Smith and Wesson Attempts Suicide, Again

[Bdog 0]

sounds like a gun company is really anti-gun.

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---Future Darwin Award recipient-

[Kennedy 0]

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I got my hands on a Ruger KP345. see attached

Looks deceptively like a toy gun, no wonder the kid picked it up.

That Ruger is not the gun that was involved in the accident.

The gun was a Smith and Wesson, unknown model.
edit: it was a Smith & Wesson Model 915 9 mm pistol

I used the Ruger as an inllustration because it has all the features the vultures sued for, but a 12 year old couldn' tell me if it was loaded or not.

Not little post or lever would make one damn bit of difference.



ps - do you really think that looks like a toy? Are you not around firearms that much? That's a fairly traditional design for these days. You should see some of the stuff on the market that really looks cheap. Besides, the Ruger weighs over two pounds unloaded.

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Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
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[dorbie 0]

I'm not actually disagreeing with you. The toy gun comment was merely polemic to convey what the mindset of 12 random people vetted for their unfamiliarity with firearms might be after listening to a cynical legal team for a few days.

Yup different model, different company.

And once again difference two whom? See my first post in this thread. Who is the indicator for? The person who owns and operates the firearm. In this case the person who assumed they left an unloaded firearm lying around when tragically the weapon had a chambered round.

[justinb138 0]

F*ck childproofing guns (something a child should never have unsupervised access to), can't we childproof parents?

[dorbie 0]

As I understand it the lawsuits primary complaint was never about childproofing guns.

You can't sell a cup of hot coffee in the USA without safety labels but you can sell a gun where if some dumbass removes the clip he can't obviously see that he has a round chambered, and he can still discharge the weapon.

None of this has anything to do with childproofing guns.

And before you start in on me, I'm not even making the case just highlighting the points they'd have made to 12 of your intelligent peers.

[justinb138 0]

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As I understand it the lawsuits primary complaint was never about childproofing guns.

You can't sell a cup of hot coffee in the USA without safety labels but you can sell a gun where if some dumbass removes the clip he can't obviously see that he has a round chambered, and he can still discharge the weapon.

None of this has anything to do with childproofing guns.

And before you start in on me, I'm not even making the case just highlighting the points they'd have made to 12 of your intelligent peers.

I didn't mean to start in on you, my post wasn't really aimed at anyone, but stemmed from my frustration with morons getting money for being morons.

[Tonto 1]

Eeee!

My Mom has one of those. She loves it cos "The bullets don't shoot out the side" and "The sticky thingy doesn't hook on my clothes"

She can shoot with it though!

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[JohnMitchell 16]

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[Unfortunately, I see the ability to fire without a magazine (useful to me) and the lack of a chamber indicator as vunerabilities in the legal realm.

A magazine disconnect makes the trigger creepy and less accurate, such as on my Browning Hi-power. That's a distinct disadvantage. The loaded chamber indicator is nice. My wife's newest auto has one, but you certainly don't bet your life on it. No gadget is a substitute for proper gun handling. No child should be untrained on gun safety. Firearm tragedies are some of the most preventable accidents around.

I understand, though, that you're looking at it from the legal point of view. Funny how we shape so may of our actions accordingly these days. There's an invisible lawyer that sits on my shoulder at work every day.

[kelpdiver 2]

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I understand, though, that you're looking at it from the legal point of view. Funny how we shape so may of our actions accordingly these days. There's an invisible lawyer that sits on my shoulder at work every day.

I try not to let it shape my actions, but I do pay attention to that perspective. The second consequence of a success with the gun liability legislation will be a refocus by HCI on the definition of a well engineered hand gun. Right now they are laying the groundwork.

The counter points you guys have made (accuracy, police concerns) have been useful bits of information to know. I just liked being able to fire the last couple rounds in the box of ammo, or to give someone a single round to fire when they first handle a given gun.

[Kennedy 0]

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As I understand it the lawsuits primary complaint was never about childproofing guns.

You can't sell a cup of hot coffee in the USA without safety labels but you can sell a gun where if some dumbass removes the clip he can't obviously see that he has a round chambered, and he can still discharge the weapon.

None of this has anything to do with childproofing guns.

And before you start in on me, I'm not even making the case just highlighting the points they'd have made to 12 of your intelligent peers.

It's too bad that logic doesn't often make an appearance in the court room. Just think about it. If a gun owner is so irresponsible that he leaves his firearm lying around where children will find it, so uncaring that he doesn't educate his children about firearms, and so incompetant that he doesn't check the chamber for the last round, does anyone really think a tiny metal post will prevent problems?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
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[JohnRich 4]

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It has the most obvious loaded indicator I've ever seen or heard about. see pic 2 In case you can't see it in the picture, the LCI has two large red spots and says "LOADED." It sticks up at least an 1/8 of an inch, probably more.

Thanks for that example. Yeah, like one-eighth of an inch is going to make a dumb person realize he's making a mistake? Hardly. These items are nothing but pandering to the anti-gun crowd. As soon as the anti-gun folks make every manufacturer put these on all their guns, then they'll keep on suing by saying that they aren't obvious enough. It's just one meaningless line of attack amongst many.

[JohnRich 4]

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You can't sell a cup of hot coffee in the USA without safety labels but you can sell a gun where if some dumbass removes the clip he can't obviously see that he has a round chambered, and he can still discharge the weapon.

The first rule of gun safety: assume that every gun is loaded.

If a gun owner ignores that rule, it shouldn't be the fault of the gun manufacturer to pick up the tab.

[justinb138 0]

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As I understand it the lawsuits primary complaint was never about childproofing guns.

You can't sell a cup of hot coffee in the USA without safety labels but you can sell a gun where if some dumbass removes the clip he can't obviously see that he has a round chambered, and he can still discharge the weapon.

None of this has anything to do with childproofing guns.

And before you start in on me, I'm not even making the case just highlighting the points they'd have made to 12 of your intelligent peers.

It's too bad that logic doesn't often make an appearance in the court room. Just think about it. If a gun owner is so irresponsible that he leaves his firearm lying around where children will find it, so uncaring that he doesn't educate his children about firearms, and so incompetant that he doesn't check the chamber for the last round, does anyone really think a tiny metal post will prevent problems?

You have to look at the keyword in that paragraph.

The gun manufacturers can idiot-proof every gun they sell, but eventually there will be a bigger idiot.

[wmw999 2,588]

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eventually there will be a bigger idiot

True. Let's get rid of childproof caps, safety gates for pools and the like while we're at it.

Every time I see this thread title, I think it's another one of those "those gun-haters think guns just up and walk around on their own" ones.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Kennedy 0]

My uncle used to have this saying about making something idiot proof, and underestimating the power of idiots...


There is only one thing more common than hydrogen in this universe: stupidity.

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Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
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[Kennedy 0]

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Let's get rid of childproof caps...

My grandfather had athritis bad enough that he couldn't open those bottles.

Just because something might be a good idea a lot of the time, that doesn't mean it's a good idea all the time.

So maybe requiring it of everyone isn't a great idea, no matter how wonderful it sounds at first.

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Every time I see this thread title, I think it's another one of those "those gun-haters think guns just up and walk around on their own" ones.

Nope, this one is actually about the company tryign to kill itself.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
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