is consistent with your metaphor. Quote The people with out a ride are not to blame other thank perhaps a lack of creativity to "find" a way out. The mayor and the governor are much less innocent. Here we agree. I would go one step further and say that the federal goverment is even less innocent. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nate_1979 9 #109 September 7, 2005 QuoteQuotenot by a long shot, however if the bus was full of plasma tv's vcrs and jeans that might be different I would have put a lot of money down if anyone asked me to bet before the hurricane if people would have considered your suggestion theft. [not that it would have been terribly appropriate of course]. Imagine the scene: A NO resident is sat in his yard opposite the kiddies bus depo. He watches a guy wander over to a bus, smash in the door with a crow-bar and start to hotwire the thing. NO resident challenges the would-be-thief: "what in the hell do you think you're doing there boy?". "I gotta steal this bus - I got no car and the mayor says to get outa town". "too bad boy, should have thought about that before you were poor. Aint no one going to steel no kiddies bus from behind my yard [cocks shotgun]". "but I got no other form of transport, I'll die here in the floods". "too bad boy, better get on walking outta town now before the winds come" [thief tries to drive off anyway and promptly gets one twelfth of a pound of lead in his side] Cops turn up and congratulate the citizen for preventing a thief from steeling city property. Taking a bus might not seem too bad an idea in hindsight. At the time I bet there would have been plenty of people willing to shoot you dead for attempting to thieve from the city during an impending emergency. Even now with the benefit of hindsight there are people posting here who have stated they would shoot looters on sight, be they taking water, plasma TV’s or even busses. I dont buy that, especially considering near the first day of this mess when I read about the guy that *DID* steal a bus and got himself and a bunch of people the hell out of there. Who's gonna shoot someone over a damn school bus? At that point how far you think cops are gonna go to stop a stolen school bus? People had other shit to worry about. But, if only the city / state had followed plan then there wouldnt have been any busses to steal huh? FGF #??? I miss the sky... There are 10 types of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
slug 1 #110 September 7, 2005 QuoteQuoteThey wouldn't come - you're not "the government"... LOL could be You know after the 2ed hurricane in central florida the men on our street went to each house seeing if everyone was ok, seeing if anyone needed anything. Chain saws were fired up and we cleared our street and the ones around it. All of that with out a single tax dollar. You take care of yourself, family and the "hood" All this with out anyone looting or shooting. Chainsaws LMAO We grew up in a hood and din't own a hammer, or screw driver, car etc till we got into the "real world". Good for you guy's sticking togther, Things just didn't get bad enough, if they had people will do what comes natural. You think your above that. Good R.I.P. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nate_1979 9 #111 September 7, 2005 Quote Good for you guy's sticking togther, Things just didn't get bad enough, if they had people will do what comes natural. Natural for a bunch of punks, assholes, and cowards mabey. I dont think the way people responded is natural. FGF #??? I miss the sky... There are 10 types of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #112 September 7, 2005 QuoteImagine the scene: A NO resident is sat in his yard opposite the kiddies bus depo. He watches a guy wander over to a bus, smash in the door with a crow-bar and start to hotwire the thing. no smash needed the doors are all open, the streering isn't even locking. QuoteTaking a bus might not seem too bad an idea in hindsight a number of busses were, to bad it had to come to that. perhaps they will elect a mayor that can cope next time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #113 September 7, 2005 QuoteNatural for a bunch of punks, assholes, and cowards mabey. I dont think the way people responded is natural. Except it happens during most any major natural disaster in the world, which leads me to believe it is natural. I'm sure you have evidence to the contrary, right? Or just empty words? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #114 September 7, 2005 Quoteperhaps they will elect a mayor, Governor and President that can cope next time. Now it's fixed! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nate_1979 9 #115 September 7, 2005 Mabey we can have a better pool of potential presidents to choose from this time. FGF #??? I miss the sky... There are 10 types of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #116 September 7, 2005 QuoteI'm sure you have evidence to the contrary, right? yea it did not happen in Florida. It's called socialism, thinking the gov't owes you something, and the poverty pimps like Jesse Jackson trying to stir up class warfare Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #117 September 7, 2005 QuoteNow it's fixed! the best man won W2 get over it, I see now why you are afraid to say the locals dropped the ball. You are still upset that the better man won. Get over it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #118 September 7, 2005 Quoteyea it did not happen in Florida. It's called socialism, thinking the gov't owes you something, and the poverty pimps like Jesse Jackson trying to stir up class warfare If you think Florida last year was even remotely as bad as the Gulf Coast region this hurricane season, you were obviously not in FL last year. I was. Charly, Frances, Ivan and Jeane were minor inconveniences in comparison to Katrina. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #119 September 7, 2005 QuoteIt's called socialism, thinking the gov't owes you something, and the poverty pimps like Jesse Jackson trying to stir up class warfare What are you talking about? Since you brought it up, though, if I pay taxes to the government, I am owed services from the government. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #120 September 7, 2005 Quotethe best man won W2 get over it, I see now why you are afraid to say the locals dropped the ball. You are still upset that the better man won. Get over it. Have you noticed that it is the right that can't seem to let the elections go? I said nothing about Bush not being a legitimate election winner. I said he failed in this aspect of his job. Miserably. But I never brought up the election. Please stay on topic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #121 September 7, 2005 QuoteIf you think Florida last year was even remotely as bad as the Gulf Coast region this hurricane season, you were obviously not in FL last year. I was. Charly, Frances, Ivan and Jeane were minor inconveniences in comparison to Katrina. maybe you don't get out much, I have and I have lived in Florida for 20 years. Come to Sebastian and I'll show you. Getting hit by 2 hurricanes in a month is hardly minor. I alone had $50,000 worth of damage and have people on my street still in trailers. No looting here at all, unless you count fema claims in south florida and yes they should be shot. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #122 September 7, 2005 QuoteGetting hit by 2 hurricanes in a month is hardly minor. I said it was minor by comparison to Katrina. Having been hit by three of those four hurricanes last year, I know that compared to what Katrina did, Florida was minorly inconvenienced by hurricane season '04. How can you say otherwise with a straight face? I was there too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #123 September 7, 2005 they were major storm events is all I am saying w/o looting Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,146 #124 September 7, 2005 Quotethey were major storm events is all I am saying w/o looting Remind me, was 2004 an election year? Did FEMA pay off people in FL who provided no evidence of damage?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #125 September 7, 2005 Quotethey were major storm events is all I am saying w/o looting Or large scale evacuations. Which would definitely contribute to looting. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
