Another reason not to like Wal-Mart

[justinb138 0]

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Other companies get a lot less of their goods from China.

What other companies are you talking about?

[billvon 3,092]

>I can buy the same stuff you do for less, and you can buy the same thing for more.

Exactly. You can support whatever you choose with your money.

>I also find it funny that you claim Wal-Mart is bad since they buy
>from China, but you drive a Honda and a Toyota.

Glad to have amused you! I think that hybrids will, overall, be good for the US. Heck, if they take off, we could avoid another oil war. To me, that's more important than waiting for a decent US hybrid. (Which will probably be a Prius in a few years - they're moving manufacturing to the US.)

> But even you must admit that claiming to be against Wal-Mart for buying
> 70% of its goods in China funny.

I'm not against Wal-Mart any more than I'm against China. There's nothing inherently bad about either one. You could fly to China, France, Ireland or Iran and do all your shopping there; it would be expensive, but it wouldn't be inherently bad. Just make sure you know who you are supporting by doing that.

[Lindsey 0]

What other companies are you talking about?

Well, there's Hickey's downtown, where I sometimes buy clothes. It's the only clothing store left in this town after Wal-Mart showed up. There's Holt's Builder's Supply. I haven't done an item-by-item check, but I *bet* that most of their merchandise doesn't come from China. There's Benton Furniture. Much nicer furniture than you'll find at Wal-Mart. You can't buy shoes in this town anymore, except for at Wal-Mart. And you can only buy children's clothes at Wal-Mart too. A shame.

That being said, I do shop at Wal-Mart. Their prices are good, and most of the time the quality is adequate for my purposes. But it is good, I believe, not to be blind to the issues involved when you support them.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[Ron 10]

You said:

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if you'd prefer that 70% of every dollar you spend goes to China instead of the US, then Wal-Mart is a fine choice

And I agree. But it is quite the hypocrite to say that then buy a Toyota and a Honda.

FWIW. I tend to avoid Wal-Mart simply because I don't like impersonal service. I do find it crazy that people bad mouth the place for a myrad of reasons (Most that do not stand to the light of day).

I guess it is human nature. But I think its sad when people bad mouth the place and ignore the good things it has done.

Also, I tend to agree on the hybrid issue.....I have even looked at them.

The Accord Hybrid seems interesting. Its 3,290 more than the standard, but only gets 8 miles more per gallon.

It could save me 6,000 in 5 years on gas..and I might qualify for the tax break...

So I may be buying one.

My only questions still are the dependability.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[PhreeZone 20]

My Civic was built with 87% US made parts. The Ford Escape I was looking at was less then 30% US and the rest was Mexican. Over all more of my money went to the American GDP then overseas by buying a Honda of America car.

Walmart also pissed me off about some customer service issue last summer and I still have'nt let them live it down. I've kept reciepts since then that have totaled into the thousands of dollars on things like food, Xmas gifts and everything else that I have bought elsewhere instead of with Walmart due to their poor service. One day I would love to shove them in the managers face and tell him how much money his store lost in sales due to 2 employees.

Owning stock in an American Automobile maker is a bad call right now... bail out while you can

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[Ron 10]

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My Civic was built with 87% US made parts. The Ford Escape I was looking at was less then 30% US and the rest was Mexican. Over all more of my money went to the American GDP then overseas by buying a Honda of America car.

The majority of the profit from sales at Wal-Mart stay in the US.

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Walmart also pissed me off about some customer service issue last summer and I still have'nt let them live it down. I've kept reciepts since then that have totaled into the thousands of dollars on things like food, Xmas gifts and everything else that I have bought elsewhere instead of with Walmart due to their poor service. One day I would love to shove them in the managers face and tell him how much money his store lost in sales due to 2 employees.

Two employees is not "Wal-Mart". Holding Wal-Mart responsible for two dumbasses would be like thinking the US is full of asswhipes based on Bush or Clinton alone. (Pick one)

That is one of the things...People jump all over Wal-Mart for lets say sexual discrimination....But its due to a very small percentage of cases...The number just happens to be really large becasue of the scope of the company.

I was in class the other night and this very topic came up. People jumped on the Anti-Mal-mart bandwaggon. NONE of them knew about "Acres for America", the 170 MILLION in donations (The largest of ANY company in the US/WORLD)....ect.

They only knew the stuff that they heard that was bad....

I aksed the class if they knew about the company I work for...They all had. I asked them one at a time what they thought about the company..They all agreed it is a good company to work for. But we pay less per hour and give fewer hours to our part time EE's than Wal-Mart. We also have less EE's, donate less to society...blah, blah, blah.

People STILL thought my company was better than Wal-Mart...even though I showed them that Wal-Mart did more.

People like to hate the biggest....Its natural.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[rehmwa 2]

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would be like thinking the US is full of asswhipes based on Bush or Clinton alone. (Pick one)

I can think of three responses to that sentence based on the people here.

"whipes" is a funny word

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[CanuckInUSA 0]

I've been living within a 10 minute walk from a Mal-Mart for the last six months. And because of this thread, I walked in there this morning for the first time and purchased some reasonably cheap blue-jeans for $16.20 (tax included). Not bad considering the same jeans go for a much higher price in some other store. Do I like Wal-Mart? Not really. But when I need certain products and don't want to spend tons of $$$, then Wal-Mart will get my business like they did today.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[markd_nscr986 0]

I am about a 10 minute drive from 2 Wal-Marts......and I refuse to set foot in either one, even if I pay more somewhere else.....at least they aren't getting my money.If I choose to buy a manufactured good from somewhere other than the PRC and have to pay more for it,then I do it.......

It's a matter of principle, not price for me.........

A point that is lost on a few around here....

Marc SCR 6046 SCS 3004

[Ron 10]

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It's a matter of principle, not price for me.........

A point that is lost on a few around here....

No, we just don't buy into the same principals you do.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[markd_nscr986 0]

Thanks for bringing that to my attention Ron

I should have said "a point that is totally lost on most around here"

Marc SCR 6046 SCS 3004

[kelpdiver 2]

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I aksed the class if they knew about the company I work for...They all had. I asked them one at a time what they thought about the company..They all agreed it is a good company to work for. But we pay less per hour and give fewer hours to our part time EE's than Wal-Mart. We also have less EE's, donate less to society...blah, blah, blah.

Does your company make people work after they've clocked out? Does it feel the need to have TVs every 30 ft blaring out how much better the company has made your life? It's a bit creepy being inside a Walmart. Somehow the vibe is quite different at Target, though there's not too much different about them.

Walmart is what it is. A big company that can leverage its buying power. The threat to drop a vendor is pretty hefty - few companies can lose one third of their sales and not go under. The money they give to society isn't really that impressive - $150/employee. Given the lack of health insurance, the communities are coming out behind just in that aspect.

And like Home Depot, it tends to bankrupt small businesses. It's really not that these are poorly run. It's just the fact that given a choice of price or quality, Americans overwhelmingly opt for price, even beyond the point of diminishing returns. We like to bitch about the morons at Best Buy that don't know the TVs they sell from their ass, but so long as the bottom line is better, we're content to just whine about it.

On the downside, this tends to lead to crappy products with higher failure rates. QA is a thing of the past - much cheaper just to accept a higher percentage of returns. And we don't get the best gadgets - even our cell phones are 2 generations behind.

[flyangel2 2]

Yup, I'm with you. I work hard for my money, and if I can get a good product cheaper at Wal-Mart vs the Mom and Pop store, you bet I'm going into Wal-Mart. Plus with the cost of fuel now, Wal-Mart is one stop shopping for me.

May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey

[Ron 10]

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The money they give to society isn't really that impressive - $150/employee

Which is still more than most companies.
And say what you will 170 MILLION is 170 MILLION.

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Given the lack of health insurance, the communities are coming out behind just in that aspect.

There is health insurance....Just like other companies it is expensive.

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QA is a thing of the past

Better not ask what I do for a living.

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And we don't get the best gadgets - even our cell phones are 2 generations behind.

How is that the fault of Wal-Mart?

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[kelpdiver 2]

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And we don't get the best gadgets - even our cell phones are 2 generations behind.

How is that the fault of Wal-Mart?

Didn't say it was. I blamed it on American consumer preferences.

[skydiverton 0]

Most of you guys sound like a fu^&^$&&ng european socialist!!!!

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Using your droque to gain stability is a bad habit,
Especially when you are jumping a sport rig

[mr2mk1g 10]

yup - the US is a hardcore capitalist country espousing open competition until it comes to looking at things on a global scale when they suddenly switch to hardcore socialists with overtly protectionist policies.

[Kennedy 0]

You have to consider that this is the country that made McDonalds it's number 1 "restaurant."

Anyone else remember that survey fast food joints conducted a while back, where they asked a LOT of people whther they wanted better food or more food, given an equal price? Yeah, those idiots opted for quantity over quality, and can we expect anything less of them when they go out and consume other products?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[markd_nscr986 0]

All too true.........

For most people if it's a matter of lowest price/low quality or higher price/better quality the lowest price wins out in most instances,as evidenced by that survey

Marc SCR 6046 SCS 3004

[Gravitymaster 0]

Wal-Mart Stores today surrendered to pressure from labor unions to increase hourly pay for its workers, and began a new corporate campaign to emulate the historical success of the U.S. auto industry.

"Our union critics were right," said H. Lee Scott Jr., Wal-Mart's chief executive, "We have an obligation to behave like General Motors did in the 1960s. And we've come to believe that the discount retail industry is primed for a chain that pays high wages to create the perception of high value through high-priced products. In addition, our focus groups indicate that Wal-Mart customers yearn for the emotional payoff that comes from providing bigger paychecks to the folks in the blue vests."

As part of the reengineering of the company, Wal-Mart will change its slogan from 'Always Low Prices' to 'Always Union Wages'. Prices will be marked up throughout the store, and many products will receive stickers indicating their higher perceived value with words like 'deluxe,' 'grand' and 'limited edition'.

In the short-term, analysts said that investors can expect to see their $48/share Wal-Mart stock (WMT) "level out" around $3 and then begin its upward climb as the store reestablishes its brand identity as the place where Americans shop to provide higher-wage jobs for less fortunate Americans.

"The unions have helped us to understand that we've been looking at the retailing business backward for 50 years," the CEO said. "We mistakenly thought it was all about providing a good selection at the lowest prices so people would shop with us. But what customers really want is the good feeling they get by providing a higher living standard for cashiers, shelf stockers and people greeters. Clearly, our primary responsibility is to pay higher wages so that our workers can afford our subsequently higher prices, or at least be able to buy from other retailers that pay their employees less."

Mr. Scott painted a visionary picture of the new progressive Wal-Mart.

"When our typical shopper pushes her cart full of 'Deluxe Tide' and 'Limited Edition Pampers' out the door, she'll smile when she sees our Wal-Mart Associates' parking area filled with late-model GM trucks and SUVs. Ain't that America?"

-Scott Ott (Scrappleface)

[AndyMan 7]

To pull this thread back on track,

Unlike McDonalds, Every product I have ever purchased at Walmart has been of topnotch quality. Most products I've purchased have been national brand names.

Craichead and I have bought most of our camping gear at Walmart, because we camp at the DZ, and don't need the uber:chic and expensive camping gear from REI. Most of the products are national brands, like Coleman.

I disagree that Walmart always kills off specialty stores, and the proof is that despite Walmart having a great selection of camping gear, there's still tons of great "real" hiking and camping stores, like REI, Moosejaw, or Mountain Equipment Co-op.

Walmart does kill off smaller discount stores. Some day some other discounter will kill off Walmart. That's just the nature of discounters. Walmart is canibalizing "Payless Shoe Source", but not Prada. I don't have a problem with that. Discounting will ALWAYS be a brutally competitive and ugly playing field.

When people want to buy discount goods, they'd be silly to shop anywhere other than Walmart (or Target, or whatever someday replaces either). If people want to pay more money for better products, they always have the choice to shop at a more upscale store. Walmart rarely canibalizes upscale stores.

Walmart does offer good products at great prices. That much is clear. They also offer a lot of crap too, so they sell a lot of stuff I won't buy. That's true of every retailer.

What's murky is some of the ethics. Some of the lawsuits have merrit. I'd bet money on Walmart breaking laws to keep the unions out. Some of the discrimination has been very real. Sam Walton might be a great business man, but he was also the epitome of a "good old boy". He ran his company like a fiefdom, and that will have to be accounted for.

Like I said earlier, owning a big chunk of Walmart stock has been very good to us. I hope when the next big retailer comes along that will eventually knock off Walmart, we'll have the foresight to buy that stock, too. In the meantime, when I'm looking for a national brand at an excellent price, I'm entirely willing to shop at Walmart.

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[PhreeZone 20]

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Plus with the cost of fuel now, Wal-Mart is one stop shopping for me.

Walmart gas stations are actually usually operating at a loss for the most part and they don't deny it since you have to use your Shoppers Card to get the discount and they relay on other purchases made to more then balence out the books. My family owns a fuel station that will probally close in the near future due to a Walmart opening a fueling station in the last year. When Walmart is selling gas at less then the purchase price that BP stations are able to get it at from the refineries there is something wrong with that picture. I knew the numbers back in Feburary were it was costing 1.42 or so to purchase the fuel, state and national taxes were about 55.7 cents per gallon. They were having to sell it at 1.979 to break even. Walmart was charging 1.949 for Gas. Its damn hard for any company to operate at a loss every day when a large corperation is able to absorb those losses since they can play with numbers and show a larger profit in the stores due to purchases needed to get the discount with your Shoppers Card.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[markd_nscr986 0]

I understand........

Having several choices available to me,I choose to spend my money at Costco.....which I guess would be equivalent to a Sam's Club?They seem to treat their employees better,the prices are as good as Sam's club and they seem to have same quality or better quality merchandise than Sam's/Wal-Mart.We recently voted down a Wal-Mart in our community (Arvada)due to issues with some aspects of their corporate policies/procedures.A suburb to the north,Thornton,also said no to a Wal-Mart for different reasons

And since I do spend a fair amount of time mountaineering out here,and need lightweight,reliable,state of the art stuff,I just bite the bullet and shop at REI

Marc SCR 6046 SCS 3004

[kelpdiver 2]

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Craichead and I have bought most of our camping gear at Walmart, because we camp at the DZ, and don't need the uber:chic and expensive camping gear from REI. Most of the products are national brands, like Coleman.

I disagree that Walmart always kills off specialty stores, and the proof is that despite Walmart having a great selection of camping gear, there's still tons of great "real" hiking and camping stores, like REI, Moosejaw, or Mountain Equipment Co-op.

The real stores exist because, frankly, Coleman sucks. Works fine for car camping, which is really what people need for the DZ. But if you want to leave the parking lot....

REI, otoh, has long given up their soul as a backpacker store and is far more about selling to yuppies who also tend to car camp, but would rather buy the 3-4 season gear as some sort of statement. (same statement as buying an SUV to drive on freeways)

[PhreeZone 20]

It depressed me when the last true outdoors store in town closed last year. In talking to one of the employees sales went kuput when a national chain opened its doors in town. Walk into the big store and no one can tell me the difference between a container stove and a liquid fuel stove, but at the other store not only could they tell me all they they also were able to suggest alternitives and tell me if new products were coming out. They also kept a much more diverse inventoy or stock list then the national chain does with its 3 brands (all which I would never take to a park let alone hiking). I really miss that store since they kept little profiles on everyone and would let you know if things were coming out that you might need or for seminars. They got ran out of business since the national chain was able to sell shitty gear at bargin prices with no knowledge base to a public that did'nt know any better.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com