TypicalFish 0 #1 October 15, 2004 Though I do not neccessarily think it was a good idea for Kerry to use her in particular as an example, I was watching the debates, and he was answering a question; in fact, if it had been any other lesbian it could have been interpreted as respectful. I am wondering if all of the furor over it is being generated by the media because they FINALLY have an excuse to talk about "Cheney's Lezbo Daughter"... Thoughts?"I gargle no man's balls..." ussfpa on SOCNET Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #2 October 15, 2004 Cheney opened the door in the VP debate. It was still a low blow from Kerry... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
markd_nscr986 0 #3 October 15, 2004 And,the question of the hour is why make political hay of it?Who cares if his daughter is gay?Marc SCR 6046 SCS 3004 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrunkMonkey 0 #4 October 15, 2004 QuoteAnd,the question of the hour is why make political hay of it?Who cares if his daughter is gay? Because since the GOP was co-opted by the Religious Right (a double misnomer), Cheney has been part of the political regime that has systematically stood in opposition to the majority of the platform of the Gay/Lesbian community... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tigra 0 #5 October 15, 2004 It was NOT a low blow. Cheney himself has brought it up numerous times during the campaign, not just the debate, and furthermore, nothing disrespectful was said. A republican candidate for senator in Illinois said far worse to the press last month, and much less fuss was made over it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
markd_nscr986 0 #6 October 15, 2004 ***Because since the GOP was co-opted by the Religious Right (a double misnomer), Cheney has been part of the political regime that has systematically stood in opposition to the majority of the platform of the Gay/Lesbian community... I dont agree with your assessment that the religious right has taken over the GOP.....My issue with the Dems is dragging the man's family into it....This will probably come as a surprise to some but just because people affiliate with one party or another doesnt mean they agree with every plank of the party's platform,Cheney included!Marc SCR 6046 SCS 3004 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tigra 0 #7 October 15, 2004 Cheney dragged his daughter into this, not the dems. And when a REPUBLICAN candidate made extremely offensive statements, the Cheneys did not whine to the press about it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #8 October 15, 2004 I have to give credit to Bill O'Reilly who I heard commenting about this. Basically he was questioning why anyone was making a big deal about it. She is gay, she is not in the closet, and all he did was answer the question about whether people are gay by choice by saying if you ask her (a well known lesbian loosely attached to the current election race) that she would say she was born that way. The republican pundit he was talking to was trying to claim that Kerry was trying to drive conservative voters away from Bush because his VP has a lesbian daugher. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #9 October 15, 2004 If you were black... And you called your friend a nigger... That's o.k... But if a white guy calls your friend a nigger you start to understand what I am talking about........ Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
narcimund 0 #10 October 15, 2004 QuoteIf you were black... And you called your friend a nigger... That's o.k... But if a white guy calls your friend a nigger you start to understand what I am talking about........ Rhino Not even a close analogy. "Nigger" is CLEARLY a bitter, vicious insult (when delivered by the white guy in your example above.) "Lesbian" in this context was CLEARLY a neutral, informational label, much like "african american" would be in your example above. Now, if Kerry had said, "Cheney's daughter is a cunt-licking, disease-brewing, man-hating bulldyke" then I'd give your analogy credit. Since he didn't do that, I'd say you're disingenuously inventing scandal where none exists. But then again as I noted in another thread, "If it isn't a partisan attack, it doesn't exist." First Class Citizen Twice Over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tigra 0 #11 October 15, 2004 That's a totally wrong analogy! Puhleeze! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #12 October 15, 2004 I think is is a perfect analogy... If I want to talk about my daughter that is one thing.. If you do it I will kick your ass... That is how it goes... Someone needs to inject COMMON SENSE in here!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dagny 0 #13 October 15, 2004 Cheney's daughter is a LESBIAN???? Take me, I am the drug; take me, I am hallucinogenic. -Salvador Dali Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,589 #14 October 15, 2004 QuoteIf I want to talk about my daughter that is one thing.. If you do it I will kick your ass... But it wasn't Cheney who was saying the really offensive things -- it was some other Republican. Would it be OK with you if a Marine called your daughter (I don't think you have one, so this should be OK -- I don't call people things like this) a worthless piece of cum-sucking lard-filled blubber? And then you'd kick the ass of someone you didn't care for because he pointed out that she was overweight? Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
narcimund 0 #15 October 15, 2004 Your "perfect analogy" was about the words "lesbian" vs. "nigger". I proposed that "nigger" (which is insulting) was a ridiculous analogy and "african american" (which is not) would be closer. If black people aren't offended by whatever the word is, then we can safely assume it's not offensive. I'm gay and I'm not offended by the word "lesbian". I haven't met a gay person of either gender who would find Kerry's remark offensive. Quite the opposite. So your analogy is bunk. Now, if you want to bring up OTHER issues (like "leave my daughter out of it!") which have nothing to do with the emotional impact of the words "nigger" or "lesbian", please address those separately. They might or might not hold water, but they are NOT support for your "perfect analogy". First Class Citizen Twice Over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
complexity 0 #16 October 15, 2004 Cheney never opened up this issue to the debates. In fact, he rarely brings her into the issue. Thats his personal life and his daughter's personal life. I am sorry, but Cheney's daughter's sexuality should not be discussed and exploited as thats her personal life. The fact is that Kerry --and Edwards -- could have made the points they were making without bringing up Cheney's daughter. Its probably hard enough for her to be a lesbian and deal with the negativity from others. You know, you can be supportive and loving towards individuals who are gay, without believing that the federal government should get involved. Thats where Cheney is. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f1shlips 2 #17 October 15, 2004 Naa... she's not hot. Oh, wait, that's not what you are talking about.-- drop zone (drop'zone) n. An incestuous sesspool of broken people. -- Attributed to a whuffo girlfriend. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #18 October 15, 2004 QuoteIf I want to talk about my daughter that is one thing.. If you do it I will kick your ass... He wasn't making a statement about her that is anything other than fact. If I said "your daughter is a female" are you going to kick my ass? The only way this could be viewed as an insult is if you view being a lesbian as something bad. And I'll take a page from Kerry and go out on a limb and say that "Dick Cheney's daugher, a lesbian, probably wouldn't feel that way." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #19 October 15, 2004 QuoteIts probably hard enough for her to be a lesbian and deal with the negativity from others. What negativity are you talking about. She is a lesbian, it is a fact. She is an admitted lesbian and doesn't try to hide it. The only way calling her a lesbian could be construed as negativity is if the speaker was using it as an epithet, which he wasn't, or if the person hearing it thinks there's something wrong with being a lesbian. But that's the fault of the person hearing it, not the speaker. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
narcimund 0 #20 October 15, 2004 Quote Someone needs to inject COMMON SENSE in here!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If "common sense" means "use any flagrantly disingenuous, cobbled-together emotionally-loaded nonsense you can piece together to pick a fight with," then this is an excellent example. "If it isn't a partisan attack, it doesn't exist." First Class Citizen Twice Over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
complexity 0 #21 October 15, 2004 QuoteQuoteIf I want to talk about my daughter that is one thing.. If you do it I will kick your ass... He wasn't making a statement about her that is anything other than fact. If I said "your daughter is a female" are you going to kick my ass? The only way this could be viewed as an insult is if you view being a lesbian as something bad. And I'll take a page from Kerry and go out on a limb and say that "Dick Cheney's daugher, a lesbian, probably wouldn't feel that way." yes, but one's sexuality is considered to be something private still in our society. There is nothing wrong with it but you don't use another person to make your point (which is what Kerry did). Kerry could make his point without getting personal. And as much as we don't want it to be, it is a sensitive issue still - thats why it IS an issue. It takes a lot for someone who is gay to come out and for family members to understand and accept. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tigra 0 #22 October 15, 2004 Your analogy was beyond ridiculous! In fact, it was crude and offensive. But, here's the common sense. Everyone knows that when you run for political office, your personal life and those of your of your family members become very public. Second, Cheney has been very open about the fact that he has a gay daughter. (Some could even argue that he's used this to his political advantage.) The topic of his daughter has come up repeatedly throughout this election season, largely due to that fact that Bush has taken a firm (and IMO ridiculous) stance against gay marriage. Gay marriage and gay rights are an issue in this election. More common sense, Kerry said nothing even remotely derogatory about Mr. Cheney's daughter. Referring to an openly gay person as gay is not derogatory. No slurs, no offensive words were used. More common sense- Mrs. Cheney is doing the political posturing by whining about it to the press, especially when very little fuss was made about a fellow republican's truly offensive comments. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #23 October 15, 2004 Yes.. That Marine would get his ass kicked... What is your point? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #24 October 15, 2004 QuoteSo your analogy is bunk. That's your opinion... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
complexity 0 #25 October 15, 2004 if you are talkling about Alan Keyes and his comments... well, no one should even acknowledge him, especially the presidential candidates. He is a total wacko close-minded candidate who has absolutely no chance of winning. Why waste their time making an issue of what Keyes says when they don't like the issue to begin with and he is such a blight on the compassionate conservates that Bush/Cheney want to be recognized as? Anyway, its politics. It doesn't make sense and both sides are hypocritical. Thats the name of the game. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
