Canadians

[JohnnyD 0]

Functionally, how does your health care system work? Is it paid for out of income tax? What rate? I assume the Canadian government then funds all the hospitals and clinics?

I'm not interested in a discussion on the pros/cons of socialized health care, just how it works in Canada.

[Remster 30]

We pay more tax then in the US (income and sales), we get more services.

The doctors / nurses / staff are paid by the government, not the users.

Remster

[PhillyKev 0]

It's my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, Rem, that it's sort of like an HMO insurance that's paid for by the gov't. But you also have the ability, if you want, to pay for a specific level of healthcare above and beyond that if you desire.

[JohnnyD 0]

Quote

We pay more tax then in the US (income and sales), we get more services.

How much more? Taken as a whole, tax rates in the US are quite high.

[Remster 30]

Quote

But you also have the ability, if you want, to pay for a specific level of healthcare above and beyond that if you desire.

Not really.... In fact, not at all except for a few issues. Canada does not have a 2 tier healtcare system: one for the rich, one for the poor.

The only thing that you can pay extra for, or get private health insurance for, from memory, is to get private rooms in the hospital (istead of semi-private) or to get prescription insurance (medication isnt covered).

Ous system isnt perfect: the libs cut a lot of the spending in healthcare, and rebuilding the system was their main campain point this time around (we had outr election yesterday).

Remster

[Remster 30]

Quote

tax rates in the US are quite high.

You're a funny guy... really, you are!

Remster

[PhillyKev 0]

Does that include dental? A friend of mine in Canada was just talking about having to pay for her dentist visit.

[JohnnyD 0]

Quote

Does that include dental? A friend of mine in Canada was just talking about having to pay for her dentist visit.

Good question. Hadn't considered that. What about vision?

[Remster 30]

Nope. Dental is only covered until you're 14 I think. Then, its either pay for use, or insurance. Most large employers offer insurance benefit for what is not covered by the national healthcare:

dental
physiotherapy/oesteopaths and all other types of related stuff (think hollistic)
presciptions
vision



When looking into a transfer to Denver a few years ago, we did the calculation with a financial specialist: to end up with similar coverage, in the US, we would have had to take insurances that roughly equated to the difference in income taxes. (and Johnny, I cant answer you tax questions... its complicated enough for a industry to do quite well in tax consultation, so wtf do I know! lol)

Remster

[AndyMan 7]

Quote

It's my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, Rem, that it's sort of like an HMO insurance that's paid for by the gov't.

There are similarities, I suppose... But to me, the definining charactersitic of the HMO system is that you have a designated Primary Care Provider, who limits your access to other providers through referals. That isn't the case in Canada. Also, with an HMO you're limited to "in-network" providers, which also isn't the case. In Canada, every doctor is "in-network".

It is the case that the government provides an arguably good and fair level of service covering most of what people are looking for.

There are some cases where you can "buy" additional levels of service, but these are few and far between. You can "buy" an upgrade to a private hospital room, otherwise you're in a "semi-private" room which you may share with 1 or 3 other patients. However, you can not "buy" line jumping, or a higher quality of heart surgury, for example. Alternately, some types of proceedures are cash only and not covered, lyposuction being a good example.

There are gaps. The government does not provide standard dental or eye care, and their prescription drug coverage also has gaps. Employers usually provide health plans which cover these gaps.

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[AndyMan 7]

Quote

You're a funny guy... really, you are!

Actually, I'd agree with Jonny.

Moving from Toronto to Chicago, while my federal and state/provincial taxes are less, these are countered by much higher municipal taxes (property taxes and often sales taxes), user-fees like toll-roads, and exorbitant health care costs.

I have no doubt that if the dollars were of equal value, and you normalise for real estate, it would be far cheaper to live in Canada. Real Estate costs in Chicago are similar to Toronto.

The tax difference between Canada and the US is far less than I would have imagined.

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[smiles 0]

Health care in Canada is financed primarily through taxation, in the form of provincial and federal personal and corporate income taxes. Some provinces use ancillary funding methods which are nominally targeted for health care, such as sales taxes, payroll levies and lottery proceeds.

Two provinces (e.g., Alberta and British Columbia) utilize health care premiums. The premiums are not rated by risk in either province and prior payment of a premium is not a pre-condition for treatment, in accordance with the Canada Health Act.

Canada has a predominantly publicly financed health care system. Our national health insurance program is achieved through thirteen interlocking provincial and territorial health insurance plans, linked through adherence to national principles set at the federal level.

The Canada Health Act establishes criteria and conditions related to insured health care services and extended health care services that the provinces and territories must meet in order to receive the full federal cash contribution under the Canada Health and Social Transfer (CHST). The aim of the Canada Health Act is to ensure that all eligible residents of Canada have reasonable access to medically necessary insured services on a prepaid basis, without direct charges at the point of service.

The federal government's role in health care includes the following:
setting and administering national principles or standards for insured health care services through the Canada Health Act;
providing funding assistance to provincial/territorial health care services through fiscal transfers;
delivering direct health services to specific groups of Canadians including veterans, First Nations peoples living on-reserve, military personnel, the RCMP and inmates of federal prisons;
fulfilling other health-related functions such as health protection, health promotion and disease prevention.

The administration and delivery of health care services is the responsibility of each individual province or territory. Provinces and territories plan, finance (assisted by federal funding), and evaluate the provision of hospital care, physician services, public health and some aspects of prescription care.

Canada's health care system relies extensively on primary care physicians (e.g. general practitioners) who account for about 51% of all practicing physicians in Canada. They are usually the initial contact with the formal health care system and arrange for access to most specialists, hospital admissions, diagnostic testing and prescription drug therapy.

Most doctors are private practitioners who work in independent or group practices. Some doctors work in community health centres, hospital-based group practices or work in affiliation with hospital out-patient departments. Private practitioners are generally paid on a fee-for-service basis and submit their service claims directly to the provincial/territorial health insurance plan for payment. Physicians in other practice settings may also be paid on a fee-for-service basis, but are more likely to be salaried or remunerated through an alternative payment scheme.
While nurses are generally employed in the hospital sector, they also provide community health care including home care and public health services. Dentists work independently of the health care system, except where in-hospital dental surgery is required.

Over 95% of Canadian hospitals are operated as private non-profit entities run by community boards of trustees, voluntary organizations or provincial health authorities.

Health outcomes are one of the most important indicators of a successful health care system. On that basis, Canada has one of the best health care systems. For example, the life expectancy of Canadians born in 1999 is 79.0, among the highest in the industrialized world, and the 1996 infant mortality rate of 5.6 per 1,000 live births is one of the lowest on the globe.

Our publicly-funded health care system also has economic benefits since companies in Canada do not have to fully fund health benefits for their employees as in the United States. This gives Canadian businesses a competitive edge. A healthy workforce is also a productive workforce. Our health care system therefore contributes to Canada's overall productivity and prosperity.

SMiles

[JohnnyD 0]

AndyMan,
How is it paid for? Income taxes? If so, does Canada have a bracketed system of taxing income that is even remotely similar to the one in America?

[AndyMan 7]

Quote

How is it paid for? Income taxes? If so, does Canada have a bracketed system of taxing income that is even remotely similar to the one in America?

It's paid for out of the general revenue fund of the provincial governments, which is primarily funded with income and sales taxes.

Canada has a bracketed system of income taxes similar to the US, although the provincial and federal tax rates do tend to be higher than their corresponding state and federal rates.

Canada also has a 7% sales tax, and most provinces also have a sales tax set around 7-8%

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[Remster 30]

Quote

these are countered by much higher municipal taxes (property taxes and often sales taxes), user-fees like toll-roads, and exorbitant health care costs.

Still, if you look at income tax, there is a huge gap. I agree with you, its nore of a user / payer system in ths US; I dont have an issue with this when it comes to road use and that type of service, but when it comes to health care and education (dont forget, universities are much more accessible here), I like living in a pinko commie state .

Remster

[PhillyKev 0]

Aren't you frogs supposed to secede or something?

[Remster 30]

Quote

Aren't you frogs supposed to secede or something?

Remster

[Kennedy 0]

My understanding is that if you want a serious treatment while you're still among the living, travelling to the US and paying for it is a common option for those who can afford it. Long lines and endless waitlists are complaints against it, same as against all socialism. Also, like most complaints, many are overstated.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[AndyMan 7]

Quote

My understanding is that if you want a serious treatment while you're still among the living, travelling to the US and paying for it is a common option for those who can afford it. Long lines and endless waitlists are complaints against it, same as against all socialism. Also, like most complaints, many are overstated.

Overstated indeed. It's true that that the very rich often travel to the US for instant treatment. I'm pretty sure that's true of pretty much every country, though.

I've never had insane delays. I had an MRI within a week of my knee injury when I was in Toronto, which was shorter by a few days than the delay I had in Chicago for my ankle injury. My dad had to visit an ER when he was visiting me in Cleveland, and his Emergency Room delay was far longer then anything I ever witnessed in Canada.

I don't know anyone who ever travelled to the states for treatment, and my circle of friends is relatively affluent. They all got good, timely treatment in Canada. I'm sure it happens, but I suspect only in the circle of the ultra-rich.

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[wallygator 0]

As of july 1/2004 we have to pay user fees. depending on your yearly income tax remittance it varies from $300 per person and up. those that require social assistance don't pay(and those that abuse social assistance). dental as long as i can remember was private insurance or COD.

[tkhayes 348]

I find that hard to believe. I found that I pay pretty much no taxes down here compared to what I paid in taxes in Canada,

Income tax is a fraction of what Canadians pay (mostly duie to all these services that are being discussed)

Real estate taxes might be higher, I do not know, but they sure are high depending on where you live. In Zephyrhills? Pretty low.

Car insurance is higher

Health care seems higher because we do not get a bill for it in Canada

Sales taxes in Canada are MUCH higher, (except Alberta). Newfoundland pays almost 21% when it is all added up.

Down here we pay for every service, everyone has their hand out to make a buck. It is the American way of life. I pay all the mortagage closing costs every time I get a loan - not because it costs money, but because they want to make a buck right up front.

I pay title insurance, which almost never pays out (scam)

Everyone sues everyone so insurance is much higher.

A few examples of the differences. In Canada we do not have title insurance because the government keeps the real estate records. Mortgage closing costs are lower, but interest rates are a bit higher.

More things are regulated in Canada, but I would not say that taxes are lower. Taxes are MUCH higher.

But do you get more services for the money you spend? I do not know. Health care is definitely not 'free'. Canada has a government that cannot afford to pay for it and tries to keep the costs under control. Here you fight with your HMO because they cannot afford it and they try to keep the costs under control. same thing, different price.

I prefer the US system, but I do not like the fact that half the country has no insurance - something wrong with a government that cannot take care of its own people, feed and educate them.

TK

[AndyMan 7]

Quote

I prefer the US system, but I do not like the fact that half the country has no insurance - something wrong with a government that cannot take care of its own people, feed and educate them.

How can you have it both ways? Either the government takes care of its own people (like Canada), or only the rich can take care of themselves (like the US).

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[Lindsey 0]

Quote

How can you have it both ways? Either the government takes care of its own people (like Canada), or only the rich can take care of themselves (like the US).

_Am

Boo Hissss (/me throwing rotten tomatoes)....lol. How (ahem) Unamerican of you

Peace~
Lindsey

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[skydyvr 0]

Quote

Either the government takes care of its own people (like Canada), or only the rich can take care of themselves (like the US).

This was a joke comment but you forgot the smiley, right?

'Cause if not, you have a laughably incorrect concept of health care in the US.

. . =(_8^(1)

[mikeat10500 12]

From Chantelle


Now that Vancouver has won the chance to host the 2010 Winter Olympics
these are some questions people the world over are asking!!!!!

These questions about Canada were posted on an International Tourism
Website.


Q: I have never seen it warm on Canadian TV, so how do the plants
grow?(UK)
A: We import all plants fully grown and then just sit around and watch
them die.


Q: Will I be able to see Polar Bears in the street? (USA)
A: Depends how much you've been drinking.


Q: I want to walk from Vancouver to Toronto - can I follow the railroad
tracks? (Sweden)
A: Sure, it's only Four thousand miles, take lots of water. . .


Q: Is it safe to run around in the bushes in Canada?(Sweden)
A: So its true what they say about Swedes.


Q: It is imperative that I find the names and addresses of places to
contact for a stuffed Beaver. (Italy)
A: Let's not touch this one.


Q: Are there any ATMs (cash machines) in Canada? Can you send me a list
of them in Toronto, Vancouver, Edmonton and Halifax? (UK)
A: What did your last slave die of?


Q: Can you give me some information about hippo racing in Canada? (USA)

A: A-fri-ca is the big triangle shaped continent south of Europe.
Ca-na-da is that big country to your North . . . oh forget it. Sure,
the
hippo racing is every Tuesday night in Calgary. Come naked.


Q: Which direction is North in Canada? (USA)
A: Face south and then turn 180 degrees. Contact us when you get here
and we'll send the rest of the directions.


Q: Can I bring cutlery into Canada? (UK)
A: Why? Just use your fingers like we do.


Q: Can you send me the Vienna Boys' Choir schedule? (USA)
A: Aus-tri-a is that quaint little country bordering Ger-man-y, which
is....oh forget it. Sure, the Vienna Boys Choir plays every Tuesday
night in Vancouver and in Calgary, straight after the hippo races. Come
naked.


Q: Do you have perfume in Canada? (Germany)
A: No, WE don't stink.


Q: I have developed a new product that is the fountain of youth. Can
you tell me where I can sell it in Canada? (USA)
A: Anywhere significant numbers of Americans gather.


Q: Can you tell me the regions in British Columbia where the female
population is smaller than the male population? (Italy)
A: Yes, gay nightclubs.


Q: Do you celebrate Thanksgiving in Canada? (USA)
A: Only at Thanksgiving.


Q: Are there supermarkets in Toronto and is milk available all year
round? (Germany)
A: No, we are a peaceful civilization of Vegan hunter/gatherers. Milk
is illegal.


Q: I have a question about a famous animal in Canada, but I forget
it'sname. It's a kind of big horse with horns.(USA)
A: It's called a Moose. They are tall and very violent, eating the
brains of anyone walking close to them. You can scare them off by
spraying yourself with human urine before you go out walking.


Q: I was in Canada in 1969 on R+R, and I want to contact the girl I
dated while I was staying in Surrey, BC. Can you help? (USA)
A: Yes, and you will still have to pay her by the hour.


Q: Will I be able to speak English most places I go? (USA)
A: Yes, but you will have to learn it first.

-----------------------------------
Mike Wheadon B-3715,HEMP#1
Higher Expectations for Modern Parachutists.