JohnRich 4 #1 August 11, 2004 In the news: Mr Howard said that since Labour came to power in 1997 (when handguns and semi-auto long guns were confiscated) gun crime had doubled, robbery was up by more than half and violent crime had risen by 83 per cent. Last year it reached the one million mark for the first time - more than 100 violent crimes every hour. He said he would scrap Labour's "dangerous" programme of releasing prisoners early if they wore electronic tags. Since the scheme was introduced in 1999, more than 3,500 crimes, including nine serious sexual crimes, had been committed by prisoners let out early. Launching a strong attack on "sociological mumbo jumbo" and the "no blame" culture, the Conservative leader condemned Labour's record on crime as "the politics of the madhouse". He accused it of downgrading prison as a punishment and said the Tories would lift the "arbitrary" 80,000 limit on the prison population, build more jails and introduce a tougher penal regime. Mr Howard blamed a "dramatic decline" in personal responsibility for rising crime. The distinction between right and wrong had become blurred and "I've got my rights" was the verbal equivalent of sticking two fingers up to authority. Source: London Telegraph Gosh, it sounds like he finally understands the root cause of crime - it's culture. Not the ownership of guns. Now, give all the guns back while you're at it, Mr. Howard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,608 #2 August 11, 2004 As the leader of the opposition it's Mr Howards job to say things like this. Now if he can explain how he will build and staff several new prisons whilst improving other public services and cutting taxes at the same time, well then I will be impressed.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #3 August 11, 2004 Interesting. I already had read plenty of articles that indicate that England has turned into a madhouse of thuggery, rampant criminality, hooliganism, and fear on the part of the law-abiding. I didn't know that there were many people trying to stand up for law and order. I have a problem, though, with Michael Howard's apparent support for a policy of being able to have police simply stop people on the street. This, combined with the erosion of privacy and the institution of citizens being watched nearly every minute they are out in public -- a la 1984 -- are troubling developments. While I would want the authorities to be "hard on crime," I do not think that warrantless searches are the way to accomplish that. And I question the chances of success for a society to be able to ENFORCE its way to civil behavior and law-abidingness. If such large numbers of people are prone to reckless criminality, as seems to be an increasing trend in England, all I can see happening if the police "crack down" is that there will either be a lot of frustrated would-be criminals, or a lot more people arrested, tried and incarcerated. I think of it as an analogy: If I owned 10 large dogs, and I needed them to stay on my property, I would much rather have them well-behaved and trained to stay there, than have them constantly be trying to get out, but have a really good fence. If the dogs are well-behaved, it won't matter, really, if I get lax and leave the gate open once in a while. So wouldn't it be better if, somehow, England could address this rampant rise in lawlessness rather than simply try to rule over it with harsh policing? --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #4 August 11, 2004 QuoteAs the leader of the opposition it's Mr Howards job to say things like this. Now if he can explain how he will build and staff several new prisons whilst improving other public services and cutting taxes at the same time, well then I will be impressed. Whoa whoa whoa... Wouldn't that mean that JOHN KERRY would also be obligated to explain HOW he plans to create a new American Utopia without increasing the size of government, raising taxes, or building prisons to house criminals? Or maybe how he plans to create world peace without eliminating any of the enemies who swear to destroy us or die trying? I mean, he talks a lot of shit about how good he's gonna make everything, sure, but he never explains beyond vague, dreamy, ethereal terms how the hell he's going to do anything. You mean these things don't pay for themselves?? --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,608 #5 August 11, 2004 QuoteI already had read plenty of articles that indicate that England has turned into a madhouse of thuggery, rampant criminality, hooliganism, Only at football matchesDo you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,608 #6 August 11, 2004 Here's what I know about John Kerry, 1) went to vietnam, 2) running for president. So if you're comparing him to Howard (different sides of the political spectrum by the way) then I won't have a clue what you're talking about. If on the other hand you're just hijacking this thread to turn it into another dem vs rep debate then I guess I'd better find something else to do.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
D22369 0 #7 August 12, 2004 I mean, he talks a lot of shit about how good he's gonna make everything, sure, but he never explains beyond vague, dreamy, ethereal terms how the hell he's going to do anything. Quote ummm, in every election they ALL do this.....promise this / promise that....they bob and weave around HOW they will accomplish what they promise. --> just pointing out how you can spot a politician lying.....>> his lips are moving RoyThey say I suffer from insanity.... But I actually enjoy it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Skyrad 0 #8 August 12, 2004 Desperate times call for desperate measures Jeffery.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kelpdiver 2 #9 August 12, 2004 Quote So wouldn't it be better if, somehow, England could address this rampant rise in lawlessness rather than simply try to rule over it with harsh policing? - Doesn't seem any different from how we're not handling the problem of lawlessness. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nacmacfeegle 0 #10 August 12, 2004 "Desperate times call for desperate measures Jeffery." So you are considering moving to Scotland?-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mr2mk1g 10 #11 August 12, 2004 Man, that would be desperate! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nacmacfeegle 0 #12 August 12, 2004 Well...Scotland has not " turned into a madhouse of thuggery, rampant criminality, hooliganism, and fear on the part of the law-abiding." In fact we have enjoyed a reduction in crime of late. But yeah, I hear what you are saying.-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Newbie 0 #13 August 12, 2004 QuoteInteresting. I already had read plenty of articles that indicate that England has turned into a madhouse of thuggery, rampant criminality, hooliganism, and fear on the part of the law-abiding. I didn't know that there were many people trying to stand up for law and order. where on earth are you getting this stuff from? Even on a bad day here in the UK, we pale into insignificance with what the US will see on a bad day. Sure we might be experiencing more vehicular vandalism and "pushing and shoving" (yes, if you push and shove someone, without even laying a fist or kick on them, it is classified as a "violent crime" by the police. Meanwhile, let's see what's going on in your country today: Teenager bomb maker caught with 18 bombs at home/in car Louisiana serial killer convicted Father and 3 yr old son shot at by road rage nutcase Man kills wife's parents after arguements with her Gunman opens fire on pickup 12 year old reportedly raped by 3 men And let's not forget 4 charged with Xbox slayings (ok, this one was on the weekend, but it's ongoing so thought i would post it up) Meanwhile, some of the headlines for us today: War on litter/graffiti urged How to become a qualified wheel clamper Diana Memorial Fountain to reopen [url "http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/3557266.stm"> Arrests for minor offences proposed Grouse hunting season 'no so glorious' [url "http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/3557506.stm" Kelloggs denies breakfast cereals unhealthy for children [/url] "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites miked10270 0 #14 August 12, 2004 Oh my God, Please, PLEASE not the "Diana Memorial Fountain" reopening. That thing is positively lethal.... Last time it was opened it injured 4 people. OK, they were mere peasants, but it still nearly killed them. I thought you were posting good news stories from Britain. Mike. . Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Newbie 0 #15 August 12, 2004 nope just posting what happened to be classified as "Main Headline" news in the UK today from BBC and Guardian sites. i would love to take a toob to the Diana memorial "foutain" (see:water slide) "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JohnRich 4 #16 August 12, 2004 Quotewhere on earth are you getting this stuff from? Even on a bad day here in the UK, we pale into insignificance with what the US will see on a bad day. Report: Crime and Justice in the United States and England and Wales, 1981-96 "Crime rates as measured in victim surveys are all higher in England than the United States. Crime rates as measured in police statistics are higher in England for half of the measured crime types. A person committing serious crime in the United States is generally more likely than one in England to be caught, convicted, and incarcerated. Incarceration sentences are also generally longer in the United States than England."Full Report Your simplistic headline selection is not a scientific survey. For one thing, since the U.S. has five times the population of England, even if crime rates were equal, you would see five times more crime headlines in U.S. papers. You must adjust the crime reports to a standard basis for comparision, which is per 100,000 population. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Newbie 0 #17 August 12, 2004 that report is somewhat out of date don't you think John? (1981-1996). I don't think the UK is a small country (65 million people), it is made up of large, densely populated areas like the US. Sure, you could argue less people = less crime in general, but look at the nature of what is being reported across the UK in the newspaper, compared to the crime being reported today in the US. Of course, there will be more crimes being committed in the US, but look at the nature of the crimes....i would argue there are instances of far more violent episodes than what we are experiencing here. It's the nature of the crime you should focus on, rather than the numbers, which is what i was focusing on in my first post. "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Kennedy 0 #18 August 12, 2004 Quotewhere on earth are you getting this stuff from? Even on a bad day here in the UK, we pale into insignificance with what the US will see on a bad day. Sure we might be experiencing more vehicular vandalism and "pushing and shoving" (yes, if you push and shove someone, without even laying a fist or kick on them, it is classified as a "violent crime" by the police. OK class, welcome to Criminology and Criminal Justice 101 Today, we will be discussing the definition of "assault." Quote...a handful of articles... What, you think you couldn't find just as many useless articles in the telegraph or BBC? Hell, even CNN International would have that many stories on the UK. It's really quite simple. Our problem is going down, and has been for years. Theirs is going up (it is actually approaching ours now). As much as you bash the US for crime problems, at least we're successfully addressing them. The UK (ok, England anyway) is spiraling out of control.witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites christelsabine 1 #19 August 12, 2004 ***In the news: ...... Not the ownership of guns. *** Mr. John Rich still is giving his very best to convince the poor, ignorant non-Americans: Gun ownership to everybody! This is ultimate answer to turn the world into a peaceful place. Forget about your culture. Amen. dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites turtlespeed 226 #20 August 12, 2004 Quote***In the news: ...... Not the ownership of guns. *** Mr. John Rich still is giving his very best to convince the poor, ignorant non-Americans: Gun ownership to everybody! This is ultimate answer to turn the world into a peaceful place. Forget about your culture. Amen. HEY JOHN - She gets it! [Happy Dance]I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites peacefuljeffrey 0 #21 August 12, 2004 QuoteI mean, he talks a lot of shit about how good he's gonna make everything, sure, but he never explains beyond vague, dreamy, ethereal terms how the hell he's going to do anything. Quote ummm, in every election they ALL do this.....promise this / promise that....they bob and weave around HOW they will accomplish what they promise. --> just pointing out how you can spot a politician lying.....>> his lips are moving Roy Some promises are more, or less, believable than others. Before I decide whether to believe one, I take the measure of just how likely it is to be able to make good on the promise and complete the promised act. When it comes to Kerry, I don't find him believable. When it comes to Bush, probably not too believable either, but I prefer someone who goes out and kicks ass over one who I believe won't; and I will go with the proven pro-gunner over the proven anti-gunner every single time. --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites peacefuljeffrey 0 #22 August 12, 2004 QuoteDesperate times call for desperate measures Jeffery. You don't seem too desperate to spell my name right. --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Newbie 0 #23 August 13, 2004 don't get me wrong Kennedy, i knwo the US has made leaps and bounds in addressing it's problems, with zero tolerance policing etc etc, look at NYC as an example of the good stuff that can happen. All i'm saying is that, on a crime by crime basis, what we tend to see is a far higher insidence of violent, mindless crime in the US than we do here in the UK. This is speaking from experience (26+ years living in London, approx 2 years living in Nor California a couple of years back). "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Kennedy 0 #24 August 13, 2004 Quotelook at NYC as an example of the good stuff that can happen OK, ok, ok, just need to get this laughing under control. Whew, ok. Um, no. NYC is a good example of how big brother can happen. Their crime rates (city and state) have not been doing anything wonderful. Many other areas (with far fewer cops per capita) have done much better in reducing their crime rates. QuoteAll i'm saying is that, on a crime by crime basis, what we tend to see is a far higher insidence of violent, mindless crime in the US than we do here in the UK. This is speaking from experience (26+ years living in London, approx 2 years living in Nor California a couple of years back). Understood. All I'm saying is if things keep going the way they are right now, you won't be able to say that in five or ten years. And your experience is underwhelming. Two whole yeras, huh? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JohnRich 4 #25 August 13, 2004 Quoteon a crime by crime basis, what we tend to see is a far higher insidence of violent, mindless crime in the US than we do here in the UK. London Telegraph: Guns blow a hole in the argument THERE was much indignation yesterday about the claim by CBS News that Britain is riddled with crime. Believe it or not, Dan Rather is right. There are many more burglaries and thefts in Britain than America and, "contact" crime is higher. This includes assaults, robberies and rapes. The 1996 victimisation survey, conducted before big falls in American crime, showed the risk of contact crime as higher in England and Wales than anywhere else. The main reason for a much lower burglary rate in America is householders' propensity to shoot intruders. They do so without fear of being dragged before courts and jailed for life. The most recent crime statistics from Britain show that in 1998 there were 963 offences of violence against the person for every 100,000 people, while in America the rate was 566. The trend in America is down while in Britain, it is up - violent crime has risen more than 10 per cent. Source Article Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 1 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. 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Skyrad 0 #8 August 12, 2004 Desperate times call for desperate measures Jeffery.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #9 August 12, 2004 Quote So wouldn't it be better if, somehow, England could address this rampant rise in lawlessness rather than simply try to rule over it with harsh policing? - Doesn't seem any different from how we're not handling the problem of lawlessness. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nacmacfeegle 0 #10 August 12, 2004 "Desperate times call for desperate measures Jeffery." So you are considering moving to Scotland?-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #11 August 12, 2004 Man, that would be desperate! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nacmacfeegle 0 #12 August 12, 2004 Well...Scotland has not " turned into a madhouse of thuggery, rampant criminality, hooliganism, and fear on the part of the law-abiding." In fact we have enjoyed a reduction in crime of late. But yeah, I hear what you are saying.-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Newbie 0 #13 August 12, 2004 QuoteInteresting. I already had read plenty of articles that indicate that England has turned into a madhouse of thuggery, rampant criminality, hooliganism, and fear on the part of the law-abiding. I didn't know that there were many people trying to stand up for law and order. where on earth are you getting this stuff from? Even on a bad day here in the UK, we pale into insignificance with what the US will see on a bad day. Sure we might be experiencing more vehicular vandalism and "pushing and shoving" (yes, if you push and shove someone, without even laying a fist or kick on them, it is classified as a "violent crime" by the police. Meanwhile, let's see what's going on in your country today: Teenager bomb maker caught with 18 bombs at home/in car Louisiana serial killer convicted Father and 3 yr old son shot at by road rage nutcase Man kills wife's parents after arguements with her Gunman opens fire on pickup 12 year old reportedly raped by 3 men And let's not forget 4 charged with Xbox slayings (ok, this one was on the weekend, but it's ongoing so thought i would post it up) Meanwhile, some of the headlines for us today: War on litter/graffiti urged How to become a qualified wheel clamper Diana Memorial Fountain to reopen [url "http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/3557266.stm"> Arrests for minor offences proposed Grouse hunting season 'no so glorious' [url "http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/3557506.stm" Kelloggs denies breakfast cereals unhealthy for children [/url] "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
miked10270 0 #14 August 12, 2004 Oh my God, Please, PLEASE not the "Diana Memorial Fountain" reopening. That thing is positively lethal.... Last time it was opened it injured 4 people. OK, they were mere peasants, but it still nearly killed them. I thought you were posting good news stories from Britain. Mike. . Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable. Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Newbie 0 #15 August 12, 2004 nope just posting what happened to be classified as "Main Headline" news in the UK today from BBC and Guardian sites. i would love to take a toob to the Diana memorial "foutain" (see:water slide) "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #16 August 12, 2004 Quotewhere on earth are you getting this stuff from? Even on a bad day here in the UK, we pale into insignificance with what the US will see on a bad day. Report: Crime and Justice in the United States and England and Wales, 1981-96 "Crime rates as measured in victim surveys are all higher in England than the United States. Crime rates as measured in police statistics are higher in England for half of the measured crime types. A person committing serious crime in the United States is generally more likely than one in England to be caught, convicted, and incarcerated. Incarceration sentences are also generally longer in the United States than England."Full Report Your simplistic headline selection is not a scientific survey. For one thing, since the U.S. has five times the population of England, even if crime rates were equal, you would see five times more crime headlines in U.S. papers. You must adjust the crime reports to a standard basis for comparision, which is per 100,000 population. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Newbie 0 #17 August 12, 2004 that report is somewhat out of date don't you think John? (1981-1996). I don't think the UK is a small country (65 million people), it is made up of large, densely populated areas like the US. Sure, you could argue less people = less crime in general, but look at the nature of what is being reported across the UK in the newspaper, compared to the crime being reported today in the US. Of course, there will be more crimes being committed in the US, but look at the nature of the crimes....i would argue there are instances of far more violent episodes than what we are experiencing here. It's the nature of the crime you should focus on, rather than the numbers, which is what i was focusing on in my first post. "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #18 August 12, 2004 Quotewhere on earth are you getting this stuff from? Even on a bad day here in the UK, we pale into insignificance with what the US will see on a bad day. Sure we might be experiencing more vehicular vandalism and "pushing and shoving" (yes, if you push and shove someone, without even laying a fist or kick on them, it is classified as a "violent crime" by the police. OK class, welcome to Criminology and Criminal Justice 101 Today, we will be discussing the definition of "assault." Quote...a handful of articles... What, you think you couldn't find just as many useless articles in the telegraph or BBC? Hell, even CNN International would have that many stories on the UK. It's really quite simple. Our problem is going down, and has been for years. Theirs is going up (it is actually approaching ours now). As much as you bash the US for crime problems, at least we're successfully addressing them. The UK (ok, England anyway) is spiraling out of control.witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #19 August 12, 2004 ***In the news: ...... Not the ownership of guns. *** Mr. John Rich still is giving his very best to convince the poor, ignorant non-Americans: Gun ownership to everybody! This is ultimate answer to turn the world into a peaceful place. Forget about your culture. Amen. dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #20 August 12, 2004 Quote***In the news: ...... Not the ownership of guns. *** Mr. John Rich still is giving his very best to convince the poor, ignorant non-Americans: Gun ownership to everybody! This is ultimate answer to turn the world into a peaceful place. Forget about your culture. Amen. HEY JOHN - She gets it! [Happy Dance]I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #21 August 12, 2004 QuoteI mean, he talks a lot of shit about how good he's gonna make everything, sure, but he never explains beyond vague, dreamy, ethereal terms how the hell he's going to do anything. Quote ummm, in every election they ALL do this.....promise this / promise that....they bob and weave around HOW they will accomplish what they promise. --> just pointing out how you can spot a politician lying.....>> his lips are moving Roy Some promises are more, or less, believable than others. Before I decide whether to believe one, I take the measure of just how likely it is to be able to make good on the promise and complete the promised act. When it comes to Kerry, I don't find him believable. When it comes to Bush, probably not too believable either, but I prefer someone who goes out and kicks ass over one who I believe won't; and I will go with the proven pro-gunner over the proven anti-gunner every single time. --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites peacefuljeffrey 0 #22 August 12, 2004 QuoteDesperate times call for desperate measures Jeffery. You don't seem too desperate to spell my name right. --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Newbie 0 #23 August 13, 2004 don't get me wrong Kennedy, i knwo the US has made leaps and bounds in addressing it's problems, with zero tolerance policing etc etc, look at NYC as an example of the good stuff that can happen. All i'm saying is that, on a crime by crime basis, what we tend to see is a far higher insidence of violent, mindless crime in the US than we do here in the UK. This is speaking from experience (26+ years living in London, approx 2 years living in Nor California a couple of years back). "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Kennedy 0 #24 August 13, 2004 Quotelook at NYC as an example of the good stuff that can happen OK, ok, ok, just need to get this laughing under control. Whew, ok. Um, no. NYC is a good example of how big brother can happen. Their crime rates (city and state) have not been doing anything wonderful. Many other areas (with far fewer cops per capita) have done much better in reducing their crime rates. QuoteAll i'm saying is that, on a crime by crime basis, what we tend to see is a far higher insidence of violent, mindless crime in the US than we do here in the UK. This is speaking from experience (26+ years living in London, approx 2 years living in Nor California a couple of years back). Understood. All I'm saying is if things keep going the way they are right now, you won't be able to say that in five or ten years. And your experience is underwhelming. Two whole yeras, huh? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JohnRich 4 #25 August 13, 2004 Quoteon a crime by crime basis, what we tend to see is a far higher insidence of violent, mindless crime in the US than we do here in the UK. London Telegraph: Guns blow a hole in the argument THERE was much indignation yesterday about the claim by CBS News that Britain is riddled with crime. Believe it or not, Dan Rather is right. There are many more burglaries and thefts in Britain than America and, "contact" crime is higher. This includes assaults, robberies and rapes. The 1996 victimisation survey, conducted before big falls in American crime, showed the risk of contact crime as higher in England and Wales than anywhere else. The main reason for a much lower burglary rate in America is householders' propensity to shoot intruders. They do so without fear of being dragged before courts and jailed for life. The most recent crime statistics from Britain show that in 1998 there were 963 offences of violence against the person for every 100,000 people, while in America the rate was 566. The trend in America is down while in Britain, it is up - violent crime has risen more than 10 per cent. Source Article Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 1 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
peacefuljeffrey 0 #22 August 12, 2004 QuoteDesperate times call for desperate measures Jeffery. You don't seem too desperate to spell my name right. --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Newbie 0 #23 August 13, 2004 don't get me wrong Kennedy, i knwo the US has made leaps and bounds in addressing it's problems, with zero tolerance policing etc etc, look at NYC as an example of the good stuff that can happen. All i'm saying is that, on a crime by crime basis, what we tend to see is a far higher insidence of violent, mindless crime in the US than we do here in the UK. This is speaking from experience (26+ years living in London, approx 2 years living in Nor California a couple of years back). "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #24 August 13, 2004 Quotelook at NYC as an example of the good stuff that can happen OK, ok, ok, just need to get this laughing under control. Whew, ok. Um, no. NYC is a good example of how big brother can happen. Their crime rates (city and state) have not been doing anything wonderful. Many other areas (with far fewer cops per capita) have done much better in reducing their crime rates. QuoteAll i'm saying is that, on a crime by crime basis, what we tend to see is a far higher insidence of violent, mindless crime in the US than we do here in the UK. This is speaking from experience (26+ years living in London, approx 2 years living in Nor California a couple of years back). Understood. All I'm saying is if things keep going the way they are right now, you won't be able to say that in five or ten years. And your experience is underwhelming. Two whole yeras, huh? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #25 August 13, 2004 Quoteon a crime by crime basis, what we tend to see is a far higher insidence of violent, mindless crime in the US than we do here in the UK. London Telegraph: Guns blow a hole in the argument THERE was much indignation yesterday about the claim by CBS News that Britain is riddled with crime. Believe it or not, Dan Rather is right. There are many more burglaries and thefts in Britain than America and, "contact" crime is higher. This includes assaults, robberies and rapes. The 1996 victimisation survey, conducted before big falls in American crime, showed the risk of contact crime as higher in England and Wales than anywhere else. The main reason for a much lower burglary rate in America is householders' propensity to shoot intruders. They do so without fear of being dragged before courts and jailed for life. The most recent crime statistics from Britain show that in 1998 there were 963 offences of violence against the person for every 100,000 people, while in America the rate was 566. The trend in America is down while in Britain, it is up - violent crime has risen more than 10 per cent. Source Article Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
