rhino 0 #76 September 6, 2005 QuoteExactly. A great many people are not halfway intelligent. true! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #77 September 7, 2005 Those that didn't leave didn't have any place to go. FEMA didn't set up evacuation shelters until _after_ Katrina hit.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #78 September 7, 2005 Quote Those that didn't leave didn't have any place to go. Not all of them. Some stayed behind that could have left. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyangel2 2 #79 September 7, 2005 QuoteQuote Those that didn't leave didn't have any place to go. Not all of them. Some stayed behind that could have left. Derek Some also stayed behind to protect their homes, stay with sick family members, stay with pets.....etc. I wonder if we'll ever see a graph with those numbers on it.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
slug 1 #80 September 7, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuote Those that didn't leave didn't have any place to go. Not all of them. Some stayed behind that could have left. Derek Some also stayed behind to protect their homes, stay with sick family members, stay with pets.....etc. I wonder if we'll ever see a graph with those numbers on it. Hi flyangel2 Your still #1 in my book. are you talking about a graph like a bell curve IMO There will be lots of graphs based on the data thats collected from Houston, Fema and the red cross and other NGRA's. Of course the people who choose to will just say the data is interesting, biased, skewed, politically motivated and all that stuff. It's a SC thing. R.I.P. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyangel2 2 #81 September 7, 2005 We know that a graph can be done to show what we "want" to see.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #82 September 8, 2005 Thirty bodies found in a NO nursing home today. Do we blame them for not leaving?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nate_1979 9 #83 September 8, 2005 QuoteThirty bodies found in a NO nursing home today. Do we blame them for not leaving? the local gov't ... as stated before. FGF #??? I miss the sky... There are 10 types of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #84 September 8, 2005 QuoteQuoteThirty bodies found in a NO nursing home today. Do we blame them for not leaving? the local gov't ... as stated before. No, you aren't paying attention. This thread is about blaming the victims.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nate_1979 9 #85 September 8, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteThirty bodies found in a NO nursing home today. Do we blame them for not leaving? the local gov't ... as stated before. No, you aren't paying attention. This thread is about blaming the victims. And in this case, you can not. FGF #??? I miss the sky... There are 10 types of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #86 September 8, 2005 Quote Thirty bodies found in a NO nursing home today. Do we blame them for not leaving? OK, one more time, since you don't listen too good. I m NOT blaming the victims for anything. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #87 September 8, 2005 QuoteNo, you aren't paying attention. This thread is about blaming the victims. No, you aren't paying attention. This thread is not about blaming the victims. This is thread is about the victims that could have left, chose to stay, and then complained about rescue/relief efforts. From my first post: "OK, some people couldn't for different reasons. What of the ones that could have and didn't? What of the ones that could have left and didn't that are now complaining about the poor response by FEMA?" I NEVER said it was their fault or that they deserved what they got. You keep saying I said that. Quote me where I said that. You can't, because I didn't. Keep trying to spin it Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BillyVance 35 #88 September 8, 2005 QuoteThirty bodies found in a NO nursing home today. Do we blame them for not leaving? I am sure they can check the personnel records in that nursing home, then track down the fuckers who abandoned their patients to save themselves, and throw their asses in jail. Could have been your grandmother in there for all we know."Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #89 September 8, 2005 Quote...I am sure they can check the personnel records in that nursing home, then track down the fuckers who abandoned their patients to save themselves, and throw their asses in jail. Could have been your grandmother in there for all we know. Bingo!!!! ....Hmmmmm...assuming that those people had no relatives or friends to help them, eh?My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Frenchy68 0 #90 September 8, 2005 QuoteQuoteThirty bodies found in a NO nursing home today. Do we blame them for not leaving? I am sure they can check the personnel records in that nursing home, then track down the fuckers who abandoned their patients to save themselves, and throw their asses in jail. Could have been your grandmother in there for all we know. Although at the emotional level, I would tend to share your feelings, I wonder if there are laws that would apply to this case. If so, would it apply to any local government official who fled the city while under a mandatory evacuation situation? I doubt it. It's not right, but probably not illegal. "For once you have tasted Absinthe you will walk the earth with your eyes turned towards the gutter, for there you have been and there you will long to return." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #91 September 8, 2005 Legality oftentimes takes a back seat to Morality in my book. If I was king.....My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BillyVance 35 #92 September 8, 2005 QuoteQuoteQuoteAlthough at the emotional level, I would tend to share your feelings, I wonder if there are laws that would apply to this case. If so, would it apply to any local government official who fled the city while under a mandatory evacuation situation? I doubt it. It's not right, but probably not illegal. You've got a point there... At the very least, I'd like to know if they can sleep at nights... I hope they have nightmares. "Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites flyangel2 2 #93 September 8, 2005 QuoteThirty bodies found in a NO nursing home today. Do we blame them for not leaving? No we don't blame them for not leaving. John, please go back and re-read what I have said.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Vallerina 2 #94 September 8, 2005 QuoteThis is thread is about the victims that could have left, chose to stay, and then complained about rescue/relief efforts. So, if a tragedy strikes, relief effort should be given by first distinguishing between who could've left and those who couldn't because they didn't have the means? My guess is that if the same tragedy happened in any major city, you would have about the same amount of people that could've left staying behind unless a better evacuation strategy is developed. I don't really see the point in saying, "Well, they could've left and didn't!" If it makes people feel better for saying it, well, whatever helps you sleep at night.There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Hooknswoop 19 #95 September 8, 2005 QuoteSo, if a tragedy strikes, relief effort should be given by first distinguishing between who could've left and those who couldn't because they didn't have the means? Um, no. If you are warned to leave, can leave, but chose not to, don't complain if releif efforts aren't perfect. They all deserve the same efforts to help them. QuoteMy guess is that if the same tragedy happened in any major city, you would have about the same amount of people that could've left staying behind unless a better evacuation strategy is developed. I don't really see the point in saying, "Well, they could've left and didn't!" If it makes people feel better for saying it, well, whatever helps you sleep at night. No, it pisses me off that those that chose to stay would then complain to rescue workers about their efforts. Please read what I wrote, carefully, not what you think I wrote. That is all I am saying, anything else just isn't there. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites lisamariewillbe 1 #96 September 8, 2005 QuoteMy guess is that if the same tragedy happened in any major city, I dont agree with this.... I do not live in a big city, but I live in GA, near FL and SC , all three states have great evac plans, that they put to use. There is also the accountibilty of the local govt to evac the ones who are not capable of doing so themselves. Just as NO had a plan. Whats the difference? NO didnt use their plan.Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites flyangel2 2 #97 September 8, 2005 QuoteNo, it pisses me off that those that chose to stay would then complain to rescue workers about their efforts. Please read what I wrote, carefully, not what you think I wrote. That is all I am saying, anything else just isn't there. Don't you love how many people have mis-read what you wrote?May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rhino 0 #98 September 8, 2005 QuoteSo, if a tragedy strikes, relief effort should be given by first distinguishing between who could've left and those who couldn't because they didn't have the means? The Mayor dropped the ball. He should have provided public transportation for anyone and everyone that didn't have their own ride. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites flyangel2 2 #99 September 8, 2005 The mayor even admitted that he could have done things different. When asked in an interview what he could have done different to help get people out, he said: "I'd yell louder next time." I have been asking myself, if I was put in that situation of living paycheck to paycheck, no car, no money, and all I own is in my house. Not to mention my dogs. I've lived there for years, and I've lived through some of the other hurricanes that have come through there. I've been told to get out, but I can't bring my pets. Would I have left? Who knows.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,147 #100 September 8, 2005 QuoteQuoteSo, if a tragedy strikes, relief effort should be given by first distinguishing between who could've left and those who couldn't because they didn't have the means? The Mayor dropped the ball. He should have provided public transportation for anyone and everyone that didn't have their own ride. How much public transportation would be required? Did NO have that much? If so, what would it be used for when evacuating a city is not going on? Can you imagine the screams from the right if every city went out and spent taxpayer money to provide public transportation for all the poor people in said city to be moved at once?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. 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flyangel2 2 #93 September 8, 2005 QuoteThirty bodies found in a NO nursing home today. Do we blame them for not leaving? No we don't blame them for not leaving. John, please go back and re-read what I have said.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vallerina 2 #94 September 8, 2005 QuoteThis is thread is about the victims that could have left, chose to stay, and then complained about rescue/relief efforts. So, if a tragedy strikes, relief effort should be given by first distinguishing between who could've left and those who couldn't because they didn't have the means? My guess is that if the same tragedy happened in any major city, you would have about the same amount of people that could've left staying behind unless a better evacuation strategy is developed. I don't really see the point in saying, "Well, they could've left and didn't!" If it makes people feel better for saying it, well, whatever helps you sleep at night.There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #95 September 8, 2005 QuoteSo, if a tragedy strikes, relief effort should be given by first distinguishing between who could've left and those who couldn't because they didn't have the means? Um, no. If you are warned to leave, can leave, but chose not to, don't complain if releif efforts aren't perfect. They all deserve the same efforts to help them. QuoteMy guess is that if the same tragedy happened in any major city, you would have about the same amount of people that could've left staying behind unless a better evacuation strategy is developed. I don't really see the point in saying, "Well, they could've left and didn't!" If it makes people feel better for saying it, well, whatever helps you sleep at night. No, it pisses me off that those that chose to stay would then complain to rescue workers about their efforts. Please read what I wrote, carefully, not what you think I wrote. That is all I am saying, anything else just isn't there. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lisamariewillbe 1 #96 September 8, 2005 QuoteMy guess is that if the same tragedy happened in any major city, I dont agree with this.... I do not live in a big city, but I live in GA, near FL and SC , all three states have great evac plans, that they put to use. There is also the accountibilty of the local govt to evac the ones who are not capable of doing so themselves. Just as NO had a plan. Whats the difference? NO didnt use their plan.Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyangel2 2 #97 September 8, 2005 QuoteNo, it pisses me off that those that chose to stay would then complain to rescue workers about their efforts. Please read what I wrote, carefully, not what you think I wrote. That is all I am saying, anything else just isn't there. Don't you love how many people have mis-read what you wrote?May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #98 September 8, 2005 QuoteSo, if a tragedy strikes, relief effort should be given by first distinguishing between who could've left and those who couldn't because they didn't have the means? The Mayor dropped the ball. He should have provided public transportation for anyone and everyone that didn't have their own ride. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyangel2 2 #99 September 8, 2005 The mayor even admitted that he could have done things different. When asked in an interview what he could have done different to help get people out, he said: "I'd yell louder next time." I have been asking myself, if I was put in that situation of living paycheck to paycheck, no car, no money, and all I own is in my house. Not to mention my dogs. I've lived there for years, and I've lived through some of the other hurricanes that have come through there. I've been told to get out, but I can't bring my pets. Would I have left? Who knows.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #100 September 8, 2005 QuoteQuoteSo, if a tragedy strikes, relief effort should be given by first distinguishing between who could've left and those who couldn't because they didn't have the means? The Mayor dropped the ball. He should have provided public transportation for anyone and everyone that didn't have their own ride. How much public transportation would be required? Did NO have that much? If so, what would it be used for when evacuating a city is not going on? Can you imagine the screams from the right if every city went out and spent taxpayer money to provide public transportation for all the poor people in said city to be moved at once?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
