Re: [PrairieDoug] Christian Skydivers...

[goose491 0]

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I'm NOT a Christian, or otherwise religious.

Christianity is not a Religion... it is faith. If you love... you are Christian to degree.

Religion and Faith must be seperated in the mind. They are seperated in language, they hold two very distinct meanings. However, we as a people have all tripped so hard over not wanting to "worship", that we cringe at anyting related to "religion".

And justly so with todays churches!

"What greater deception could be foisted upon our people than for Satan to bring falsehood from within the church, while the members expect it to come from a source outside the church. How well we have been prepared to receive it by being taught to depend upon a system of religious organization to warn us of its approach and arrival, rather than encouraged to look to the platform of truth established in the early years of the movement."
-Jon A. Vannoy

My Karma ran over my Dogma!!!

[PrairieDoug 0]

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Christianity is not a Religion... it is faith. If you love... you are Christian to degree.

By this reasoning, if I love I'm probably also Muslim, Buddhist, Jewish, etc. to a degree. I thought being Christian required believing that Jesus is the Son of God and all that. But I defer to those who are better informed on the topic.

Edited to add: Anyway, the main point of my original post was to say that even non-Christians can welcome the participation of Christians in skydiving.

[goose491 0]

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Christianity is not a Religion... it is faith. If you love... you are Christian to degree.

By this reasoning, if I love I'm probably also Muslim, Buddhist, Jewish, etc. to a degree.

Yup... If you know to separate Faith from Religion, you are absolutely correct.

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I thought being Christian required believing that Jesus is the Son of God and all that. But I defer to those who are better informed on the topic.

Being Christian requires nothing of you... other than Love. "Faith" is some sort of strength or power you obtain solely from the belief in something. If you belIeve in anything he said, you do obtain some degree of power from it. "Religion" is a system of guideline or rules that accompany a certain "Faith". You may be extremely religious and go to church each Sunday... you are not obtaining any such power.

Example: I am of Christian Faith because I believe in the covenant he has brought us. I believe that all will be well when we all love one another properly.

I am of the Catholic Religion because they also believe in the covenant that Jesus has brought us. Moreover, they believe that they have come up with the guidelines and practices we should follow in order to... be proper Christians.

Now, I am not a Catholic... I am not member of any Religion... but in my example you can see the difference.

By raising churches of different practice, we are only dividing the people. Trust that at the base of each and everyones true "FAITH" lies one Divine truth. Religion builds upon that truth but forces us to argue fabricated Mortal differences.

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Edited to add: Anyway, the main point of my original post was to say that even non-Christians can welcome the participation of Christians in skydiving.

And you are doing right by all in doing so.

My Karma ran over my Dogma!!!

[windcatcher 0]

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Being Christian requires nothing of you... other than Love.

Sorry, I have to disagree with you again Goose. My opinion, of a born-again Christian, is someone who has recognized themselves as a sinner, lost without Jesus' death on the cross for their sins. Jesus said "I am the Way, the Truth, the Life...no man comes to the Father except through me"
Also, to be a Christian, requires you to turn away from your former way of living, and have a relationship with God. Just because you believe in God, doesn't mean you are necessarily of the Christian faith .
God wants people, who will turn away from sin, and love Him, love people...it's that simple.

Mother to the cutest little thing in the world...

[goose491 0]

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Being Christian requires nothing of you... other than Love.

Sorry, I have to disagree with you again Goose. My opinion, of a born-again Christian, is someone who has recognized themselves as a sinner, lost without Jesus' death on the cross for their sins.

You disagree on semantics. Whether or not you agree that he died for YOUR sins, all you need to do is Love to be in accordance with him. This is not about you. It is about us all. Don't forget that:

-There are many who believe that Jesus died only for the sins of a certain few.

-There are many others who believe that Jesus died for the sins of all men and women.

-There are still a great many more who believe that Jesus died for the sins of all mankind committed up until that point and up until that point only, leaving everyone more responsible for their own actions from that point on. and

-There happens to be some "in betweens".

-Heck, there are some that don't agree he ever physically existed! But that follow his word as they think it is the way.

All of the above are "Christian"... are you going to tell them they aren't? Well who are you? Because Jesus does not want the fame... he just wants you to understand.

The important part is that you not push people away because their "Opinions" differ from yours. Each, Either and/or All of the above is true if you believe it to be. (Jesus was the first professor of Quatum Physics! lol) What's important is the message it bring you. Like a fable told to a child. It can be told a few different ways but the message, the moral, that's what's important.

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Jesus said "I am the Way, the Truth, the Life...no man comes to the Father except through me"

Indeed he did. Before Jesus, man and "God" had a very different relationship. He brought forth the new covenant. That is, the new relathionship between man and "God". No man comes to the Father unless they do so via the new covenant... Jesus is the Fable, the message, the moral of the "story" which is no more complex than "Love thy Neighbor" and "Do unto others..."

My Karma ran over my Dogma!!!

[GTAVercetti 0]

Hey, someone let SC out of its cage!

BAD SC! BAD!!!!

Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

[windcatcher 0]

I predict SC in

3

2

1

C-ya!!!!

Mother to the cutest little thing in the world...

[goose491 0]

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Hey, someone let SC out of its cage!

BAD SC! BAD!!!!

... Do I even what to know? lol

My Karma ran over my Dogma!!!

[chadkal 0]

being a christian has nothing to do with what we do it has everthing to do with what god did. the only thing that we have to do to be christian is to beleive and except this. god came to the earth as a man, was crucified dead and buried. he arose from the dead to take on all of the sin in the world so that you would not perish. to be a christian means that you have excepted christ as your savior. he came here to save you. if you do not beleive that christ came here and died to save you from your sin, then no amount of love will make you a christian. it,s all god's love and if you are willing to except it





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I am a greek midget

[juanesky 0]

So if you love jumping, you are christian, hence all skydivers are Christian

"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

[lurch 0]

re: your above paragraph
being a christian has nothing to do... etc.

I've been hearing religious people say stuff like this my whole life. A lot of it seems based on a cause-effect assumption similar in nature to astrology. Astrology is based on the notion that somehow the positions of the planets control and determine aspects of my life which can be predicted by judging those planets against a scaling system somebody thought up centuries ago before we even knew what planets were. Try as I might, I can't see any detectable connection between the position of saturn and my career prospects in the coming month.

Christianity is based on the notion that somehow everyone alive has committed acts which piss off the creator of the universe. These acts are classified as "sins" according to a scaling system somebody thought up centuries ago before we even understood anything about the planet, or even that it WAS one, or anything about its structure and construction.
Somehow we are supposed to need to be saved from these crimes. The christ character central to the myth was a preacher common to the times who was executed in the fashion of the times by the local government with the hands-off endorsement of Rome's local representative magistrate, some asshole name of Pilate. Rome was in the habit of indulging the locals in minor matters such as these to aid in maintaining stability in fringe areas especially areas where preachers frequently surfaced, often bringing instability and rebellion with them.
This preacher let himself be killed, deliberately. Passive suicide.
Supposedly he did this to pay for everyone else's crimes against the creator. "Died for our sins." " so that you would not perish."
Huh? This is the part where they lose me, just like astrology with the idea of planets connected to my life according to when I was born.
First off, whats with the "would not perish" bit? Basic fact of reality: everything living is mortal and will die. Me. You. Your favorite housepet. No exceptions. As undeniably realistic of an unavoidable fact as the crunch of an suv into a bridge abutment at 88 mph. No matter how avid a believer in christ-sponsored immortallity the driver may be, he's dead.
Even if you grant the notion of sin as having objective validity, what does the politically motivated state sponsored execution of a pacifist preacher from millennia ago have to do with any crime I may commit? The idea is so far away from having cause and effect validity as to be blatantly fictitious.
The guy died 2000 years ago. He can't save me from a bad day let alone any objectively real quantifiable hazard.
Why am I supposed to believe this mythology in preference to any other equally realistic ones such as astrology, witchcraft, satanism, zoroastrianism animism or haitian voodoo?

Live and learn... or die, and teach by example.

[GTAVercetti 0]

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First off, whats with the "would not perish" bit? Basic fact of reality: everything living is mortal and will die. Me. You. Your favorite housepet. No exceptions. As undeniably realistic of an unavoidable fact as the crunch of an suv into a bridge abutment at 88 mph. No matter how avid a believer in christ-sponsored immortallity the driver may be, he's dead.

I will explain this little bit. "So that you would not perish" does not refer to your physical body but to your soul. If you actually read the Bible, you would know that.

I have numerous problems with the Bible, but this point is pretty evident.

Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

[kinney29 0]

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Supposedly he did this to pay for everyone else's crimes against the creator. "Died for our sins." " so that you would not perish."
Huh? This is the part where they lose me, just like astrology with the idea of planets connected to my life according to when I was born.
First off, whats with the "would not perish" bit? Basic fact of reality: everything living is mortal and will die. Me. You. Your favorite housepet. No exceptions. As undeniably realistic of an unavoidable fact as the crunch of an suv into a bridge abutment at 88 mph. No matter how avid a believer in christ-sponsored immortallity the driver may be, he's dead.
Even if you grant the notion of sin as having objective validity, what does the politically motivated state sponsored execution of a pacifist preacher from millennia ago have to do with any crime I may commit? The idea is so far away from having cause and effect validity as to be blatantly fictitious.
The guy died 2000 years ago. He can't save me from a bad day let alone any objectively real quantifiable hazard.
Why am I supposed to believe this mythology in preference to any other equally realistic ones such as astrology, witchcraft, satanism, zoroastrianism animism or haitian voodoo?

First you must understand that Jesus was not a "preacher" but indeed was God himself. Like it was stated above he did not die to physically save us but to save our soul/spirt, which is eternal. Prior to his crusifixion the only way to atone for your sins was through animal sacrafice. But God chose to come here and offer himself as a sacrafice for our sins. This is not to say that by asking and recieving forgivness that we are then immune from punishment. We are still liable here on earth for what we have done wrong.
Lets not forgot another key point, here in the Easter season, not only did he die, but he then rose again.

[lurch 0]

oh hell I just don't feel like starting shit today. Deleted.

Live and learn... or die, and teach by example.

[shropshire 0]

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but indeed was God himself

- you might believe this, but please dont state it as fact.

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not only did he die, but he then rose again

*** - If you say so.....

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[sfzombie13 324]

i agree with this, i have the utmost respect for anyone's beliefs, i just wish people would acknowledge that not everyone believes the same thing, or even close to the same thing. i don't pre-judge people for anything, nor do i try to sway your beleifs. when you go to church, you can state any "facts" as such that you want, because all of you are sharing the same belief. just my opinion.

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Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes

[rickjump1 0]

I am a Christian, and I hope you enjoy this. I believe it could apply to other faiths as well.http://www.theinterviewwithgod.com/

Do your part for global warming: ban beans and hold all popcorn farts.