New Pope Elected

[Rebecca 0]

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Joey the Rat, not a bad name for a pope

Actually, the 'Rat' part of his name means 'advice or counsel', not the rodent.

you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel loquacious?' -- well do you, punk?

[Frenchy68 0]

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You would rather the Church try to be "popular" than moral?

Yes. I don't want anyone telling me what is moral and what is not.Once again, i do not believe that claiming that blacks did not have a soul was morally right. But that's me. And if the church is for the people, it should be popular. Not elitist.
Once again, the Catholic Church has changed its stance on certain matters many times before.

"For once you have tasted Absinthe you will walk the earth with your eyes turned towards the gutter, for there you have been and there you will long to return."

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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Actually, the 'Rat' part of his name means 'advice or counsel', not the rodent

I know, I remember my high school German classes.

It would be a great mob nickname for him though.

[billvon 3,131]

>Do you think the church should adapt to society when it against the writtings of the Church?

It already has, hundreds of times. Google "Vatican II."

[jakee 1,609]

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The Grand Inqusitor will keep the Dogma pure.
No condoms for Africa,
No population control for south America,

not the church's job to supply these things. But since we don't live in a theocracy, you're free to obtain them anyway.

Damn dude, talk about deliberately missing the point. The catholic church has an enormous influence over some of the worst AIDS affected countries in the world. Forbiding their followers from using condoms is not just wrong its despicable.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[rehmwa 2]

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I'm pleased because he's not italian. JPII was the first non-italian pope in 400 years, and if they went back to an italian pope at this point, it would be many years before another country got a chance again for fear of breaking tradition. JPII would have been looked back on as an anomaly, and it would be much harder to break the tradition again. Benedict XVI is German, which does demonstrate a bit of change in the church.

Hypothetically, if the best qualified candidate just happened to be Italian and they picked him based on his qualifications, you'd be upset because of his nationality. In other words, you'd have been upset if any Italian would have gotten the job.

How would that fly in an everyday job her in the US? Maybe the next pope has to be a woman, or only a white or black guy, or maybe a goat. No one else need apply, we have arbitrary quotas to fill to make cosmetic PR gestures.

I don't even know where to start with the whole "another country got a chance" quote.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[rehmwa 2]

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Ratzinger, head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, aka The Inquisition.

Founded in 1542 by Pope Paul III, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith was originally called the Sacred Congregation of the Universal Inquisition: the lovely people responsible for torturing and burning victims to death in the name of God.

Great choice, guys!

Wow, I thought this guy was in his 70s. But according to the Prof here he's over 450 years old and likely pushing a half Millenium - if that isn't qualification for head of a major religion (relative immortality) I don't know what is.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[DrunkMonkey 0]

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Ratzinger, head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, aka The Inquisition.

Founded in 1542 by Pope Paul III, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith was originally called the Sacred Congregation of the Universal Inquisition: the lovely people responsible for torturing and burning victims to death in the name of God.

Great choice, guys!

Wow, I thought this guy was in his 70s. But according to the Prof here he's over 450 years old and likely pushing a half Millenium - if that isn't qualification for head of a major religion (relative immortality) I don't know what is.

..And he's from Germany, the country that started WWII. The scandal!!

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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..And he's from Germany, the country that started WWII. The scandal!!

That isn't, his alleged membership to the Hitler Youth may raise some questions though.

[rehmwa 2]

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..And he's from Germany, the country that started WWII. The scandal!!

Well, the logic does follow then that anyone from Germany put into a leadership position will result in chaos and invading France - WW2 did happen even more recently than the Inquisition and look at the concern on this forum.

Heck, I'm half German, and I can barely restrain myself from getting in my tank and driving to France right now. The only problem is I don't know if tanks are amphibius..amphibious..amfibyous.. can operate on or in water.

well, only one way to find out

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Nightingale 0]

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How would you like to see it change?

I'd definitely like to see a more prominant role for women. The church virtually ignores half the population. JPII was against even female altar servers and eucharistic ministers. If you're male and want to serve the church, you can be a priest, deacon, acolyte, etc. If you're female, well, you can be a nun, and nuns don't really do anything that a regular person can't do, since nuns focus mainly on prayer and community service. It's as if the church is saying that women aren't good enough to take on the responsibilities of a priest. A priest is the most important local position, and women are denied the opportunity.

The church's attitude towards women is one of the things that is driving younger people, especially young women, away. Women look at the church and realize that they really don't have much of a role in it.

Also, I believe that priests should be allowed to marry. The church states now that priests and nuns should be basically married to the church. However, that wasn't always the case. Priests were originally allowed to marry. However, this became a problem, because priests didn't own property. Therefore, there was nothing for the children to inherit, so priests began giving their sons church property, because at the time, inheritence was very important. The church didn't like this much, and changed the rules to say priests can't marry to get rid of the whole inheritence issue. There's no real religious reason that priests can't marry, and the historical one isn't really valid anymore. The protestants seem to have balanced marriage and serving the church, and there's no reason why catholics can't do the same.

There are also many reasons to lift that restriction.
1. People wouldn't have to make the difficult choice between church and family/marriage/love.
2. Priests would be better equipped to counsel their parishoners on life, because they wouldn't be so far removed from it. The current system is like a flight instructor trying to teach someone to fly a plane when the instructor himself has never done it but just read a book on the subject. They have no practical knowledge, which can lead to spouting off ideals that are not always practical in reality.
3. It would open the priesthood to married men, and, with the priest shortage, a larger pool of candidates, there will be more priests.
4. It would probably cut down on the sexual abuse of parishoners by priests. Having normal outlets for sexuality can cut down on abnormal behavior. (take a look at how many men with normal sex lives go into jail and end up hooking up with other men when they wouldn't have done so otherwise).

There are a lot of other reasons. those are just the big ones.

Those are the two main things I'd like to see the church change.

[DrunkMonkey 0]

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..And he's from Germany, the country that started WWII. The scandal!!

That isn't, his alleged membership to the Hitler Youth may raise some questions though.

Membership in the HJ was mandatory at the time. His bio said he joined, and according to wikipedia:

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he was not an enthusiastic member. He requested to be taken off the rolls and reportedly refused to attend a single meeting

I'd quote his official bio, but the site is Farked.

As far as his military time, he was forced into a FLAK unit, then into the Wehrmacht. He deserted (despite the SS's death threats for deserters), went home, was taken as a POW by the allies, and released after the war.

[SpeedRacer 1]

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Ratzinger, head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, aka The Inquisition.

Founded in 1542 by Pope Paul III, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith was originally called the Sacred Congregation of the Universal Inquisition: the lovely people responsible for torturing and burning victims to death in the name of God.

Great choice, guys!

does anyone else notice a trend towards sensationalism in some of kallend's post?

This is kind of like your other post where you try to paint all of "the right" with the same brush as that anti-abortion terrorist. Except in this case you had to reach back about 500 years.

I actually agree with you sometimes, but would you mind keeping a sense of proportion & reality? You're coming across like a left-wing Anne Coulter.

and as for Frenchy's comment about Catholic's believing that black people don't have a soul, well, I'll just let everyone decide for themselves if that isn't the same kinda trend.

Speed Racer
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[justinb138 0]

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Heck, I'm half German, and I can barely restrain myself from getting in my tank and driving to France right now. The only problem is I don't know if tanks are amphibius..amphibious..amfibyous.. can operate on or in water.

well, only one way to find out

[rehmwa 2]

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How would you like to see it change?

I'd definitely ....

Now that's a good post.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Nightingale 0]

Well, the problem used to be that "if you weren't Italian, you can't be pope". Now, with two non-italians in a row, it breaks that tradition and gives everyone an equal chance, rather than giving the cardinals an opportunity to present JPII's appointment as an anomaly.

[rehmwa 2]

I understand, just disagree. Nationality, race, sex, etc are crappy criteria to demand for most any position. Equity is one of the biggest abuses in this century. To the point where now it's just a joke.

i.e., it's just as wrong to disqualify a candidate because he's Italian as it would be to pick him because he's Italian.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Frenchy68 0]

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and as for Frenchy's comment about Catholic's believing that black people don't have a soul, well, I'll just let everyone decide for themselves if that isn't the same kinda trend.

You are misquoting me.
I used the passed temps. To illustrate that the Catholic church has evolved in its doctrine, for the better.

"For once you have tasted Absinthe you will walk the earth with your eyes turned towards the gutter, for there you have been and there you will long to return."

[Nightingale 0]

I'm not saying that italians should have been disqualified, just that I'm glad that the cardinals felt that the best man for the job wasn't italian, because it reinforces the breaking of the italian monopoly over the papacy and will, in the future, allow for more global representation.

[christelsabine 1]

and as for Frenchy's comment about Catholic's believing that black people don't have a soul, well, I'll just let everyone decide for themselves if that isn't the same kinda trend.

[flyangel2 2]

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JPII was against even female altar servers

I believe females (young gals) can be altar boys now. Only they are called altar girls, I think.

My mother can serve the sacraments of bread and wine.

May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey

[Miranda 0]

yes they can, we have just as many altar girls as boys in my church.

[Nightingale 0]

Females can be altar servers here in the US, but in many other countries they can't. The pope spoke out against it, but didn't make a formal decree on the subject, so churches were free to have them or not, even though the pope didn't want females on the altar. Ditto with eucharistic ministers.

[rehmwa 2]

Kris - I think you're smart and well spoken. I get your point. I just think any equity discussion is a distraction from real a discussion of real leadership qualities or lack of in the new pope, no matter how well intended. Even having this discussion shows that it plays in your personal evaluation of this candidate. I believe it's a real trap in terms of race relations, sexual discrimination, and now papalcy (I apologize for the spelling right now).

Allowing for more "global representation" is specious in the end and just PR nonsense, they should endeavor to get the best individual for the job based on leadership abilities alone. Maybe exactly for the sake of the very valid points you made in the later post about humanizing the clergy and accepting women as valid contributors to faith.

(I'm not a religious person - disclaimer)

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Andrewwhyte 1]

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Well, the problem used to be that "if you weren't Italian, you can't be pope". Now, with two non-italians in a row, it breaks that tradition and gives everyone an equal chance, rather than giving the cardinals an opportunity to present JPII's appointment as an anomaly.

Last time there was a non-Italian pope there were two in a row (the Borgia Pontificates). That didn't work out so well.