Food for thought

[AlexCrowley 0]

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(And unless you can read Greek and Hebrew, you have only read altered versions.)

Actually even the early manuscripts available are simply copies of earlier books.

An interesting article on the KJV translation, with quotes from the team that performed it, can be found here: http://www.av1611.org/kjv/kjvhist.html

As you can see, it's not the sort of book I'd want to claim is the *exact* word of God.

TV's got them images, TV's got them all, nothing's shocking.

[Frenchy68 0]

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You can't compare that to Catholisism, when its clear that its referring to the Roman Catholic church. You offer no evidence that the any Catholic churches in Ireland have sponsored terrorism but yet you think we should all take your word for it. Here a little tidbit for you about the Roman Catholic church before I just give up on you. Its structured, as I have already said. A priest does not just do what he wants, he answers to a pastor, who does not just do what he wants but answers to a Bishop, and so on all the way up to the Pope.

Following your thought process, the Pope approved pedophilia? There are bad apples everywhere.

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They only reason, I have even responded to you is so that others reading who may not be politically correct witch-hunting fools won't be confused by your jibberish.

And I thank you for exposing him for what he is.

"For once you have tasted Absinthe you will walk the earth with your eyes turned towards the gutter, for there you have been and there you will long to return."

[waltappel 1]

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A horrendous idea,but I understand his viewpoint

Tom Tancredo states that we shouldn't rule out any scenario when it comes to dealing with Islamic extremism.........including retaliation on muslim sacred sites

http://www.denverpost.com/nationworld/ci_2869419

It occurred to me that it would be pretty cool if we could plant bombs in mosques and make it look absolutely credible that it was done by some sort of Islamic faction so that massive infighting could be ignited. Maybe they would leave the rest of the world alone.

Maybe not the most moral approach to the problem, but could be effective.

Walt

[Frenchy68 0]

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It occurred to me that it would be pretty cool if we could plant bombs in mosques and make it look absolutely credible that it was done by some sort of Islamic faction so that massive infighting could be ignited. Maybe they would leave the rest of the world alone.

Maybe not the most moral approach to the problem, but could be effective.

Actually, it's already happened between islamic factions.

"For once you have tasted Absinthe you will walk the earth with your eyes turned towards the gutter, for there you have been and there you will long to return."

[billvon 3,132]

>so that massive infighting could be ignited. Maybe they would leave
>the rest of the world alone.

You figure the more bombs there are, the more terrorism there is, the more people dying in suicide bombings - the safer we are? I would have to disagree. How many innocent people a year die from inter-gang wars here in the US?

[Steel 0]

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You can't compare that to Catholisism, when its clear that its referring to the Roman Catholic church. You offer no evidence that the any Catholic churches in Ireland have sponsored terrorism but yet you think we should all take your word for it. Here a little tidbit for you about the Roman Catholic church before I just give up on you. Its structured, as I have already said. A priest does not just do what he wants, he answers to a pastor, who does not just do what he wants but answers to a Bishop, and so on all the way up to the Pope.

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Following your thought process, the Pope approved pedophilia? There are bad apples everywhere.
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Exactly the point. Are you not aware of Catholic clergy men being dissmissed for pedophilia, because the the Catholic church is against this? Or do you just like playing word games because you have not facts to support your postion?

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[billvon 3,132]

Steel, you said:

>A priest does not just do what he wants . . .

so how do you explain the priests brought up on pedophilia charges? Weren't they 'just doing what they wanted?'

[waltappel 1]

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>so that massive infighting could be ignited. Maybe they would leave
>the rest of the world alone.

You figure the more bombs there are, the more terrorism there is, the more people dying in suicide bombings - the safer we are? I would have to disagree. How many innocent people a year die from inter-gang wars here in the US?

My thinking is along the lines of a war of attrition combined with a war where one side is fighting on numerous fronts, overwhelming its capacity to fight well on all fronts.

As inhumane as it sounds, I am totally ok with Muslim extremists spending all of their time killing other Muslim extremists. If that means throwing a few "innocent" Muslims in the mix, I'm ok with that if they are among the Muslims that have been silently standing by.

No matter how we fight terrorism, innocent people are going to die. If for no other reason, innocent people will die because that is simply what terrorists do--they kill innocent people.

I have no doubt that the US is also killing innocent people in its pursuit of terrorists and I like to think that most Americans, like me, are horrified by that. As a country, we damn sure don't want to be in the business of killing innocent people, whether they be women, children, or men.

I think the best solution is a strong belief by people of all persuasions that terrorists are evil and it is in everyone's interest to see that they are hunted down and killed. That means absolutely no asylum for terrorists by any person, group, or governement.

That doesn't seem to be happening, though, so it is going to get dirty.

By the way, I have no idea how many innocent people are killed by gangs fighting each other, but it is way to many.

Walt

[Steel 0]

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Steel, you said:

>A priest does not just do what he wants . . .

so how do you explain the priests brought up on pedophilia charges? Weren't they 'just doing what they wanted?'

Until it was discovered that he was doing something the Catholic religion was not in accordance with and dealt with him. Just like the would have dealt with him if it was something less severe like marrying homosexuals. Obviously nobody can predict what one specific person can do, but they can be dealt with if they are acting inappopiately.
And by the way for others that may question it. The most powerful religion in the world is the Roman Catholic Church. The Greek Catholic have their own Pope and I really don't think that the other sects are thought of when people just say Catholic. In other words, if somebody asked where is the "Capitol" of the Catholic religion? The most common answer would be the Vatican. Kind of like if you said you are American, people would associate you with the United States. Not Canadian, Mexican Brazilian, Nicaraguan, etc... Technically its not exactly accurate. But unfortunately when people say something in accurate. It can be repeated over and over again until finally even the dictionary can be edited to fit the newly "common meaning". I found this out recently and frankly was quite disturbed by it. Its kind of like how a word like "hispanic" original meant those or that which or who descended from Spain. But now if you look in the dictionary that has been moved to the 3 or 4 meaning at best because so many have associated the word with Latin America or speaking Spanish that dictionary's have been edited. So uneducated fools misusing words can change a language.

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[AlexCrowley 0]

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Until it was discovered that he was doing something the Catholic religion was not in accordance with and dealt with him.

Actually in Boston they knew exactly what the priests were doing yet Cardinal Law just put them in other parishes where they did it again, thats what the scandal was about. Read about it here: http://www.boston.com/globe/spotlight/abuse/

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And by the way for others that may question it. The most powerful religion in the world is the Roman Catholic Church.

Powerful? The most popular is Islam, followed by Catholicism. I can't argue about who's god is most powerful.

This is a red-herring argument Steel, you bought up Catholicism to argue that it was monolithic with a central authority. As someone with a Catholic yet not Roman catholic wife I mentioned other forms of Catholicism. Even if we concede Roman Catholicism is monolithic and not a good comparison to a decentralized Islam you have to agree that ALL Christian Sects are decended from Roman Catholicism and therefor all Christianity and its diversity == Islam and its various sects.

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Oh, The Greek Catholic have their own Pope

Actually they dont, they have a Patriach, Oriental Orthodox Catholics have their own Pope.

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..and I really don't think that the other sects are thought of when people just say Catholic. In other words, if somebody asked where is the "Capitol" of the Catholic religion? The most common answer would be the Vatican.

Being married to someone with a Maronite background I always think of other Catholic sects unless stated specifically. Again, Ad Ignorantum is not an excuse, just because you didnt know does not make it not exist. Popularity does not make your statement any more accurate, you made a statement that was not true.

Millions of people think Marconi invented the radio, that does not make it true.

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Kind of like if you said you are American, people would associate you with the United States. Not Canadian, Mexican Brazilian, Nicaraguan, etc... Technically its not exactly accurate.

No it isnt.

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It can be repeated over and over again until finally even the dictionary can be edited to fit the newly "common meaning". I found this out recently and frankly was quite disturbed by it. Its kind of like how a word like "hispanic" original meant those or that which or who descended from Spain. But now if you look in the dictionary that has been moved to the 3 or 4 meaning at best because so many have associated the word with Latin America or speaking Spanish that dictionary's have been edited. So uneducated fools misusing words can change a language.

Is this why you keep altering your argument each time you're caught on an inaccuracy or outright fallacy?

So far you've been inaccurate about islam, arabs, the IRA, the catholic church - its funding and structure, and most recently the Greek Pope and Catholicism being the most powerful religion.

Are you accusing the people who have corrected your errors as attempting to perform the BIG LIE technique on your posts?

Keep up the great work!!

TV's got them images, TV's got them all, nothing's shocking.

[Steel 0]

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Until it was discovered that he was doing something the Catholic religion was not in accordance with and dealt with him.

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Actually in Boston they knew exactly what the priests were doing yet Cardinal Law just put them in other parishes where they did it again, thats what the scandal was about. Read about it here: http://www.boston.com/globe/spotlight/abuse/
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Last I heard they were going after the Bishop because he was not doing anything about it. None the less it has not been swept under the rug at higher levels in the church.
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Powerful? The most popular is Islam, followed by Catholicism. I can't argue about who's god is most powerful.
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No as I said earlier Islam is further broken down into other sects. The Roman Catholic church is one entity an no other religion rivals in amount of followers. Even more so as you mentioned. Which is among the few accurate statements that you made. All other Christian religions branched off it.

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[Ron 10]

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The papacy:

Matthew 16:18 - And I also say unto thee, that thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it. (Catholics interpret "Peter" to mean "Peter and his successors i.e. the popes)

It seems only the Catholics take that interpretation....So just because the Catholics do it everyone else should? You would force YOUR vision of religion on others? Well Catholics have done that more than almost any other religion, so I guess it fits....But even that passage does not say there will be a Pope.

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The right to interpret it, from the Catholic Catechism:

"The task of interpreting the Word of God authentically has been entrusted solely to the Magisterium of the Church, that is, to the Pope and to the bishops in communion with him."

Matthew 16:18 does not say to create a Pope, and Catholics are not the only 'Christians'.

The whole catholic religion is shakey at best, and not founded on the Bible. A perfect example is the quote you used...Nowhere does it say to create a Pope.

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So why are you applying the same rules to both?

Im not, you are. You think the Bible should 'change'...But you have not been able to show anything IN THE BIBLE where it says it can be changed. You have shown how a religion based (sort of) on the Bible has said how it can change, but thats not IN the bible. The Constitution has IN IT a way to modify it...Something the Bible does not have.

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However, it _is_ the basis of a great many religions, and their interpretations of it are just as valid as yours.

When a religion goes directly against the bible to be popular, it distances itself from the source....When a religion makes its own rules against what the bible says...It is clearly no longer based on the bible.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[rehmwa 2]

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Steel, you said:

>A priest does not just do what he wants . . .

so how do you explain the priests brought up on pedophilia charges? Weren't they 'just doing what they wanted?'

Wow, just, wow.

This would only be analogous if the church either approved of the pedophilia or at least ignored the behavior (they did neither). It would also be equivalent if the left in this country, 'kind of' disagreed with it but still came out and noted that they understood why the priests did that and that we need to understand why they did it and how it's the fault of the US government historically and that we should leave the priests alone as it's their culture and we only want to punish the priests because of big business - it's about power and oil really.

I mean wow.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[AlexCrowley 0]

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This would only be analogous if the church either approved of the pedophilia or at least ignored the behavior (they did neither). .

Actually they did ignore it in Boston, check out the link above which links to the Pullitzer Prize winning exposes written by the Boston Globe, and shows how the Boston Diocese ignored the issue for decades.

From the article: "When the Rev. James Porter abuse cases became public in the early 1990s, and again in January 2002 when the Globe revealed the extent of Rev. John Geoghan's abusive behavior, Cardinal Bernard F. Law characterized these as isolated incidents. But as documents started flowing from the church in 2002 and more alleged victims came forward, it soon became clear that clergy abuse was, in fact, a systemic problem in the Boston Archdiocese, involving scores of priests and hundreds of victims across the metropolitan area.

For decades church leaders kept horrific tales of abuse out of the public eye through an elaborate culture of secrecy, decepetion, and intimidation. Victims who came forward with abuse claims were ignored or paid off, while accused priests were quietly transferred from parish to parish or sent for brief periods of psychological counseling. "

TV's got them images, TV's got them all, nothing's shocking.