crwmike 0 #26 June 28, 2004 QuoteQuoteI have more respect for people who say and, more importantly, do things I respect. Ahhh, but how about those who say things you respect, but do things you don't? Or those that say things you don't respect, but do things you do? I'd still rather be dealing with someone who makes clear their intentions, than someone who lies and cheats to get their way. Dude, we're talking about politicians here! Michael Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #27 June 28, 2004 So I guess you dislike Kerry and Hillary as much as Bush then... right? We can always write in someone for president.Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crwmike 0 #28 June 28, 2004 QuoteSo I guess you dislike Kerry and Hillary as much as Bush then... right? We can always write in someone for president. I distrust all politicians. I dislike (in the extreme) what Dubyah is doing to my country. I'd much rather having my president getting his dick sucked in the oval office than one giving it's citizens rectal exams. Having said that, I don't give a shit about Bill or Hillary. Kerry is just the only viable means to stop this before our nation is gone. If I can use him to this purpose, I will. They'e politicians, dude! Stop reacting like someone said your child was ugly. Michael Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #29 June 28, 2004 I'm not worried about whether or not someone's a politician. I'm worried that so many people can accuse so many others of being hypocritical without seeing that they are themselves. I'll never stop holding people to what they say and I'll be just as pissed when a Republican or Democrat does it. A lot of people would love a president that doesn't really do much. No one's super happy, no one's super mad. Thankfully we've had presidents who had enough balls to do what they thought was right when we really needed it. (NOT naming names on purpose)Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 102 #30 June 28, 2004 QuoteA lot of people would love a president that doesn't really do much. No one's super happy, no one's super mad. Thankfully we had presidents who had enough balls to do what they thought was right when we really needed it. Hurumph, hurumph!People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #31 June 28, 2004 QuoteI find it wierd that you give such unquestioning support to an administration that lies, is obsessed with secrecy, engages in pre-emptive foreign wars, is building an empire, and has no fiscal responsibility, all of which are contrary to the values embued as American by the Founding Fathers. Clinton running again? Lies...Monica gate Secrecy...Whitewater Foreign wars.... Somolia, Kosovo, several air attacks on Iraq. Empire...Well I can't think of one...But you can't prove GWB is either. Fiscal responsability...UH the government SHUT down under Clinton."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #32 June 28, 2004 QuoteNo, you still don't understand. I'm not saying that the quotes were taken out of contaxt, but rather that some people are taking the entire concept out of a much larger context. I really don't know how to make it any more clear. Sorry, you are wrong. They supported the war, admitted they thought there were terroist ties, thought he had WMD's. They said it. You may not like where it took us, but they helped lead us down that path. It kills me how so many supported the Patriot act, the war in Iraq...And now they are against it. Flip/flop"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,174 #33 June 28, 2004 QuoteQuoteI have more respect for people who say and, more importantly, do things I respect. Ahhh, but how about those who say things you respect, but do things you don't? Or those that say things you don't respect, but do things you do? I'd still rather be dealing with someone who makes clear their intentions, than someone who lies and cheats to get their way. Examples of saying one thing and doing another: Bush: "Veterans deserve the best" in a speech to vets at Walter Reed Army Hospital on the SAME DAY his administration acted to reduce veterans' care. Bush: "Deficit that will be small and short term" (State of Union Address 2002) while enacting policies that reduce revenues and increase government spending leading to a record deficit that will last at least 10 years. Bush: "Nation building - ABSOLUTELY NOT" (Campaign speech, 2000). What is going in Iraq, then? Bush: "No Child Left Behind", while his administration takes steps to leave millions behind.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #34 June 28, 2004 QuoteClinton running again? No, he's not. So what's the point of your post? We all know you hate Clinton, you've told us enough times. Still trying to figure out what the hell it has to do with Bush. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #35 June 28, 2004 QuoteNo, he's not. So what's the point of your post? We all know you hate Clinton, you've told us enough times. Still trying to figure out what the hell it has to do with Bush. Almost all the things Kallend said about Bush (who we all know you and he hate, but keep bringing it up) can be said for Clinton. So neither are perfect...But as long as you bring up Bush'e faults...expect others to bring up your heros faults."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #36 June 28, 2004 QuoteAlmost all the things Kallend said about Bush (who we all know you and he hate, but keep bringing it up) can be said for Clinton. So neither are perfect...But as long as you bring up Bush'e faults...expect others to bring up your heros faults. Doesn't it bother you that the only defense you can come up with for the faults of your hero, GWB is that some has been president who has no relevance to the current campaign or current policies was just as bad? Since you like to point out how alike GWB and Clinton are, I have to assume that Clinton is your hero as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #37 June 28, 2004 QuoteDoesn't it bother you that the only defense you can come up with for the faults of your hero, GWB is that some has been president who has no relevance to the current campaign or current policies was just as bad? Nope...In fact I have plenty of defenses for old GWB....However you leftish freak 'O's just keep playing the same old broken record..I could get a parrot to slam Bush for you... Squak....Bush lied...Bush lied Squak.. Its much more complicated than you claim. He got fed bad intel...as ALL Presidents do...But unlike prior morons in the white house he did what he thought was right while some others just sat on their asses...If prior Presidents (Including SR.) had finished the job, and made OBL's death a priority...Then we would not be here now. Clintons 8 years of hide your head in the sand policies on the middle east did nothing by give terrorists the time needed to plan big attacks. But you guys just keep playing the same old BS... International politics is not a simple game...At times you have to kill people who want to kill you. QuoteSince you like to point out how alike GWB and Clinton are, I have to assume that Clinton is your hero as well Well if I were to go looking for a piece of ass I'd rather have Clinton ridding shotgun than GWB....But when running a country I'd rather have a guy with MORALS...Even if they are based in religion than some corrupt assclown. Speaking of a corrupt assclown...Thats EXACTLY why I don't like Kerry...You can't get him to stick to one side of ANY issue. And a uber rich guy has NO IDEA what it is like to be a "common man"...But that jackass makes the claim he understands the "little guy"...How many of your friends have six, million+ dollar homes? Neither canidate understands the little guy...But Bush does not claim to be a normal man..Kerry does and it makes me sick. Kerry is an idiot that no one knows where he stands on anything....He is for or against whatever is popular..And that is dangerous."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #38 June 28, 2004 QuoteWell if I were to go looking for a piece of ass I'd rather have Clinton ridding shotgun than GWB Have you seen his taste in women? What, are you nuts? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #39 June 28, 2004 QuoteHave you seen his taste in women? What, are you nuts? Sometimes its quantity, not quality"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airdweller 0 #40 June 28, 2004 > No, you still don't understand. < Just because someone does not agree with you does not necsarily mean they do not understand what you are saying. To me your statement seems to be a put down on some ones intelligence, which can be viewed as treading on the lines of a personal attack------------------------------------------------------ "From the mightiest pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?" C. Montgomery Burns Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrunkMonkey 0 #41 June 28, 2004 QuoteQuoteWell if I were to go looking for a piece of ass I'd rather have Clinton ridding shotgun than GWB Have you seen his taste in women? What, are you nuts? Go ugly early? (Not my philosophy, just a guess...) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,131 #42 June 28, 2004 >Squak....Bush lied...Bush lied Squak.. As opposed to Squauk - Clinton blowjob - squauk - Clinton perjury . . . . It's what happens when your objective is to "win" a debate at all costs. At the first sign of anything that GWB has done wrong, you must find something that Clinton did wrong; in that way you "win." For example: You make a good point about "Its much more complicated than you claim. He got fed bad intel...as ALL Presidents do. . ." And that's exactly right. The next question - why did he get bad intel? Did he pressure them to _give_ him that intel? Did he want a justification for war? Did other leaders within the White House want a justification for war, or did the one-sidedness of the info he got come from the CIA? And most importantly - how do we fix that so that we are operating on good intelligence in the future? But then it's right back to business as usual. Instead of considering those questions, it's: >Clintons 8 years of hide your head in the sand policies on the middle >east did nothing by give terrorists the time needed to plan big attacks. Never mind that he tried to blow Bin Laden to bits during a cruise missile attack. Hindsight is 20/20. And in hindsight both leaders didn't take the threat of Al Qaeda seriously enough before 9/11. What we should consider now is how to keep from making that mistake again. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #43 June 28, 2004 QuoteIt's what happens when your objective is to "win" a debate at all costs. At the first sign of anything that GWB has done wrong, you must find something that Clinton did wrong; in that way you "win." For example How about you guys PROVE any of your claims? I can PROVE my claims against Clinton. You have yet to PROVE any GWB lies...You MIGHT be able to prove he made bad calls...But being wrong and LYING are two different things. QuoteYou make a good point about "Its much more complicated than you claim. He got fed bad intel...as ALL Presidents do. . ." And that's exactly right. The next question - why did he get bad intel? Did he pressure them to _give_ him that intel? Did he want a justification for war? Did other leaders within the White House want a justification for war, or did the one-sidedness of the info he got come from the CIA? And most importantly - how do we fix that so that we are operating on good intelligence in the future? But you don't ANSWER these questions...Hell you don't even ASK them as questions. You treat them as FACT. Typical political BS..you can't prove it, but if you say it enough the weak minded will believe it. QuoteBut then it's right back to business as usual. Instead of considering those questions, it's: >Clintons 8 years of hide your head in the sand policies on the middle >east did nothing by give terrorists the time needed to plan big attacks. When you quit pushing the Bush lied approach and ASK then maybe look for the answers to those questions, then maybe we can have a real talk...But as long as you continue to flat out refuse to do more than slam Bush and his choices...Then expect me and others to bring up the FACTS about your buddy Clinton.. See I can show proof Clinton was a scumbag that lied....you can't PROVE GWB lied...But that never stopped you from saying it now did it? QuoteHindsight is 20/20. And in hindsight both leaders didn't take the threat of Al Qaeda seriously enough before 9/11. What we should consider now is how to keep from making that mistake again. Yes, Clinton had 8 YEARS to deal with it...Even a prior attack...GWB had a few mths. But you seem to be ready to jump on GWB for not doing enough...But you just glaze over Clintons 8 YEARS of not doing anything. You condem GWB for taking us to war...And you applaud Clinton for giving us "peace"...Uh, if Clinton had done something....Then we would not have had to go to war...And the same thing goes for Bush Sr....We should have rolled over SH when we were there the first time...But the left wanted us to give him a chance...Yeah, that worked well. Its easy to be popular in good times...And its easy to nit pick and slam those who actually DO SOMETHING about a problem. In the battle of life it is not the critic who counts, not the man that points out how the strong man stumbled or how the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena...Who's face is marred with dust, sweat and blood. Its easy to play arm chair QB after game day. I for one think GWB did a good job considering what he had to face..The sudden surprize attack on US soil, and the largest loss of life by an enemy on US soil...9/11 killed more people than Pearl Harbor. On that day I bet Gore was thanking God he didn't win. So slam the guy who is active all day long with half truths and lies you can't back up. It just makes you look stupid and petty."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #44 June 28, 2004 QuoteI can PROVE my claims against Clinton. Great, you can prove something that is completely irrelevant. QuoteYou MIGHT be able to prove he made bad calls...But being wrong and LYING are two different things. That's why I'll say that he's either a stupid puppet, or a liar. Take your pick. QuoteBut you seem to be ready to jump on GWB for not doing enough...But you just glaze over Clintons 8 YEARS of not doing anything. Many members of GWB's own administration have come forward to blast both of them for not doing enough. Once again, Clinton is irrelevant, GWB, who you seem to admit is just as incompetent, is running for reelection. QuoteSo slam the guy who is active all day long with half truths and lies you can't back up. It just makes you look stupid and petty. Much better to divert criticism of the current president running for reelection by slamming a previous administration that is no longer an issue. That makes you look intelligent and on topic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,131 #45 June 28, 2004 I ask questions about the intelligence provided to Bush (questions you raised) and I get a multi-page reply that starts off with a comment about how you can prove how bad Clinton is. Ah well. Good luck slamming; you've gotten pretty good at it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
catfishhunter 2 #46 June 28, 2004 QuoteThe Bush/Cheney administration is the most un-American in recent history. You mean more un-american then Clinton-Gore? More un-american then taking a million in cash from the Chinese in secret, in a buddisht monestary, then when they are caught they say oh we didn't know it was wrong. We will give it back and you all can just forget that it was FUCKING TREASON and they both should have been Hung.... Shall I go on........ MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #47 June 28, 2004 QuoteGreat, you can prove something that is completely irrelevant. At least I can prove what I say...you can't QuoteThat's why I'll say that he's either a stupid puppet, or a liar. Take your pick. Again you can't prove he is a "stupid puppet"..But I don't expect you to not slander him...You're to good at it to stop now. QuoteMany members of GWB's own administration have come forward to blast both of them for not doing enough Last I checked we had troops looking for OBL, and SH is in Jail...Seems like GWB did something. QuoteGWB, who you seem to admit is just as incompetent, is running for reelection. I don't think GWB is incompetent...you do, of course you can't PROVE any of it...so here we go again. QuoteMuch better to divert criticism of the current president running for reelection by slamming a previous administration that is no longer an issue. That makes you look intelligent and on topic. at least I can prove everything I bring up...you just have slander."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #48 June 28, 2004 QuoteI ask questions about the intelligence provided to Bush (questions you raised) and I get a multi-page reply that starts off with a comment about how you can prove how bad Clinton is. Ah well. Good luck slamming; you've gotten pretty good at it. And you have gotten good at avoiding any answers when they are asked of you...Oh and I have seen you use your greenie powers to force your point home. You are good at it. Why don't you answer questions Bill?"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #49 June 28, 2004 Quoteat least I can prove everything I bring up And I can prove that the earth revolves around the sun, but it has dick diddly to do with the current president or the race for that office. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #50 June 28, 2004 QuoteAnd I can prove that the earth revolves around the sun, but it has dick diddly to do with the current president or the race for that office And your non proven SLANDER has what to do with anything???? We already know you can spread lies and half truths..."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
