TheAnvil 0
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Deuce 1
Ah. My brother. The pistol is only necessary for killing other people. A pretty rare event. Only amateurs actually ever threaten with a pistol.
The rest of us don't need firearms until other amateurs start lording them about. Then we kill those people and use their firearms until it's appropriate to discard them.
Owning them in the first place is just a shortcut.
The rest of us don't need firearms until other amateurs start lording them about. Then we kill those people and use their firearms until it's appropriate to discard them.
Owning them in the first place is just a shortcut.
Would you happily give up your guns to fit in with a society where the normal, law abiding majority, and the vast majority of the criminal element did not possess or use forearms?
Nothing leading about this question, is there?
The lack of freedom to defend yourself would be a major strike against making the decision. If I did it, it would be for a fixed interval. 6 months, maybe 2 years. I wouldn't relocate to another country on a more permament basis without spending significant time there first. And if I found that the bit about crime being nonexistent was bullshit, it would probably lead me to come home.
The tradeoff being made in your country appears to be less violent crime for a lot more of the more minor crime - robberies and such.
In between I'd leave my "toys" with a friend.
Would you happily give up your guns to fit in with a society where the normal, law abiding majority, and the vast majority of the criminal element did not possess or use forearms?
Mike
I suppose I'd feel safe if the vast majority of criminals did not possess FOREARMS. How could they hold a gun or a knife, or even make a fist, without them?
Watch your typing, bucko.
-
-Jeffrey
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"
TomAiello 26
I'd just leave my guns locked up somewhere in the States. I certainly wouldn't get rid of them just because I was leaving the country for a while.
-- Tom Aiello
Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com
Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com
I'd just leave my guns locked up somewhere in the States. I certainly wouldn't get rid of them just because I was leaving the country for a while.
I thought the question was more about being willing to live without them, and the benefit of having them (possibly for defense). What good do they do you if they are here in the states while you are (indefinitely) over there?
-
-Jeffrey
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"
TomAiello 26
I travel alot. I still keep the things I have at home. It'd be silly to go thrusting my American attitudes on everyone just because I was travelling.
-- Tom Aiello
Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com
Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com
I thought the question was more about being willing to live without them, and the benefit of having them (possibly for defense). What good do they do you if they are here in the states while you are (indefinitely) over there?
-
I live in California - I'm almost always away from them. England's not too different then, save the awful weather and limited cuisine.
Skyrad 0
In moving to a country where private gun ownership is unusual, bordering on illegal, how willing would you be to discard your toys? .
ROFLMAO!!!!!
When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca
Lucius Annaeus Seneca
mr2mk1g 10
GB is now reporting more gun crimes and murder per capita than the US!
Please point to data to back up this statement.
Please see the linked graph which illustrates just how wrong you are. The link shows data for the last set of figures available for murders with firearms per capita.
Britain is last out of all the countries where this data is available. US is the 8th worst in the world. http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_mur_wit_fir_cap
Are you sure the UK is reporting more gun crimes than the US?
(with thanks to nacmacfeagle who posted a similar link in an earlier thread).
Skyrad 0
Well said Deuce!
When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca
Lucius Annaeus Seneca
Ripple 0
People who advocate that attitude, or tolerate those restrictions, pretty much deserve what happens if they are victimized.
That's a very interesting statement, Jeffrey. Do you really mean it?
I was raped when I was 21 by four men in a pub car park. I'm sure that if I had been carrying a gun, I could have prevented it from happening. Does that mean I deserved it?
This (surprisingly, seeings its coming from me
) isn't an attempt to start a flame war, and I'm not trolling, I'm genuinely interested in what you really think Jeffrey.
Oh, and sorry for taking this off topic, Mike.
Next Mood Swing: 6 minutes
GB is now reporting more gun crimes and murder per capita than the US!
Please point to data to back up this statement.
Please see the linked graph which illustrates just how wrong you are. The link shows data for the last set of figures available for murders with firearms per capita.
Britain is last out of all the countries where this data is available. US is the 8th worst in the world. http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_mur_wit_fir_cap
Are you sure the UK is reporting more gun crimes than the US?
(with thanks to nacmacfeagle who posted a similar link in an earlier thread).
No offense, but who the fuck are the people who put together that information? What is their reliability? Why are they to be believed, anyway?
And, um, I think it's kinda funny that countries like former socialist republics have lower firearms murder rates than the U.S. does... I guess they exclude those who are killed in war-like conflict, and bombings. Nothing like being selective in how people are killed to make a country look better.
-
-Jeffrey
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"
"With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!"
mr2mk1g 10
No offense, but who the fuck are the people who put together that information? What is their reliability? Why are they to be believed, anyway?
Oh dear. It's source Jeffrey is listed at the bottom of the table. The data is from the Seventh United Nations Survey of Crime Trends and Operations of Criminal Justice Systems, covering the period 1998 - 2000 (United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, Centre for International Crime Prevention).
Do you dispute the data for some reason?
Do I get to keep all 3 boxes? 
I wouldn't relocate to a country that wouldn't allow me to keep my gun. I'd come play and jump but wouldn't live there.
I wouldn't relocate to a country that wouldn't allow me to keep my gun. I'd come play and jump but wouldn't live there.
Life is short! Break the rules! Forgive quickly! Kiss slowly! Love truly, Laugh uncontrollably. And never regret anything that made you smile.
People who advocate that attitude, or tolerate those restrictions, pretty much deserve what happens if they are victimized.
That's a very interesting statement, Jeffrey. Do you really mean it?
I was raped when I was 21 by four men in a pub car park. I'm sure that if I had been carrying a gun, I could have prevented it from happening. Does that mean I deserved it?
This (surprisingly, seeings its coming from me
Oh, and sorry for taking this off topic, Mike.
Nope...you didn't deserve it and too bad you didn't have a gun to permanently remove those a$$holes from the gene pool.
Life is short! Break the rules! Forgive quickly! Kiss slowly! Love truly, Laugh uncontrollably. And never regret anything that made you smile.
rushmc 23
There are many newspaper accounts of how the British government hides some of the data from the people. the attachment is and op/ed I know but it uses and names studies done by others. Let me know what you think. By the way, I think it is a great question to ask for the data!!! More of this thinking and questioning is needed!
http://www.newsmax.com/articles/?a=2000/1/20/115342
http://www.newsmax.com/articles/?a=2000/1/20/115342
"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln
rushmc 23
The gun crime rates in the US have been dropping for nearly a decade now. Conversely, the US now has 37 states that have "shall issues" laws concerning concealed carry. In EVERY state that has passed these kinds of laws gun crime has gone down. No police officer in the US has been shot by or threatened by anyone that legally carries a gun. There are 4 stories I know of where the officers say they were saved because of a civilian that had his gun.
Compare that to every country where guns are being taken away (Canada, Great Britain, Australia) and crime rates go up. And so goes the cities in the US that do not allow people to have guns. The data is overwhelming. give it up
Compare that to every country where guns are being taken away (Canada, Great Britain, Australia) and crime rates go up. And so goes the cities in the US that do not allow people to have guns. The data is overwhelming. give it up
"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln
Ripple 0
Nope...you didn't deserve it and too bad you didn't have a gun to permanently remove those a$$holes from the gene pool.
Yes, you're probably right. Although I'm not sure if the impact on me of killing someone would have been better than the impact of being raped. That sounds stupid, doesn't it?
But, either way, its an interesting point that Jeffrey's raised isn't it? I mean, if I'd have had a gun, I'd have been ok, if they had been decent people, I'd have been ok.
I guess its like we need better people, not necessarily more guns.
Can't remember who said it, but I like the saying that goes something like 'Bad people will break laws anyway. We don't need more laws we need more good people'
Next Mood Swing: 6 minutes
Do I get to keep all 3 boxes?
I wouldn't relocate to a country that wouldn't allow me to keep my gun. I'd come play and jump but wouldn't live there.
Ahhh... But would you swap your guns for boxes!?
Maybe I've FINALLY hit on a "Toys for Guns" type programme that'd be effective....
OK...
Ladies, here's the deal. You can surrender your guns in exchange for boxes. Small guns for a small box and big guns for a "big" box
.
Guys, here's the deal. You can surrender your guns for a place in one of the boxes
.
Think it'd work?
Mike.
Editet to add: the offer of a free makeover for both ladies and guys before the "box selection" in the interests of customer satisfaction
.
.
Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.
Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.
Do I get to keep all 3 boxes?
I wouldn't relocate to a country that wouldn't allow me to keep my gun. I'd come play and jump but wouldn't live there.
Ahhh... But would you swap your guns for boxes!?
Maybe I've FINALLY hit on a "Toys for Guns" type programme thad'd be effective....
OK...
Ladies, here's the deal. You can surrender your guns in exchange for boxes. Small guns for a small box and big guns for a "big" box
Guys, here's the deal. You can surrender your guns for a place in one of the boxes
Think it'd work?
Mike.
.
First there would need to be a test drive of all 3 boxes to determine if they were worth considering giving up my guns for them. Then, there would need to be a practical application in their ability to protect me if I was in a situation where I was unable to protect myself. Yes, I have a black belt and a gun. I hope to go to my grave never needing to use either in self-defense. However, if I gave up my gun for a man, I'd have to know beyond a shadow of a doubt that he would have the ability to protect me if I was unable to protect myself...which means I'd have to have a deep amount of trust in his abilities as well as the fact that he'd have to be around me when a situation arose that I'd need help. In most instances where a crime is committed against a woman...she's alone.
Reality is...I wouldn't give up my gun...no matter how good the test drive was.
Life is short! Break the rules! Forgive quickly! Kiss slowly! Love truly, Laugh uncontrollably. And never regret anything that made you smile.
mr2mk1g 10
Remember the data I supplied is not from the British public but from the UN.
Please see the earlier thread entitled "Gun Question for the Brits" for my comments on the reasons behind the increase of gun crime in the UK. Whilst it is true that this increase correlates temporally with the 1997 Firearms legislation it is also intrinsically linked with the influx of Yardie gangs and their associated crime patterns. Your article mentions Eastern European firearms being found during raids... that is hardly surprising given the number or Eastern European gangsters we also now have operating in this country.
Remember, correlation does not indicate causation. I would suggest that the development of mafia style crime syndicates in this country (a phenomena with which we have little prior experience) is of a far greater importance in the increase of armed crime in this country than was our recent change in firearms legislation.
I am not anti gun. I sympathise with many of the pro-gun lobby's positions. I agree there is evidence out there that would back many of their arguments. But I also disagree with many of their arguments. And I disagree that the UK is an example of gun legislation gone wrong.
I think the conclusion of the last thread like this was pretty much correct in that what works for one country wouldn't necessarily work for another. What works in the UK (and I would submit that it does) would probably not work in the US. What works over there would most certainly not work over here. We simply have too many cultural differences.
I understand that many of the pro-gun lobby's arguments are motivated by firstly a wish to seek out evidence that supports their arguments and secondly by a wish to prove tighter gun legislation a disaster in the hope that the trend does not travel to America.
I would suggest that the UK does not fall into either category. It is not an example of failures in gun legislation, as our current problems are not linked to said legislation. It is equally not cause for concern to gun carrying Americans, as it is not a shining example of how well increased gun legislation can work [I]in the US[/I], because the same legislation would not work [I]in the US[/I] for a great many cultural reasons.
Please see the earlier thread entitled "Gun Question for the Brits" for my comments on the reasons behind the increase of gun crime in the UK. Whilst it is true that this increase correlates temporally with the 1997 Firearms legislation it is also intrinsically linked with the influx of Yardie gangs and their associated crime patterns. Your article mentions Eastern European firearms being found during raids... that is hardly surprising given the number or Eastern European gangsters we also now have operating in this country.
Remember, correlation does not indicate causation. I would suggest that the development of mafia style crime syndicates in this country (a phenomena with which we have little prior experience) is of a far greater importance in the increase of armed crime in this country than was our recent change in firearms legislation.
I am not anti gun. I sympathise with many of the pro-gun lobby's positions. I agree there is evidence out there that would back many of their arguments. But I also disagree with many of their arguments. And I disagree that the UK is an example of gun legislation gone wrong.
I think the conclusion of the last thread like this was pretty much correct in that what works for one country wouldn't necessarily work for another. What works in the UK (and I would submit that it does) would probably not work in the US. What works over there would most certainly not work over here. We simply have too many cultural differences.
I understand that many of the pro-gun lobby's arguments are motivated by firstly a wish to seek out evidence that supports their arguments and secondly by a wish to prove tighter gun legislation a disaster in the hope that the trend does not travel to America.
I would suggest that the UK does not fall into either category. It is not an example of failures in gun legislation, as our current problems are not linked to said legislation. It is equally not cause for concern to gun carrying Americans, as it is not a shining example of how well increased gun legislation can work [I]in the US[/I], because the same legislation would not work [I]in the US[/I] for a great many cultural reasons.
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!
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