billvon 3,131 #26 October 29, 2004 >Had you said republicans, I would not have said peep. Fair enough comment. I will change it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #27 October 29, 2004 Well, I am will not argue loudly, because honestly I am partially ignorant. I have nto had time to follow this. However, I thought I heard early on that the weapons in question did not have IAEA seals?-- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #28 October 29, 2004 My hat tips to you, and I owe you a beer -- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheAnvil 0 #29 October 29, 2004 Utterly astounding. Since your 'Bush didn't guard the ammo dumps' nonsense has no hope of withstanding even rudimentary analysis, you attempt to shift the subject back to Bush/Rumsfeld not agree with Gen. Shinseki. Quiiiiite humorous. Don't you realize how much of a chuckle those of us who are actually intimately familiar with the military are getting out of such shenanigans? Streets of Baghdad completely unsafe? Completely? No. Sorry. Doesn't compute. Again - stating such to those of us with friends and family over there just gives us a chuckle. I do blast certain books, though I'm not sure to which one you're referring. If you can find error in Mr. Bozell's conclusions, by all means present them. Read the chapter from the book and then attempt to refute his conclusions. You miss my point with regards to the analogy. Neither statement holds water. Period. Keep trying though. Vinny the Anvil Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL JACKASS POWER!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,131 #30 October 29, 2004 >However, I thought I heard early on that the weapons in question did >not have IAEA seals? http://kstp.com/article/stories/S3741.html?cat=1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #31 October 29, 2004 QuoteSince your 'Bush didn't guard the ammo dumps' nonsense has no hope of withstanding even rudimentary analysis, you attempt to shift the subject back to Bush/Rumsfeld not agree with Gen. Shinseki. Ummm, that's not shifting, that's the crux of the problem. One is the cause of the other. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 0 #32 October 29, 2004 Quote>Had you said republicans, I would not have said peep. Fair enough comment. I will change it. Why not change it to what it is really is and say Guiliani blames the troops. - Jim"Like" - The modern day comma Good bye, my friends. You are missed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #33 October 29, 2004 Yes, I understand that. But the 'missing weapons' I thought they were not determined on the seal issue?-- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #34 October 29, 2004 QuoteWhy not change it to what it is really is and say Guiliani blames the troops. Because, like most of the left, he'd rather stereotype a large group of people for what one person has said. This is EXACTLY the type of bullshit reporting that we see in many of the media outlets. The headline says one thing (so Kerry has something to talk about) and the details say something else (so he can look stupid when people intelligent enough to read take a closer look).Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,131 #35 October 29, 2004 >Because, like most of the left, he'd rather stereotype a large group >of people for what one person has said. Actually it's because someone here asked me to change it to that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #36 October 29, 2004 ... and how does that change what my comment is getting at? You're still doing it. Now instead of the official GOP, you're stereotyping Republicans. Like someone mentioned. Being HONEST would be to say that Giuliani says... But that's not what you were going for, was it?Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mardigrasbob 0 #37 October 29, 2004 QuoteRudy Guiliani, while stumping for the president, found a novel way to deal with the missing-explosives issue - blame the troops. Denying the issue isn't working, and a simple "hey, so some explosives went missing; we'll do better next time" isn't an option, so following the old shit-rolls-downhill philosophy, our troops in Iraq were an obvious target: "No matter how you try to blame it on the president, the actual responsibility for it really would be for the troops that were there. Did they search carefully enough?" http://1010wins.com/topstories/winstopstories_story_302174510.html I saw this coming, Republicans are all liars unless they say something the Dems consider damaging to the Republicans. I resist the urge to say exactly how I feel because I do not want to get exiled before I can laugh at all the liberal $%#&@ on Nov.3. Hopefully all the naive, uninformed, anti-patriotic and cowardise attacks on our leaders, troops, and citizens will end. Siding with the terrorists because you disagree with American policies is traitorous. The venom spewed by the anti-Bush and pro-socialist community not only encourages the evil-doers but also helps in their recruiting efforts. The majority of the news outlets pounce on every negative report; regardless of it's validity, age or origin. I have not seen a single Iraqi flying a kite, or the peaceful commerce that is occurring every day. This election is not about Kerry v. Bush; it is about Bush v. notBush. ------------------ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #38 October 29, 2004 Actually I just stated the conditions under which I would not have commented. In any case, I honor Bill's response as courtesy to my comments. I was impressed. I still think the whole issue is a source of disagreement, and honestly have nothing to add that will truly be productive.-- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,131 #39 October 29, 2004 >Now instead of the official GOP, you're stereotyping Republicans. Tell ya what. Talk to FlyingFerret and decide amongst yourselves what thread title you would prefer that gives it just the right spin. That way I don't have to change it eight times. >Being HONEST would be to say that Giuliani says... >But that's not what you were going for, was it? Of course not! I'm a liberal, so when I say that republicans blame the troops it's a filthy lie told to mislead people. When a republican says that democrats are giving people crack to vote for them, why, they are bastions of truth, and democrats just can't handle that. It's not what's said, it's who says it! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #40 October 29, 2004 QuoteOf course not! I'm a liberal, so when I say that republicans blame the troops it's a filthy lie told to mislead people. When a republican says that democrats are giving people crack to vote for them, why, they are bastions of truth, and democrats just can't handle that. Cry me a river. QuoteIt's not what's said, it's who says it! RIGHT! And who said it? Republicans, or was it just Giuliani. When one person says something, wouldn't it be more honest just to say they did? Or did you just want to generalize about all republicans? You're being shady about this and you know it. I don't give a shit what you change the title to, you've shown your colors already. Those of us who know, always see the spin in your anti-Bush posts anyway. ...now come back with the but but but... THEY did it over here!! excuse. Then we'll have the discussion about how we don't really want to stoop to "their" level. Blah blah blah.Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,174 #41 October 29, 2004 QuoteIF it is proven that the weapons were moved under our watch, then I believe the burden falls upon a field commander, if that is how you define troops. Hierarchical leadership is all about delegation, not micromanagement. Sometimes delegation falls, sometimes best efforts are not enough. I suspect the troops did exactly as they were ordered to do - protect the oil facilities. When the mission itself is unclear (get rid of WMDs, or was it eliminate SH and his sons, or was it root out Al Qaeda.....) you can hardly blame the troops in the field (whatever their rank). The Buck stops where?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,131 #42 October 29, 2004 >When one person says something, wouldn't it be more honest just to >say they did? Or did you just want to generalize about all republicans? Like I said, talk to FlyingFerret and decide what the title of the thread should be. I've already changed it once at someone else's request. >I don't give a shit what you change the title to . . . . An interesting conclusion to a complaint about a thread title. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pajarito 0 #43 October 29, 2004 QuoteThe Buck stops where? Nowhere until you know for sure someone is in error. You need to have all the facts. I picture you as a detail oriented person. You should agree with that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 0 #44 October 29, 2004 QuoteTell ya what. Talk to FlyingFerret and decide amongst yourselves what thread title you would prefer that gives it just the right spin. That way I don't have to change it eight times. Bill, it's not about spin, it's about honesty. The most HONEST title you could have given this thread is Guiliani blames the troops, and you know it. - Jim"Like" - The modern day comma Good bye, my friends. You are missed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #45 October 29, 2004 If you're not going to read all of what I write, or selectively respond to parts of a sentence. There's not much I can do here. Like I said, no matter what you change the title to.. the first 2 reflect your attempt to stereotype everyone in a group for what was said by one person. You know what you were trying to do, debate it with yourself if it helps.Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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