"We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good."

[panzwami 0]

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/news/archive/2004/06/28/politics2039EDT0165.DTL&type=printable

Hang on to your wallets.

[skydyvr 0]

The village idiot is out there promoting the village again.

. . =(_8^(1)

[benny 0]

"We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good."


What, like my right to due process? Oh I forgot, I already lost that, good thing we're all so much safer.

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[rehmwa 2]

Ok, there's the irony, but what do you think of Hillary's statement?

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[benny 0]

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Ok, there's the irony, but what do you think of Hillary's statement?

Crap, I didn't actually read it. Now I guess I'll have to. I was just trying to get the Patriot Act lovers all riled up.

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[benny 0]

OK, yeah that was pretty horrible decision making in the way she worded it, but it's true. Well, it's not exactly taking it from them, it's more requiring payment for services rendered by the government. But that's a whole nother story, Yeah, she should've kept her mouth shut on that line.

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[rehmwa 2]

But that's the mentality of some of these congress people. It's not the taxpayers' money used to pay for services to sometimes all but mostly some. (dems and GOP)

They think that all income is really the government's money that they generously allow the people to keep the portion not taxed. Remember how Al Gore said a tax cut is 'spending'? Clear sign of socialist leanings.

I look for comments like this. It's clearly self superior and belittling to anyone that works. Hillary has it in spades, always had.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[benny 0]

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I look for comments like this. It's clearly self superior and belittling to anyone that works. Hillary has it in spades, always had.

I would tend to agree with you if the comment hadn't been made a $10000 a plate event. And also if we weren't talking about rolling back tax cuts which were directed at the top one half of one percent of all income earners in the US.

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[rehmwa 2]

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I would tend to agree with you if the comment hadn't been made a $10000 a plate event. And also if we weren't talking about rolling back tax cuts which were directed at the top one half of one percent of all income earners in the US.

It either applies or not. Both of your sentences are not pertinent (unless she was talking about using the event profits and not the proposed tax increase They only illuminate an unrelated issue that bugs you.

Aside and friendly jabs - 'rollback' is rhetoric, you can't "rollback" all the effects of the federal tax cuts (such as increased local and state taxes to compensate, factory growth or not, interest rate effects, inflation effects, etc - we'll never roll those back automatically by just flipping the switch on a Federal tax table), so it's a new proposed event and will have a different impact compared to just not having the cuts in the first place. So lets just call it an (targetted) increase and not pretend it's a time machine - 'kay?

BTW - I thought that everybody got a tax cut (of those that pay). I'm not in the top one half percent and I had more take home pay. ("top one half of one percent" thanks for clarifying which percent we were looking at the top half of. All this time I thought it was the top one half of the 63rd percent.)

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[TheAnvil 0]

Bwaaahahahahahahaha. I read that article. At least she admits it. I fully expect to hear leftists screaming about tax cuts for the rich. They shall, of course, forget to add that the rich pay most of the taxes.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[penniless 0]

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Bwaaahahahahahahaha. I read that article. At least she admits it. I fully expect to hear leftists screaming about tax cuts for the rich. They shall, of course, forget to add that the rich pay most of the taxes.

That's because we have most of the money.

[panzwami 0]

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And also if we weren't talking about rolling back tax cuts which were directed at the top one half of one percent of all income earners in the US.

You have to PAY TAXES to get a TAX REFUND. In this country, 96.03% of the taxes are paid by the top 50% of wage earners. The top 1% paid 33.89% of the taxes. That means that the top 1% of wage earners paid more than TEN TIMES the taxes that the entire bottom 50% did. I am willing to bet that that same 1% of the people did not use ten times as many government services as did the 50%.

In this country, we actually punish people for working hard and being successful. Just think, all those years of schooling and work so that you can provide for someone who decided not to provide for himself.

The general belief today is that all of the money in this country, by default, belongs to the government. You get the privilege of keeping YOUR OWN MONEY if and only if the Man decides to be nice and let you keep it.

[Zennie 0]

I read that and about croaked. It doesn't get more "Robin Hood" than that.

I do agree withthe general concept that our current budget is WAY out of whack and needs to be fixed. And I also generally agree that tax cuts for anyone in a time of enormous budget deficits is a colossaly bad idea.

But still... to make that a class warfare issue? They're predictable if nothing else.



"You want to abolish the IRS & implement a national sales tax..."

"You want to abolish the IRS & implement a national sales tax..."

- Z
"Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon

[PhillyKev 0]

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Just think, all those years of schooling and work so that you can provide for someone who decided not to provide for himself.

How are you "providing for someone else" by them not having as much of their income taken away? Everyone's pocket is being picked. The vast majority of taxes are not used for welfare.

[Harksaw 0]

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"We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good."

Everyone here agrees with this statement, besides any anarchists who may lurk. What we disagree on is the degree of which things are taken away for the common good. So, unless you advocate eliminating public police, military, currency, highways, etc., you can't really disagree with this exact quote.

__________________________________________________
I started skydiving for the money and the chicks. Oh, wait.

[rehmwa 2]

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You have to PAY TAXES to get a TAX REFUND. In this country, 96.03% of the taxes are paid by the top 50% of wage earners. The top 1% paid 33.89% of the taxes. That means that the top 1% of wage earners paid more than TEN TIMES the taxes that the entire bottom 50% did. I... .

This goes by the assumption that each person should pay the same amount rather than the same percentage. Maybe it's fair in the end (think going to lunch with your buddies), it's not practical.

I'd much rather see the stats brokedown in terms of "The top x% of people make y% of the total income but pay z% of the total tax. We only ever get 2 of the 3.

Since it's an income tax, and not a user fee, I'd much rather see the ratio of y to z: instead of the ratio of x to z (see above) which is what the righties scream about; or the ratio of x to y which is what the lefties scream about.

anyone know where I can find the breakdown the way I'd like to see it? I wouldn't know where to start.

Edit: Here's a chance to turn me into a bleeding heart liberal - just show me that the top 50% of the income ("top" defined as whatever percentage of top income earners totals out that 50%) pays less than 50% of the tax - because of shelters, tax dodges, etc. Or pays less than 80%, whatever. If the number seems terrible unbalanced and the stats are terribly cooked, then I'm converted. This is on income, not wealth.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[panzwami 0]

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How are you "providing for someone else" by them not having as much of their income taken away? Everyone's pocket is being picked. The vast majority of taxes are not used for welfare.

Because the majority of the extra taxes taken from the higher wage earners are redistributed by the government through welfare, medicare, and a host of other "entitlements" (as though anyone is entitled to anyone else's money). These programs are necessary because the people drawing from them are incapable of providing for themselves.

[PhillyKev 0]

irs has all those stats on their site.

[Gravitymaster 0]

Here's a good place to start, for all you "tax cuts for the rich" robots.

http://www.cagw.org/site/PageServer

How about we eliminate pork first. If we do that and we still have budget shortfalls and there is no other way to pay off the debt After making as many cuts as possible, then I'd support a tax increase. As long as it is short term and is only used to pay off the Nat'l Debt. or to make up for budget shortfalls.

Now where did I put that Crack pipe.

[panzwami 0]

http://www.irs.ustreas.gov/pub/irs-soi/01in01ts.xls

Excel breakdown of tax percentages and income levels.

[PhillyKev 0]

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How are you "providing for someone else" by them not having as much of their income taken away? Everyone's pocket is being picked. The vast majority of taxes are not used for welfare.

Because the majority of the extra taxes taken from the higher wage earners are redistributed by the government through welfare, medicare, and a host of other "entitlements" (as though anyone is entitled to anyone else's money). These programs are necessary because the people drawing from them are incapable of providing for themselves.

Really? It is? Are you just making that claim because is sounds good?

About 8% of the entire budget is spent on welfare and social programs. 15% is spent on the interest to pay down the national debt, 21% on defense.

Even though almost TWICE as much money is spent just on the interest on the debt, how does anyone rationalize the right wing stance of increasing deficit spending and reducing public assistance?

The FACT of the matter is, that if the national debt were paid off, as we were in the progress of doing before GWB came along. Then income tax could be reduced 15% ACROSS THE BOARD.

[benny 0]

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Because the majority of the extra taxes taken from the higher wage earners are redistributed by the government through welfare, medicare, and a host of other "entitlements" (as though anyone is entitled to anyone else's money). These programs are necessary because the people drawing from them are incapable of providing for themselves.

So are we to take this to mean that you believe entitlement programs are the largest budget items in the US? Hmm, you don't think it might possibly be defense?

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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The FACT of the matter is, that if the national debt were paid off, as we were in the progress of doing before GWB came along. Then income tax could be reduced 15% ACROSS THE BOARD.

I see you found my crack pipe.

[PhillyKev 0]

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The FACT of the matter is, that if the national debt were paid off, as we were in the progress of doing before GWB came along. Then income tax could be reduced 15% ACROSS THE BOARD.

I see you found my crack pipe.

Yeah, but it's empty. You must have already toked it all up

[Gravitymaster 0]

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The FACT of the matter is, that if the national debt were paid off, as we were in the progress of doing before GWB came along. Then income tax could be reduced 15% ACROSS THE BOARD.

I see you found my crack pipe.

Yeah, but it's empty. You must have already toked it all up

Evidently there was quite a bit left for you.