PhillyKev 0 #1 November 30, 2004 So, I spent the weekend in Toronto. Just in flipping past the news I heard about 3 separate shootings and a police raid that turned up a large gun cache. Good thing they don't have any gun problems up there thanks to ownership restrictions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest #2 November 30, 2004 QuoteSo, I spent the weekend in Toronto. Just in flipping past the news I heard about 3 separate shootings and a police raid that turned up a large gun cache. Good thing they don't have any gun problems up there thanks to ownership restrictions. heh mh . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IanHarrop 43 #3 November 30, 2004 QuoteSo, I spent the weekend in Toronto. Just in flipping past the news I heard about 3 separate shootings and a police raid that turned up a large gun cache. Good thing they don't have any gun problems up there thanks to ownership restrictions. We get them from the states!"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #4 November 30, 2004 QuoteQuoteSo, I spent the weekend in Toronto. Just in flipping past the news I heard about 3 separate shootings and a police raid that turned up a large gun cache. Good thing they don't have any gun problems up there thanks to ownership restrictions. We get them from the states! I'm sure you do. And if we banned them here, we'd get them from somewhere else. Point is...once again, passing laws restricting guns doesn't keep criminals from getting them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #5 November 30, 2004 QuoteI'm sure you do. And if we banned them here, we'd get them from somewhere else. Point is...once again, passing laws restricting guns doesn't keep criminals from getting them. Toronto is the 4th or 5th largest metropilitan area in North America. I wonder how we stack up (crime wise) against Los Angelos, Detroit, Washington DC, Chicago and New York. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites chuteless 1 #6 November 30, 2004 Phillykev....I thought for as minute that you were up here gunning for me..... Bill Cole Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhillyKev 0 #7 November 30, 2004 Considering you picked the cities that have the most stringent gun control and restrictions in the US, that's kind of bad comparison. Plus TO is ranked that high when only talking about city limits. They don't have the densely populated outer lying suburbs like we do here. But, just to make you happy, here's one stat for you. Aggravate assaults in TO are about 4 times as frequent per 100k people than NYC. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #8 November 30, 2004 QuoteConsidering you picked the cities that have the most stringent gun control and restrictions in the US, that's kind of bad comparison. Plus TO is ranked that high when only talking about city limits. They don't have the densely populated outer lying suburbs like we do here. But, just to make you happy, here's one stat for you. Aggravate assaults in TO are about 4 times as frequent per 100k people than NYC. I just picked the other large metropolitan areas on the list. I really could care less what you guys dow ith your gun laws. I am happy we generally do not feel that everybody walking around with a gun is the correct answer. QuotePlus TO is ranked that high when only talking about city limits. They don't have the densely populated outer lying suburbs like we do here. Not true, that is why we were talking about metropolitan areas and not cities. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhillyKev 0 #9 November 30, 2004 QuoteNot true, that is why we were talking about metropolitan areas and not cities. Well your listing was based on city limits, not metropolitan areas. If you go by Metropolitan areas, TO is 45th in the world, in fact in addition to the cities you listed in the US it also ranks below SF, Philly, and Boston. http://www.demographia.com/db-world-metro2000.htm And I could care less what you do with your gun laws, as well. My post was made because Canada is often used as an example of effective gun control. What I'm wondering is if it's so effective, why are people being shot and being found with stockpiles of weapons? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #10 November 30, 2004 QuoteWell your listing was based on city limits, not metropolitan areas. If you go by Metropolitan areas, TO is 45th in the world, in fact in addition to the cities you listed in the US it also ranks below SF, Philly, and Boston. http://www.demographia.com/db-world-metro2000.htm And I could care less what you do with your gun laws, as well. My post was made because Canada is often used as an example of effective gun control. What I'm wondering is if it's so effective, why are people being shot and being found with stockpiles of weapons? all depends on where you look. I don't think any law or restriction will ever have an absolute effect. Your question is like the following: If the death penalty is so effective why are people still getting murdered? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhillyKev 0 #11 November 30, 2004 QuoteYour question is like the following: If the death penalty is so effective why are people still getting murdered? Easy answer...because the death penalty is not effective. Again, my point is just that Canada's gun restrictions should be held up as an example of effective gun control. It's neither effective nor control. It's a law that's broken by criminals and obeyed by non-criminals, in effect, giving criminals an advantage, not making people safer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AndyMan 7 #12 November 30, 2004 QuotePlus TO is ranked that high when only talking about city limits. They don't have the densely populated outer lying suburbs like we do here. ??? Toronto has some of the worst examples of urban sprawl anywhere, especially in the North and East. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites IanHarrop 43 #13 November 30, 2004 QuotePoint is...once again, passing laws restricting guns doesn't keep criminals from getting them. Yep... you are absolutely correct. I am always amazed that I have to explain this to some people. The easiest way I found so far is to point out that laws against murder, theft, adultery and drunk driving don't stop those activities either!"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #14 November 30, 2004 QuoteIt's a law that's broken by criminals and obeyed by non-criminals Yes I do believe that would be close to the definition of a criminal. The only way to ensure that there are no criminals is to abolish all laws. Toronto is one of the most ethnically diverse cities in the world. On top of that it is one of the larger(est) metropolitan areas in the world. If you consider those facts, it really is amazing how safe the city is. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Remster 30 #15 November 30, 2004 QuoteIf you consider those facts, it really is amazing how safe the city is. If only it wasnt so borring.... Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JohnRich 4 #16 November 30, 2004 QuoteI am happy we generally do not feel that everybody walking around with a gun is the correct answer. Study: "Canadian Gun Registration Has Little Impact on Crime" National Center for Policy Analysis Quote: "One myth driving government action, Mauser argues, is that Canadian gun laws have kept citizens safe. In fact: * Handguns have been registered for more than 60 years, but gun crime is increasing -- especially handgun crime. * Since the mid-1970s, handgun homicides have increased from around 25 percent to almost 60 percent of gun homicides. * Since 1998, when the government started registering firearms, homicides involving firearms have also increased more than 20 percent." End quote. You are deluding yourself if you think that Canada's gun laws have anything to do with keeping you safe. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #17 November 30, 2004 QuoteYou are deluding yourself if you think that Canada's gun laws have anything to do with keeping you safe. Never said that was the case. Said that I am happy that as a society in general we generally do not feel that more guns makes us safer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhillyKev 0 #18 November 30, 2004 QuoteToronto is one of the most ethnically diverse cities in the world. On top of that it is one of the larger(est) metropolitan areas in the world. If you consider those facts, it really is amazing how safe the city is. I agree with that completely. And from John Rich: QuoteYou are deluding yourself if you think that Canada's gun laws have anything to do with keeping you safe. I also agree with that completely. Once again (or is this twice again...thrice again...?).... What I am saying is that using the example of Canada's gun control legislation as being responsible for reduced gun crime is ridiculous. Both of the quotes above are equally valid. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkyDekker 1,465 #19 November 30, 2004 QuoteOnce again (or is this twice again...thrice again...?).... What I am saying is that using the example of Canada's gun control legislation as being responsible for reduced gun crime is ridiculous. Both of the quotes above are equally valid. I agree. You are much better off indicating how generally polite Canadians are Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Iflyme 0 #20 November 30, 2004 ***You are deluding yourself if you think that Canada's gun laws have anything to do with keeping you safe. *** I think you are the delusional one. I'll keep supporting our gun laws, and keep urging that they become more stringent. Guns are made for one reason only: killing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhillyKev 0 #21 November 30, 2004 QuoteQuoteOnce again (or is this twice again...thrice again...?).... What I am saying is that using the example of Canada's gun control legislation as being responsible for reduced gun crime is ridiculous. Both of the quotes above are equally valid. I agree. You are much better off indicating how generally polite Canadians are Ok...now that one I'm going to have to argue with. Canadian's say sorry a lot and call you buddy a lot, and people attibute that to politeness. But I also saw some rude ass Canadians yesterday in line at Customs. The guy behind me (with Canadian passport in hand) says to me, "Can you watch my bag for me I think I dropped my boarding pass back there." I said, "No, sorry, that's the first they're going to ask me up at the counter." I was about to continue with...."but I'll save your spot in line" (after all, the only bag the guy had was a small shoulder bag anyway)...when he exclaimed, "Thanks a lot, freak!". I politely told him to "Fuck off, buddy." A short while later the guy proceeded to squeeze past me while I was turned around in line to get in front of me. (He never did go looking for his boarding pass..hmmm). I let that slide since I wasn't really in a rush and was almost at the counter so didn't wish to make a scene. Besides, when I got up to the customs agent, to my suprise they didn't ask me if anyone asked me to watch their bags for them. But, I felt it was my civic duty to volunteer that information and pointed out the polite Canadian who pushed past me in line and called me a freak, who was standing at the next booth over. Strangely enough, they took him into some side room..hmmm.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhillyKev 0 #22 November 30, 2004 QuoteGuns are made for one reason only: killing. That's arguable, but letting that slide, if that's truly your belief, why is it that you want laws whose sole purpose is to allow criminals to kill without fear of reprisal? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JohnRich 4 #23 November 30, 2004 QuoteGuns are made for one reason only: killing. Ah yes, another uninformed opinion from someone unwilling to reveal his name... If you really believe this, why aren't you willing to stand behind your statement, and be known for it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SpeedRacer 1 #24 November 30, 2004 QuoteGuns are made for one reason only: killing. I guess this is one of those "it's as simple as that" type of mentalities. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AndyMan 7 #25 November 30, 2004 Quote You are deluding yourself if you think that Canada's gun laws have anything to do with keeping you safe. You are deluding yourself if you think the NCPA is a respected organization. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 1 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. 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chuteless 1 #6 November 30, 2004 Phillykev....I thought for as minute that you were up here gunning for me..... Bill Cole Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #7 November 30, 2004 Considering you picked the cities that have the most stringent gun control and restrictions in the US, that's kind of bad comparison. Plus TO is ranked that high when only talking about city limits. They don't have the densely populated outer lying suburbs like we do here. But, just to make you happy, here's one stat for you. Aggravate assaults in TO are about 4 times as frequent per 100k people than NYC. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #8 November 30, 2004 QuoteConsidering you picked the cities that have the most stringent gun control and restrictions in the US, that's kind of bad comparison. Plus TO is ranked that high when only talking about city limits. They don't have the densely populated outer lying suburbs like we do here. But, just to make you happy, here's one stat for you. Aggravate assaults in TO are about 4 times as frequent per 100k people than NYC. I just picked the other large metropolitan areas on the list. I really could care less what you guys dow ith your gun laws. I am happy we generally do not feel that everybody walking around with a gun is the correct answer. QuotePlus TO is ranked that high when only talking about city limits. They don't have the densely populated outer lying suburbs like we do here. Not true, that is why we were talking about metropolitan areas and not cities. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #9 November 30, 2004 QuoteNot true, that is why we were talking about metropolitan areas and not cities. Well your listing was based on city limits, not metropolitan areas. If you go by Metropolitan areas, TO is 45th in the world, in fact in addition to the cities you listed in the US it also ranks below SF, Philly, and Boston. http://www.demographia.com/db-world-metro2000.htm And I could care less what you do with your gun laws, as well. My post was made because Canada is often used as an example of effective gun control. What I'm wondering is if it's so effective, why are people being shot and being found with stockpiles of weapons? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #10 November 30, 2004 QuoteWell your listing was based on city limits, not metropolitan areas. If you go by Metropolitan areas, TO is 45th in the world, in fact in addition to the cities you listed in the US it also ranks below SF, Philly, and Boston. http://www.demographia.com/db-world-metro2000.htm And I could care less what you do with your gun laws, as well. My post was made because Canada is often used as an example of effective gun control. What I'm wondering is if it's so effective, why are people being shot and being found with stockpiles of weapons? all depends on where you look. I don't think any law or restriction will ever have an absolute effect. Your question is like the following: If the death penalty is so effective why are people still getting murdered? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #11 November 30, 2004 QuoteYour question is like the following: If the death penalty is so effective why are people still getting murdered? Easy answer...because the death penalty is not effective. Again, my point is just that Canada's gun restrictions should be held up as an example of effective gun control. It's neither effective nor control. It's a law that's broken by criminals and obeyed by non-criminals, in effect, giving criminals an advantage, not making people safer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #12 November 30, 2004 QuotePlus TO is ranked that high when only talking about city limits. They don't have the densely populated outer lying suburbs like we do here. ??? Toronto has some of the worst examples of urban sprawl anywhere, especially in the North and East. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IanHarrop 43 #13 November 30, 2004 QuotePoint is...once again, passing laws restricting guns doesn't keep criminals from getting them. Yep... you are absolutely correct. I am always amazed that I have to explain this to some people. The easiest way I found so far is to point out that laws against murder, theft, adultery and drunk driving don't stop those activities either!"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #14 November 30, 2004 QuoteIt's a law that's broken by criminals and obeyed by non-criminals Yes I do believe that would be close to the definition of a criminal. The only way to ensure that there are no criminals is to abolish all laws. Toronto is one of the most ethnically diverse cities in the world. On top of that it is one of the larger(est) metropolitan areas in the world. If you consider those facts, it really is amazing how safe the city is. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 30 #15 November 30, 2004 QuoteIf you consider those facts, it really is amazing how safe the city is. If only it wasnt so borring.... Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #16 November 30, 2004 QuoteI am happy we generally do not feel that everybody walking around with a gun is the correct answer. Study: "Canadian Gun Registration Has Little Impact on Crime" National Center for Policy Analysis Quote: "One myth driving government action, Mauser argues, is that Canadian gun laws have kept citizens safe. In fact: * Handguns have been registered for more than 60 years, but gun crime is increasing -- especially handgun crime. * Since the mid-1970s, handgun homicides have increased from around 25 percent to almost 60 percent of gun homicides. * Since 1998, when the government started registering firearms, homicides involving firearms have also increased more than 20 percent." End quote. You are deluding yourself if you think that Canada's gun laws have anything to do with keeping you safe. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #17 November 30, 2004 QuoteYou are deluding yourself if you think that Canada's gun laws have anything to do with keeping you safe. Never said that was the case. Said that I am happy that as a society in general we generally do not feel that more guns makes us safer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #18 November 30, 2004 QuoteToronto is one of the most ethnically diverse cities in the world. On top of that it is one of the larger(est) metropolitan areas in the world. If you consider those facts, it really is amazing how safe the city is. I agree with that completely. And from John Rich: QuoteYou are deluding yourself if you think that Canada's gun laws have anything to do with keeping you safe. I also agree with that completely. Once again (or is this twice again...thrice again...?).... What I am saying is that using the example of Canada's gun control legislation as being responsible for reduced gun crime is ridiculous. Both of the quotes above are equally valid. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #19 November 30, 2004 QuoteOnce again (or is this twice again...thrice again...?).... What I am saying is that using the example of Canada's gun control legislation as being responsible for reduced gun crime is ridiculous. Both of the quotes above are equally valid. I agree. You are much better off indicating how generally polite Canadians are Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Iflyme 0 #20 November 30, 2004 ***You are deluding yourself if you think that Canada's gun laws have anything to do with keeping you safe. *** I think you are the delusional one. I'll keep supporting our gun laws, and keep urging that they become more stringent. Guns are made for one reason only: killing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #21 November 30, 2004 QuoteQuoteOnce again (or is this twice again...thrice again...?).... What I am saying is that using the example of Canada's gun control legislation as being responsible for reduced gun crime is ridiculous. Both of the quotes above are equally valid. I agree. You are much better off indicating how generally polite Canadians are Ok...now that one I'm going to have to argue with. Canadian's say sorry a lot and call you buddy a lot, and people attibute that to politeness. But I also saw some rude ass Canadians yesterday in line at Customs. The guy behind me (with Canadian passport in hand) says to me, "Can you watch my bag for me I think I dropped my boarding pass back there." I said, "No, sorry, that's the first they're going to ask me up at the counter." I was about to continue with...."but I'll save your spot in line" (after all, the only bag the guy had was a small shoulder bag anyway)...when he exclaimed, "Thanks a lot, freak!". I politely told him to "Fuck off, buddy." A short while later the guy proceeded to squeeze past me while I was turned around in line to get in front of me. (He never did go looking for his boarding pass..hmmm). I let that slide since I wasn't really in a rush and was almost at the counter so didn't wish to make a scene. Besides, when I got up to the customs agent, to my suprise they didn't ask me if anyone asked me to watch their bags for them. But, I felt it was my civic duty to volunteer that information and pointed out the polite Canadian who pushed past me in line and called me a freak, who was standing at the next booth over. Strangely enough, they took him into some side room..hmmm.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #22 November 30, 2004 QuoteGuns are made for one reason only: killing. That's arguable, but letting that slide, if that's truly your belief, why is it that you want laws whose sole purpose is to allow criminals to kill without fear of reprisal? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #23 November 30, 2004 QuoteGuns are made for one reason only: killing. Ah yes, another uninformed opinion from someone unwilling to reveal his name... If you really believe this, why aren't you willing to stand behind your statement, and be known for it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #24 November 30, 2004 QuoteGuns are made for one reason only: killing. I guess this is one of those "it's as simple as that" type of mentalities. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #25 November 30, 2004 Quote You are deluding yourself if you think that Canada's gun laws have anything to do with keeping you safe. You are deluding yourself if you think the NCPA is a respected organization. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
