jcd11235 0 #26 December 22, 2004 Quoterespecting that belief and not trashing it is important, and I try to do the same... hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoadRash 0 #27 December 22, 2004 QuoteQuoterespecting that belief and not trashing it is important, and I try to do the same... hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha I think you just went splat...ROFLAO!!!!!! ~R+R...Remember...that whole parachute analogy of yours...or do you need a definition for the word analogy from Google?~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #28 December 22, 2004 QuoteI think you just went splat...ROFLAO!!!!!! Just take your meds and go back to sleep....Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoadRash 0 #29 December 22, 2004 QuoteQuoteI think you just went splat...ROFLAO!!!!!! Just take your meds and go back to sleep.... I don't need meds...I sleep just fine......and if you want to continue with this...take it to PMs or the Bonfire...I don't want to further waste anymore of HH's bandwith...with your veiled personal attacks...~R+R...~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shotgun 1 #30 December 22, 2004 QuoteI don't need meds...I sleep just fine... Hmm.... Well then... Can I have your meds??? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #31 December 22, 2004 QuoteHmm.... Well then... Can I have your meds??? HAHAHAHMath tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoadRash 0 #32 December 22, 2004 QuoteQuoteI don't need meds...I sleep just fine... Hmm.... Well then... Can I have your meds??? Well, I don't have any...but I'll give you some of my mom's...... ~R+R...~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Fly the friendly skies...^_^...})ii({...^_~... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #33 December 22, 2004 QuoteI’m curious; when you explain to your children what you are celebrating, do you do so from neutral perspective allowing your children to make up there own minds as to whether there is any authenticity in your particular religion. Or do you just force it upon them giving them no choice but to accept it??? With regard to Christianity, I can’t “make” my children accept or reject. That is their decision alone. I, however, am not neutral in what I teach my children is correct when they’re not yet old enough to make informed decisions for themselves. Until they are old enough, it is my job as a parent to guide them in the direction that I think is appropriate and is the best course of action. I can only hope that when they’re older, they will continue to be able to decide wisely for themselves. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tunaplanet 0 #34 December 22, 2004 What are you going to tell your children if they figure out all of the innacuracies and contradictions in the bible? Forty-two Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #35 December 22, 2004 QuoteWhat are you going to tell your children if they figure out all of the innacuracies and contradictions in the bible? I hope they'll be smart enough to research it, take everything into context, and make informed decisions. Ultimately, however, the desire to become a Christian isn't based on how much you know from the Bible. It comes from God. By the way, my eldest son recently made the decision to become a Christian and be baptized. I'm very proud of him. That decision came not only without any pushing on my part but with a great deal of skepticism. I guess because it took me until I was 28. After much questioning, however, I believe him and I've come to realize that he has much more insight than I gave him credit for. By the way, he's 9 1/2. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aerohaga 0 #36 December 22, 2004 Quote>There is no other reason for Christmas than Christ's birth. If that were true we'd celebrate it on Jan 6th, the day he was most likely born. December 25th was a date derived by the church for the celebration of his birth. Which is no problem - but not exactly a celebration of his birthdate. Actually, Jesus was most likely born in September.For my part, I know nothing with any certainty, But the sight of the stars makes me dream. -Vincent Van Gogh Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #37 December 22, 2004 QuoteIn Reply To >There is no other reason for Christmas than Christ's birth. If that were true we'd celebrate it on Jan 6th, the day he was most likely born. December 25th was a date derived by the church for the celebration of his birth. Which is no problem - but not exactly a celebration of his birthdate. Actually, Jesus was most likely born in September. I heard Agust. Is it safe to say no one really knows?Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #38 December 22, 2004 QuoteQuoteWhat are you going to tell your children if they figure out all of the innacuracies and contradictions in the bible? I hope they'll be smart enough to research it, take everything into context, and make informed decisions. Ultimately, however, the desire to become a Christian isn't based on how much you know from the Bible. It comes from God. By the way, my eldest son recently made the decision to become a Christian and be baptized. I'm very proud of him. That decision came not only without any pushing on my part but with a great deal of skepticism. I guess because it took me until I was 28. After much questioning, however, I believe him and I've come to realize that he has much more insight than I gave him credit for. By the way, he's 9 1/2. with your son being a skeptic, what do you think was the turning point for him, or what was it that made him say "yes i want to be a christian"?----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #39 December 22, 2004 QuoteI heard Agust. Is it safe to say no one really knows? The exact day or month is not recorded. So, you're right, no one really knows. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #40 December 22, 2004 Quotewith your son being a skeptic, what do you think was the turning point for him, or what was it that made him say "yes i want to be a christian"? No, I was the skeptic. I didn't believe his sincerity at first. I thought he was too young. I was wrong. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #41 December 22, 2004 QuoteQuotewith your son being a skeptic, what do you think was the turning point for him, or what was it that made him say "yes i want to be a christian"? No, I was the skeptic. I didn't believe his sincerity at first. I thought he was too young. I was wrong. I’m sure at his age (9 or 10) I was a firm believer in God, although I think by that age I had decided that Santa wasn't real. But then I don’t think I had made an informed decision, I hadn’t looked at both sides of the argument. My parents went to church therefore I went to church, therefore I believed, I was 10 years old, there were far more important things in my life then, like Lego and cartoons. I think it was when I was in my early twenties that I decided it was time to take a deeper look into religion, as I wanted more then blind faith was giving me. Now I am a very happy atheist, I have made up my own mind that as of today, there simply isn’t anything more then faith. If someone digs up the Holy Grail tomorrow, or finds a buried angel then I will be quite happy to change my beliefs. So my question to you is I guess, as your son is still young and I would hazard a guess that he really hasn’t looked into the whole religion topic in great depth, hasn’t fully examined both sides of the argument, then it is quite possible that he could go the same way that I did. If this is the case, will you try to steer him back?----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #42 December 22, 2004 QuoteSo my question to you is I guess, as your son is still young and I would hazard a guess that he really hasn’t looked into the whole religion topic in great depth, hasn’t fully examined both sides of the argument, then it is quite possible that he could go the same way that I did. If this is the case, will you try to steer him back? Or, it’s quite possible that he could continue to go the way I did. Yes, as a father, I’d try and steer him back. I'd love him regardless. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #43 December 22, 2004 QuoteQuoteSo my question to you is I guess, as your son is still young and I would hazard a guess that he really hasn’t looked into the whole religion topic in great depth, hasn’t fully examined both sides of the argument, then it is quite possible that he could go the same way that I did. If this is the case, will you try to steer him back? Or, it’s quite possible that he could continue to go the way I did. Yes, as a father, I’d try and steer him back. I'd love him regardless. I agree he could go either way, but if he goes the wrong way why are you going to steer him back, you have already said he can make his own informed decision. But is that only of that decision suits you?----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Muenkel 0 #44 December 22, 2004 Hey Gary, Thanks for your post. Merry Christmas to you and all your loved ones.Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #45 December 22, 2004 QuoteI agree he could go either way, but if he goes the wrong way why are you going to steer him back, Because I'm his father and I love him. Would you, as a parent, allow your child to continue on a path that you feel is detrimental to him/her without interference? Quoteyou have already said he can make his own informed decision. But is that only of that decision suits you? No, it's the decision that best suits him. Like I said, it's not up to me to make him/her accept or reject the message. That's up to God. I can only answer the questions as best I can with what I believe to be true. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #46 December 22, 2004 QuoteBecause I'm his father and I love him. Would you, as a parent, allow your child to continue on a path that you feel is detrimental to him/her without interference? Absolutely not, however belief or non-belief in a particular God / Religion is hardly detrimental. Well unless my child decided to embrace some weird religion that meant he was going to start sacrificing virgins in the basement, then yes I would intervene, or he decides to become a suicide bomber...... Like you I will give me child all the information he asks for, I will present it in a non biased way, I will explain why I might feel a particular way about something, but I will make it quite clear that he has his own free will to decide what he feels is correct. If I believe something is detrimental, then I would step in, as I’m sure any parent would, if something is going to cause damage, harm or injury to my child then I will try to prevent it. I really don’t think that religion fits into this “detrimental” category, in this case... Perhaps explain why you feel that it would be detrimental…..----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #47 December 22, 2004 QuoteIf Christ never existed, do you think we'd have a Holiday for the Winter Solstice? Many pre-Christian cultures celebrated the Winter Solstice. So I'd imagine that postulating that Christ never existed, cultures would have continued celebrating the Winter Solstice up to the present day. Many non-Christian cultures have large winter holiday celebrations around the same time. If you try to fly to KL for an event around december 25th, for example, you find it very hard to get airline reservations, because of the very large number of (non-Christians) in that area who travel during that time for their cultural celebrations. In short, yes. I think it very likely that we'd have a holiday around that time even if Christ never existed.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #48 December 22, 2004 QuoteAbsolutely not, however belief or non-belief in a particular God / Religion is hardly detrimental. And here is where you and I fundamentally disagree. QuoteLike you I will give me child all the information he asks for, I will present it in a non biased way, I will explain why I might feel a particular way about something, but I will make it quite clear that he has his own free will to decide what he feels is correct. I also give my children all the information they ask for. I also make it quite clear that they have free-will to decide what they feel is correct and that I cannot make that kind of decision for them. I, however, also tell them what I feel is correct and hope that influences their decisions. That’s my job as a parent. QuotePerhaps explain why you feel that it would be detrimental….. I believe that we are sinful and selfish by nature. I believe that we are separated from God by this selfish nature. I believe that the wages of sin is spiritual death and that God became a man in the form of Jesus Christ to pay the penalty for my sin with his torture, crucifixion, death, resurrection, and ascension. I believe that we will all face judgment for everything we’ve done in life when we die. I believe that, without accepting Jesus as Lord and Savior, one will be eternally separated from God (i.e. Hell; whatever that is exactly). That is what I mean by detrimental. I do not believe life ends when we die. Physically, yes. Spiritually, no. I, therefore, wholeheartedly believe that it is crucial that my children follow the correct path in life. I will do everything in my power to help them. Mostly pray for their salvation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #49 December 22, 2004 QuoteI believe that we are sinful and selfish by nature. I believe that we are separated from God by this selfish nature. I believe that the wages of sin is spiritual death and that God became a man in the form of Jesus Christ to pay the penalty for my sin with his torture, crucifixion, death, resurrection, and ascension. I believe that we will all face judgment for everything we’ve done in life when we die. I believe that, without accepting Jesus as Lord and Savior, one will be eternally separated from God (i.e. Hell; whatever that is exactly). That is what I mean by detrimental. I do not believe life ends when we die. Physically, yes. Spiritually, no. I, therefore, wholeheartedly believe that it is crucial that my children follow the correct path in life. I will do everything in my power to help them. Mostly pray for their salvation. Ok finally, what happens when they ask you for evidence? Then your in trouble…..----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #50 December 22, 2004 QuoteDoes it have to be Christianity, or will any religion be expectable??? It's all about Jesus. QuoteOk finally, what happens when they ask you for evidence? Then your in trouble….. Why would I be in trouble? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
