wish I lived in a time with no drugs...

[Steel 0]

Yes I would liked to have lived in a time when the great men, Eugen Sandow, Louis Cyr, Arthur Saxon, etc. got the way they were through hard work and not chemical enhancements.
So what brought this on? Well yesterday I was at the gym and suddenly out of the corner of my eye, I notice that some guy sets up 225 to bench. Its not a lot but its more than most people play with. So I am curious and I look to see how many times he does it. He does it 12 times. Now I am thinking this guy is stronger than most here. But its ok, I did it for 14 the day before. Now he wants to go heavier and he sets up 315. I am thinking no big deal, he probably just wants to max out or something like that. Then he asks me for a spot. I give him a lift off and he throws out a set of 8 reps WITH 315. Now its all clear this guy is not only stronger than me, he is probably stonger than I will ever be. So now I feel like shit wondering whats wrong with me, but wait this will be answered very quickly. We get to talking and he asks if I am taking any "supplements". I am thinking he is talking about Creatine or Whey or something along those lines and so thinking I am the nutrition expert I ask what he is planning on taking. (so that I can explain how by simply changing his diet he can do more than with supplements). Then he says, "oh I have been taking andros and they really work." Well like DUH!, ofcourse they work, those are not supplements their freakin steroids.

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[peregrinerose 0]

At least you can know that though is body may be pumped up, his balls are shrivelled up little nothings with no wee spermies, he'll grow man boobs, and he'll drop dead sooner than you. Thus keeping his drug assisted genes out of the pool and as you buy him his first bra, you can be glad you are drug free. Plus, most girls think those huge body builder guys are truly grotesque.

Jen

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[AggieDave 6]

That's why I dont' lift at Golds Gym anymore, it had a drug scene and little fuckers who were huge, but didn't know a damned thing about lifting. Huge from drug use. Sad actually.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Tonto 1]

Well, on Monday I was at the gym working with two 2.2 pound (1kg) free weights... and I don't even use suppliments!

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[Steel 0]

Quote

That's why I dont' lift at Golds Gym anymore, it had a drug scene and little fuckers who were huge, but didn't know a damned thing about lifting. Huge from drug use. Sad actually.

Whats even sadder is that this was not at some big name gym. It was at a private company gym. Nortel has a gym just for Nortel employees. The problem is quite out of control. I read an article on-line some time ago that predicted it would continue to get worse until an IFBB competitor just dies on stage out in the open. They said it has already happened backstage warming up. But they have covered it up to avoid the negative publicity because there is too much money involved in the sponsorships and all.

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[AggieDave 6]

Even Tom Prince has come out against it all, after he's ravaged his body...

Its definately heading for a downfall, which is sad, since it could be a natural sport still with amazingly built bodies.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Luv2Fall 0]

.......they only delude themselves.

[dbattman 0]

I don't understand the obsession with huge pumped up bodies. My interest is in being lean and strong, not just with being big.

Given a choice, I'd look like this guy over Arnold any day. That's my goal when I structure my workouts.

Charles Atlas

[peregrinerose 0]

Granted I'm just one girl, but YUCK!! That guy just doesn't do a darn thing for me. Of course my husband is very lean, but he can carry me all over the house without a problem (and I'm no tiny thing at 155lb) and that is all that matters ;-)

Jen

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[Steel 0]

Quote

I don't understand the obsession with huge pumped up bodies. My interest is in being lean and strong, not just with being big.

Given a choice, I'd look like this guy over Arnold any day. That's my goal when I structure my workouts.

Charles Atlas

One thing that is great about Charles Atlas is that he was from a time of no steroids. But when I think of who inspires me and who I want to look like for me its Frank Zane. I don't know if he did or didn't use drugs. But I do believe I can accomplish his numbers without. {or so I hope, but only time will tell}

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[peregrinerose 0]

I know it sounds sarcastic, but I really do mean this as an honest question... what makes a guy want to look like Frank or Charles? What about that body type appeals to guys, or makes them want to become that?

Jen

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[airdweller 0]

I don't know, but for some reason it really doesn't bother me if someone wants to use steroids. I wouldn't do it personally, but people should have the right to put whatever they want into there own body, no matter how stupid it is.

P.S. You shouldn't feel like shit, 14 reps at 225 is pretty impressive. You are probably stronger than I will ever be. Fuck now I feel like Shit.

------------------------------------------------------
"From the mightiest pharaoh to the lowliest peasant,
who doesn't enjoy a good sit?" C. Montgomery Burns

[Steel 0]

Quote

I know it sounds sarcastic, but I really do mean this as an honest question... what makes a guy want to look like Frank or Charles? What about that body type appeals to guys, or makes them want to become that?

Jen

actually Frank Zane is / (was in 1978) very close to what is considered the Grecian Ideal. His arms and legs were slightly larger but I think they looked better that way anyway. The Grecian ideal proportions come from the Greek Statues. See when these statues were first sculpted nobody came even close to those measurements. That is the reason for the top bodybuilding title being call Mr. Olympia, for Mount Olympus. Anyway the statues were made to display perfection.

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[peregrinerose 0]

Even the Greek statues didn't have bodies that were THAT defined, every fiber of every muscle bulging hugely through the skin. The proportions may be similar, but the look is not. I also don't understand why an art form 2K+ years ago would define an ideal body type. By that arguement in 2000 years are we supposed to look like a Picasso?

I honestly don't understand the motivation. I'm not criticizing the end goal, only trying to figure out why that mental image of perfection?

Jen

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[wmw999 2,589]

Quote

By that arguement in 2000 years are we supposed to look like a Picasso?

I'm just hoping to live for another 1000, so that the Rubens beauties are the standard
Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[ladyskydiver 0]

Keep in mind that the pics depicted thus far show the guys when they are flexed and when they've gone on a competition diet to eliminate all extra water from their system in order to show muscle definition better. (Also, why they tan - darker skin shows muscle definition better.)

Life is short! Break the rules! Forgive quickly! Kiss slowly! Love truly, Laugh uncontrollably. And never regret anything that made you smile.

[AggieDave 6]

Quote

what makes a guy want to look like Frank or Charles? What about that body type appeals to guys, or makes them want to become that?

I'm not worried with the look so much as I'm worried about moving that bar with the 45lbs plates on it. For me its a battle in the gym, I have that bar and I have to press it, curl it, move it.

When I pick up the bar for shrugs and it weighs nearly 400lbs, the bar bends and flexes, with deadlifts going over 400lbs, the bar bends and flexes. I have to move that weight, I can't let it conquor me. When I'm on that flat bench and looking up at over 300lbs, that bar HAS to move, I HAVE to get atleast 6 reps or I'm a failure.

Its that simple.

The fact that big arms, wide back and a large chest come along with that is just a cool bonus, but it starts with the battle between me and the bar.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[peregrinerose 0]

Now this I can understand, man vs. nature and all that. If the goal is strength, kicking the bar's ass, I can grasp that too. It's the guys who want the body and the body's look is the primary goal, that's what I don't get.

Oh, I'm still waiting for Rubenesque women to be the ideal too ;-)

Jen

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[lawrocket 3]

I guess it comes down to your values. Take baseball players, where steroids are PROVEN, yes, PROVEN, to get guys millions. The roids give more power with an easier swing. It happens.

I don't get the recreational athlete doing it. Why? What's the benefit? To me, it's no different than an anorexic, with a self image that is nothgin less than problematic.

Ask Caminitti about roids. He still says he'd do it the same way, even thoguht his testicles literally crept back inside.

It builds muscle, but can cause some pretty bad stuff. Guys didn't use to tear muscles like they do now (who heard of a torn bicep in a baseball player except the past few years?) Back injuries, torn quads, and other things like that are consequences. Shortstops, second basemen and ceterfielders don't get those injuries. They need to be agile and throw their bodies around, while not expected to perform so well at the plate.

It's the first basemen, DH's, guys who play the lines that get those injuries. Guess why?

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[Steel 0]

Quote

Quote

what makes a guy want to look like Frank or Charles? What about that body type appeals to guys, or makes them want to become that?

I'm not worried with the look so much as I'm worried about moving that bar with the 45lbs plates on it. For me its a battle in the gym, I have that bar and I have to press it, curl it, move it.

When I pick up the bar for shrugs and it weighs nearly 400lbs, the bar bends and flexes, with deadlifts going over 400lbs, the bar bends and flexes. I have to move that weight, I can't let it conquor me. When I'm on that flat bench and looking up at over 300lbs, that bar HAS to move, I HAVE to get atleast 6 reps or I'm a failure.

Its that simple.

The fact that big arms, wide back and a large chest come along with that is just a cool bonus, but it starts with the battle between me and the bar.

You bring up the 64K dollar question. What is better to be strong or to look strong? For me the answer has changed. 10 years ago my answer was hands down to be strong and how I looked meant nothing at. If anything I thought of bulking up as a negative thing. I remember one time I was working out with someone in college and he said something along the lines of, "you come to the gym because you want to burn out because you want to look great at the beach right, I mean you don't do it for the numbers". I remember this specifically because what crossed my mind right then and there was, "no I do do it for the numbers. I want that 400 pound bench max." Now however, I am not sure where I stand. I am definately not in line with the powerlifters. I like the thought of moving a lot of weight, but absoloutely am not willing to give up my washboard abs for more strength.

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[AggieDave 6]

Ha, and I'm not willing to achieve washboard abs and give up my beer.

Basically, I don't worry about even a high protein diet any more, I just do what I want and go lift weights. So I'm not even a "power lifter" and I'm not a "body builder" I'm just a guy that likes to lift weights and drink beer and eat pizza...well, you get the idea.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[kallend 2,151]

it's a pity that people don't seem to exercise their minds as much as their bodies.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[dbattman 0]

I think it's more of what the body type represents than how it actually looks. To say 'I want to look like...' is more implying 'I would like the physical properties of...' or what your goals are. Since I was a former 'butterball' in my youth physical fitness has become extremely important especially with the amount of travel that I endure. Personally I lean towards developing the overall package of lean muscle and sculpting rather than the brute herculean strength and size.

[Steel 0]

Quote

it's a pity that people don't seem to exercise their minds as much as their bodies.

But even more a shame is that some people can exercise the minds all day long for decades and still not understand the simplest of concepts. {socialism = bad system}.

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[riddler 0]

My brother (the biology PhD at Albert Einstein University in New York - have I mentioned how proud I am of him??) benches 300, 4 reps and has never used drugs in his life. He's also been lifting weights for 15 years. It can be done without drugs. Drugs are for people that are impatient.

Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD