bodypilot90 0 #1 July 17, 2005 How about a national photo Id card. You must have one to work, drive, vote, ect. Use of this is to prevent Illegal aliens from being able to make a living, to prevent employers from saying they didn't know. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AlexCrowley 0 #2 July 17, 2005 You do realize that this law was already (sort of) passed in the last couple of months, right? Attached as an addition to a military spending bill, the Real ID act will go into effect in 3 years. All your info will be kept on the magnetic stripe in your drivers license and any merchant or authority will be able to scan it - something tough to do currently because each state has a different format for the information stored on the license. Computer security experts are, understandably, concerned because this system is going to make it even easier for people to steal identities. http://news.com.com/FAQ+How+Real+ID+will+affect+you/2100-1028_3-5697111.html?tag=st.ref.goo What's going to be stored on this ID card? At a minimum: name, birth date, sex, ID number, a digital photograph, address, and a "common machine-readable technology" that Homeland Security will decide on. The card must also sport "physical security features designed to prevent tampering, counterfeiting, or duplication of the document for fraudulent purposes." Homeland Security is permitted to add additional requirements--such as a fingerprint or retinal scan--on top of those. We won't know for a while what these additional requirements will be. How will I get one of these new ID cards? You'll still get one through your state motor vehicle agency, and it will likely take the place of your drivers' license. But the identification process will be more rigorous. For instance, you'll need to bring a "photo identity document," document your birth date and address, and show that your Social Security number is what you had claimed it to be. U.S. citizens will have to prove that status, and foreigners will have to show a valid visa. State DMVs will have to verify that these identity documents are legitimate, digitize them and store them permanently. In addition, Social Security numbers must be verified with the Social Security Administration. ****[my addition: which is a horrible idea: choicepoint, lexis nexus, mastercard etc etc] Is this a national ID card? It depends on whom you ask. Barry Steinhardt, director of the American Civil Liberties Union's technology and liberty program, says: "It's going to result in everyone, from the 7-Eleven store to the bank and airlines, demanding to see the ID card. They're going to scan it in. They're going to have all the data on it from the front of the card...It's going to be not just a national ID card but a national database." At the moment, state driver's licenses aren't easy for bars, banks, airlines and so on to swipe through card readers because they're not uniform; some may have barcodes but no magnetic stripes, for instance, and some may lack both. Steinhardt predicts the federalized IDs will be a gold mine for government agencies and marketers. Also, he notes that the Supreme Court ruled last year that police can demand to see ID from law-abiding U.S. citizens. --------------------- Papers please. TV's got them images, TV's got them all, nothing's shocking. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #3 July 17, 2005 do you have a problem with that? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,175 #4 July 17, 2005 www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1048869#1048869 "Your papers pleeze"... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AlexCrowley 0 #5 July 17, 2005 A problem? I don't think enabling identity thieves is a positive, no. ID cards seem to work well in some european countries, and as an immigrant to the US I am expected to carry my identity card with me at all times, so I dont have any moral issues with the concept - although I realize many nationals do, and for obvious reasons considering the foundations of your society. The post 9/11 hysteria has calmed down somewhat (at least, the CNN footage of black clad Homeland Security officers asking 'citizens' for their papers during border training hasn't been shown since circa 2002.). The Real ID is a defacto end run around the whole national ID thing. Personally I wish people would look at the real gains an ID card would get them , if there are any, rather than bogus 'it will identify terrorists easier/illegals easier' something patently false considering each of the 9/11 hijackers had valid IDs and I know several immigrants with fake papers good enough to fool most employers. So my score: i) dont care I already have ID, ii) stop talking about terrorists, iii) Why make it so easy for identity thieves to steal everything about you? Simply digitizing that quantity of information makes it available for 'hackers' to steal. (would now be a time to mention the Russian mob, links to arms dealers and terrorism?), which in conclusion means: dont mind the constitutional issues, it's technologically a really bad idea and after more than a decade in computer security feel qualified to judge the issue accurately. TV's got them images, TV's got them all, nothing's shocking. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chutem 0 #6 July 17, 2005 I have a problem with more federal intervention in my life. What's the point of a national ID card if they don't arrest the "illegals" anyway. Here in AZ unless your close to the border most "illegals" just get detained for a little while (hours if that) then released. The Fed's won't come and get them. Some states want to give them food stamps and drivers licences. The laws and paperwork are already in place to do the job, all we need is somone to enforce it. I had to provide my license to a deputy the other day while I was working on my sons truck. He was looking for some dirtbag that used to live in the neighborhood and matched my physical description. (short white guy I guess) I handed him my license, he knew I was not the dirtbag in question, we BS'd a couple minutes and all was cool. It's easy enough to tell who should be here and who not if you can get in their wallets now, we don't need any more cards to carry. James Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Botellines 0 #7 July 17, 2005 Are you saying that it is not possible at the present time to tell which inmigrant is legal or ilegal? I don´t buy it, looks to me like a measure to appease the population, like something is being done. If you want to kick illegal inmigrants out (cheap labour force) you will need to convince your capitalist government and share holders to make a bit less of money. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #8 July 17, 2005 QuoteAre you saying that it is not possible at the present time to tell which inmigrant is legal or ilegal? I don´t buy it, looks to me like a measure to appease the population, like something is being done. If you want to kick illegal inmigrants out (cheap labour force) you will need to convince your capitalist government and share holders to make a bit less of money. _________________________ Good luck, with that one! Big business make less money? HAH! They live in their gated communities, go places in their private jets and let those who work for them live their lives the best they can! As for illegals already here? Good luck there, too. The I&NS won't do a thing about the ones already here. Did you ever feel trapped or backed in a corner? I think, until, those who do not care for the idea of illegals living in this country, 'rise-up' and start demanding our government to do something about it, nothing will be done about it. Sitting here, talking about it won't do a damned thing to get it stopped. Maybe, the 'Minutemen', have a good idea. At least, they are doing something! Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,175 #9 July 17, 2005 QuoteQuoteAre you saying that it is not possible at the present time to tell which inmigrant is legal or ilegal? I don´t buy it, looks to me like a measure to appease the population, like something is being done. If you want to kick illegal inmigrants out (cheap labour force) you will need to convince your capitalist government and share holders to make a bit less of money. _________________________ Good luck, with that one! Big business make less money? HAH! They live in their gated communities, go places in their private jets and let those who work for them live their lives the best they can! As for illegals already here? Good luck there, too. The I&NS won't do a thing about the ones already here. Did you ever feel trapped or backed in a corner? I think, until, those who do not care for the idea of illegals living in this country, 'rise-up' and start demanding our government to do something about it, nothing will be done about it. Sitting here, talking about it won't do a damned thing to get it stopped. Maybe, the 'Minutemen', have a good idea. At least, they are doing something! Chuck How much do you pay your lobbyist in DC? Not enough, I'm quite sure. "The business of America is business", Pres. Calvin Coolidge.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #10 July 18, 2005 look - we already know that illegal aliens can get current documentation. What will your ID card actually change, other than being another invasion of privacy? Sounds even less cost effective than Canada's gun registry. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
