TomAiello 26 #26 June 4, 2004 QuoteWho the heck would they get to moderate it? I nominate Quade and Billvon.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ltdiver 3 #27 June 4, 2004 QuoteQuoteWho the heck would they get to moderate it? I nominate Quade and Billvon. I second that. But we've got to give them cool pen names for the media flash! ltdiver Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MC208B 0 #28 June 4, 2004 tweedle de and tweedle dum Just kidding Bill and QuadeAl Sharpton is certainly something else isn't he? How that guy managed to not work a day in his life and continue to live "high on the hog" is beyond me. Guess it shows how many stupid folks there is in the world (his supporters). This is the second time this week that I have fully agreed on what Quade and Billvon have said on these posts, wow, what's the world coming to Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nacmacfeegle 0 #29 June 4, 2004 Hey Trent, "What are you doing in my swamp?" Just to set the record straight, you've never struck me as a whiner. A vocal opponent in civilised debate, definitely. One thing I find curious though..from the article, "Sharpton, a 49-year-old New York native, was ordained as a minister when he was 10," 10? Is that right? If so is a ten year old really qualified to act as a spiritual leader? (analogies to the Dalai Lama duly noted, but a different belief set).-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tcnelson 1 #30 June 4, 2004 if i didn't say it live, thank you for the absolutely fabulous dinner over memorial day weekend. the NBFT appreciates it!! furthermore, bless kallend for having a good mind 'cause good minds are hard to come by in america these days...but, you're right, it's more about us vs. them with him instead of wrong vs. right. of course, that's just my conservative opinion..."Don't talk to me like that assface...I don't work for you yet." - Fletch NBFT, Deseoso Rodriguez RB#1329 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #31 June 4, 2004 Quote>And whenever that happens, the outlet usually becomes wildly >popular, for example Fox News and numerous conservative >magazines and talk radio shows. So you are arguing that popular media is conservative. No argument there, but you seem to be contradicting the premise of the thread. Fox has no substantial competition, it is the only major right leaning media source. This proves the opposite that you intended- that as a whole the people reporting the news are on the left. And hell, Kallend seemed to ackowledge that fact too, claiming the right has only itself to blame for this reality. Talk about wanting to have the cake, and eat it too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #32 June 4, 2004 Quote>He and Jerry Springer would be great running mates someday. I'd love to just see them all in a debate. Get Jerry Springer, Sharpton, Rush, Howard Stern, Al Franken and Ann Coulter in a room and let em go at it. Sell tickets and give the money to charity; you could feed the world for a year, given the amount of drama and good old fashined entertainment they could produce. Man....Stern could bring the hookers, Rush could hook them up with dope, Springer could sleep with them, and Franken and Coulter could get into a good old fashion slap fight. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #33 June 4, 2004 QuoteFranken and Coulter could get into a good old fashion slap fight. $20 on Coulter. Any takers? ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,150 #34 June 4, 2004 QuoteI say Sharpton is a jackass and I'm whining, according to you. You asked for an explanation for my statement: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1100604;#1100604 Whine http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1101007;#1101007 Whine http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1101042;#1101042 Whine http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1100428;#1100428 Whine http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1090497;#1090497 Whine But that's just my opinion. I don't see how it is any more insulting than you telling me to stop whining. I just felt it was odd hearing someone telling me to stop whining when they take every chance they get to whine about Bush, Guns, etc. Honestly, I'm not going to whine about Sharpton being a liberal icon/pundit. If that's who's gonna represent liberal views, I'll just continue to laugh my ass off. You still have not explained how my statement was in error. Conservatives (including you) have complete freedom to open up media outlets. So if there's a bias they (and you) don't like, it's entirely their (your) own fault. Going on endlessly about something that is in your power to fix but doing nothing about it except complain falls clearly into the category of whining. The US media represents a free market in ideas and has done for years. Anyone can start a newspaper and, if wealthy enough, own a radio station. Free markets balance supply and demand. Ergo we can conclude that the status quo fairly accurately represents the balance of opinion in the population as a whole. So if YOU think there's a liberal bias, the probability is that the bias is yours, in the other direction. NO-ONE is stopping you from starting your own media outlet.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #35 June 4, 2004 I would say that you're a master of twisting a topic to an argument that you can win, but it's so easy to see you doing it. Go back and read our posts and find where I said there was an error in your post. Nice try to get into a debate on media free market. QuoteConservatives (including you) have complete freedom to open up media outlets. So if there's a bias they (and you) don't like, it's entirely their (your) own fault. True, and unfortunately it didn't happen until it became clear that most existing media outlets were very left-leaning. I thought news was supposed to be facts anyway... I guess now between fox, talk radio and the left media the truth is out there somewhere. QuoteGoing on endlessly about something that is in your power to fix but doing nothing about it except complain falls clearly into the category of whining. So stop whining about Bush and go vote. I'd say that whining also exists when you constantly complain about things you have NO power to change (ie the past). You do that a lot. ( I expect you'll want examples... just think "Iraq", "Bush", "Guns" just a few) QuoteFree markets balance supply and demand. Ergo we can conclude that the status quo fairly accurately represents the balance of opinion in the population as a whole. So, is it a free market or an oligopoly spawned by virtually insurmountable barriers to entry?Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #36 June 4, 2004 Yeah, Dave... there's room in the swamp for both of us, big fella! I didn't think I was a whiner either, but I guess I am! QuoteOne thing I find curious though..from the article, "Sharpton, a 49-year-old New York native, was ordained as a minister when he was 10," 10? Is that right? If so is a ten year old really qualified to act as a spiritual leader? (analogies to the Dalai Lama duly noted, but a different belief set). That's just one of the things about Sharpton that are full on BS. All he does is self promote, issues be damned. Don't let your scottish ears listen to a word he says... he doesn't represent anyone! Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,150 #37 June 4, 2004 Quote So, is it a free market or an oligopoly spawned by virtually insurmountable barriers to entry? What are these "virtually insurmountable barriers"? How come the "liberals" didn't find them insurmountable? You're just making excuses for inaction. I think the Right likes it just the way it is, it provides something to whine about.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #38 June 4, 2004 QuoteWhat are these "virtually insurmountable barriers"? You're smart enough to figure it out... money. QuoteHow come the "liberals" didn't find them insurmountable? Because they didn't start out being mouthpeices for the left. They started out as newspapers, radio stations, and tv stations that reported on what was going on, made lots of money, then used their position as "news" outlets to slip in opinions and political messages. Liberals didn't set them up to be propaganda machines. But if it keeps going the way it is, we'll probably see either more fact only media outlets, or conservative minded ones pop up. QuoteYou're just making excuses for inaction. I take what action I can feasibly afford. I don't watch the crap on CNN and NBC. I do watch Fox when I can. And have you forgotten?? I express myself here. QuoteI think the Right likes it just the way it is, it provides something to whine about. Now you definitely sound like those that you despise. People have been saying that about the left for years. What will you whine about if Kerry is president? What would make you not whine anymore?Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,150 #39 June 4, 2004 QuoteQuoteWhat are these "virtually insurmountable barriers"? You're smart enough to figure it out... money. It's such a shame that those conservatives are so strapped for cash. Yup - big money in the US votes Democratic. You heard it here, folks.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #40 June 4, 2004 QuoteIt's such a shame that those conservatives are so strapped for cash. Yup - big money in the US votes Democratic. You heard it here, folks. Think about the costs of setting up a media firm over the last 80 years, where you can expand using profits from business. Now, think about the cost of jumping in headfirst today to establish a full on company that will directly compete with existing ones. I guess economic feasibility is a concept that escapes the most brilliant liberal minds.... But hey, at least you got to throw in a nice one-liner!Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 226 #41 June 4, 2004 Kallend - in reply to the free market thing - If you are a liberal - you spend the day whining about how bad everything is and try to convince everyone that life as we know it is evil and should be extinguished, at birth, so the trees have a better world to live in. Conservatives spend thier time making money. So - as you can see it is unlikely to find a conservative willing to whine that much - and hence will not be a reporter. just in case you couldn't follow it - That is why a conservative paper is a rareity - the bias is too strong in the feel good community.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,150 #42 June 4, 2004 QuoteKallend - in reply to the free market thing - If you are a liberal - you spend the day whining about how bad everything is and try to convince everyone that life as we know it is evil and should be extinguished, at birth, so the trees have a better world to live in. Conservatives spend thier time making money. So - as you can see it is unlikely to find a conservative willing to whine that much - and hence will not be a reporter. If there's a demand for conservative reporters, the free market will provide them. If there's no demand for liberal reporters, the free market will eliminate them. It's very simple, really. It's called "Capitalism", and it's the most successful economic system ever devised (not to say Capitalism doesn't have its flaws, but failing to balance supply and demand is not one of them).... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,150 #43 June 4, 2004 QuoteQuoteIt's such a shame that those conservatives are so strapped for cash. Yup - big money in the US votes Democratic. You heard it here, folks. Think about the costs of setting up a media firm over the last 80 years, where you can expand using profits from business. Now, think about the cost of jumping in headfirst today to establish a full on company that will directly compete with existing ones. You mean like Ted Turner did with CNN? Head on competition with the established networks. Yup, a conservative would never have the balls to do that.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,150 #44 June 4, 2004 Just a general comment - isn't it wierd to have such vehement arguments against the operation of the free market from the self-proclaimed "conservatives".... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #45 June 4, 2004 QuoteIf there's a demand for conservative reporters, the free market will provide them. If there's no demand for liberal reporters, the free market will eliminate them. It's very simple, really. It's called "Capitalism", and it's the most successful economic system ever devised (not to say Capitalism doesn't have its flaws, but failing to balance supply and demand is not one of them). You ignore one thing. With liberal editors and liberal administrators, conservative journalists will not be hired, and will not be heard. The simple fact is there is a huge demand (see Foxnews, talk radio). Have you seen an influx of conservatives at the Washington Post? LA Times? Didn't think so. FoxNews provided for the market something that the big papers did not. Hence its wild success. CNN, on the other hand, provided something totally new and unheard of, something people said couldn't be done. It was successful because it was the first, and had no direct competition. Radio news is no less valid than TV news. It is easier (cheaper) to start up than a TV network.witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #46 June 4, 2004 QuoteJust a general comment - isn't it wierd to have such vehement arguments against the operation of the free market from the self-proclaimed "conservatives". I'm not arguing against the free market, and probably never will (though what we have is not a free market, and going further from it each day).witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,150 #47 June 4, 2004 QuoteQuoteJust a general comment - isn't it wierd to have such vehement arguments against the operation of the free market from the self-proclaimed "conservatives". I'm not arguing against the free market, and probably never will (though what we have is not a free market, and going further from it each day). What is preventing any rich conservative from opening up a newspaper, buying a radio station, or starting a new cable TV news channel? Nothing. Surely you're not now going to argue about wealth having its privileges?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #48 June 4, 2004 I'm not arguing against a free market system. Instead, I'm looking at what IS instead of what should/could be. If the majority of media is leaning left, wouldn't most reporters who wanted jobs need to fit in as well? Was CNN Turner's first entry into media? Or did he have other things going on that allowed him to build up to it? I guess he did it overnight, and I guess we should ignore Fox's success since it goes against your point. You asked why I didn't start my own media outlet. I told you. You then went to generalize my statements to apply to all conservatives. What did you call that debate tactic? Even if your hypothesis that there are more left media outlets because there are more left leaning people in the US were true... does a majority of people believing in something make it fact? Is it possible that you may have been one of the people who SWORE that the world was flat?Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,150 #49 June 4, 2004 QuoteQuoteIf there's a demand for conservative reporters, the free market will provide them. If there's no demand for liberal reporters, the free market will eliminate them. It's very simple, really. It's called "Capitalism", and it's the most successful economic system ever devised (not to say Capitalism doesn't have its flaws, but failing to balance supply and demand is not one of them). You ignore one thing. With liberal editors and liberal administrators, conservative journalists will not be hired, and will not be heard. The simple fact is there is a huge demand (see Foxnews, talk radio). Have you seen an influx of conservatives at the Washington Post? LA Times? Didn't think so. FoxNews provided for the market something that the big papers did not. Hence its wild success. CNN, on the other hand, provided something totally new and unheard of, something people said couldn't be done. It was successful because it was the first, and had no direct competition. Radio news is no less valid than TV news. It is easier (cheaper) to start up than a TV network. Excuse me while I get my hanky. You poor conservatives, prevented from owing media outlets because you can't make enough money that way.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #50 June 4, 2004 Apparently some of us are not capable of reasoned debate in this thread, so I am excusing myself from it. ps - don't you hate it when people knock one liners, then throw them around?witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
