kallend 2,147 #76 May 27, 2004 QuoteQuoteQuoteHow's that. Canadian legislators are fearful of people getting offended by one's speech. You're assuming that I am offended by your opionion. The fact is I couldn't care less what you think. What offends me is when people pass laws to legalize hate. What offends you are laws that are designed to counteract hate legislation. I'm not talking about any assumption that you're offended. I don't like hate speech any more than you do. However, I do not believe people should be forced to suppress their opinion (offensive or not). Try standing outside the White House and expressing the opinion that the government of the USA should be overthrown by force. Try standing anywhere that GWB goes with an anti-Bush poster. The Secret Service (SS) "protects" him by removing protesters from his route.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 0 #77 May 27, 2004 QuoteQuoteThis law, and laws like it, seem to be geared more towards saving one's feelings than they are geared to safety. Laws designed to prevent people from being dragged to death just because they’re black is all about feelings and has nothing to do with safey??? Stay on track here, Keith. We can scroll up a few posts and see where (A) Andy pointed out that this is indeed all about free speech, and (B) you agreed. Again, this is about freedom of expression. QuoteYou're assuming that I am offended by your opionion. The fact is I couldn't care less what you think. What offends me is when people pass laws to legalize hate. What offends you are laws that are designed to counteract hate legislation. Actually, I don't see anyone passing laws to legalize hate, quite the contrary in fact, they seem to be passing laws to criminalize the expression of hate, in other words, freedom of expression. You don't have a problem with that? - Jim"Like" - The modern day comma Good bye, my friends. You are missed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #78 May 28, 2004 QuoteActually, I don't see anyone passing laws to legalize hate, quite the contrary in fact, they seem to be passing laws to criminalize the expression of hate, in other words, freedom of expression. You don't have a problem with that? As a Canadian, allow me to be the first to say that I don't give a rats ass if any American supports Canada's hate laws, or not. Different kinds of speech are criminalized in every country, everywhere. This isn't new. Most Americans don't have a problem with how speech is limited in the US. Most Canadians don't have a problem with hate laws, either. Besides, I'll take Canada's track record on protecting individual rights any day over Americas. I can't be held indefinitely without trial in Canada. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,147 #79 May 28, 2004 QuoteQuoteActually, I don't see anyone passing laws to legalize hate, quite the contrary in fact, they seem to be passing laws to criminalize the expression of hate, in other words, freedom of expression. You don't have a problem with that? As a Canadian, allow me to be the first to say that I don't give a rats ass if any American supports Canada's hate laws, or not. Different kinds of speech is criminalized in every country, everywhere. This isn't new. Most Americans don't have a problem with how speech is limited in the US. Most Canadians don't have a problem with hate laws, either. Besides, I'll take Canada's track record on protecting individual rights anyday over Americas. I can't be held indefinately without trial in Canada. _Am Yes, but when is Canada going to emancipate its slaves? ... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Keith 0 #80 May 28, 2004 QuoteAgain, this is about freedom of expression. No, it's about the results of hate speech. Supressing hate speech, helps minimize acts of hate.Keith Don't Fuck with me Keith - J. Mandeville Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #81 May 28, 2004 Earlier I used as example that its possible a priest might be charged if he wants to condemn a gay man. I missed the point. It's an acknowledgement that handing out flyers denying the holocaust cause just as much fear and intimidation as burning a cross on somebody's front lawn, and is just as fundamentally wrong and unjustifiable. If you were to ask me how I expect the laws to be enforced, well - now its illegal to be a gay basher. Once the amendement goes through it'll be a hate crime to threaten to be a gay basher, or use imagery or propaganda to instill the same kind of fear. A few years ago I remember a gay man got killed by being dragged behind a truck down south somewhere. I remember the entire world was shocked by the depravity. I can imagine someone might use imagery or descriptions of an event like that to try to instill fear. The amendment would make those attempts to instill fear crimes in themselves. Those are the kinds of events this law targets. The enforcement of these laws have always been very narrowly targeted, and I don't expect that to change. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #82 May 28, 2004 I'm still trying to figure out why killing a man because of his skin, or because of who he screws, is any worse than killing a man for money, or for revenge, or any other reason. (self defense, and justifiable excluded) They're all just as dead, aren't they? Some question for assault and battery. In events of equal severity, why is motivation more important in one case than another?witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #83 May 28, 2004 QuoteIt's an acknowledgement that handing out flyers denying the holocaust cause just as much fear and intimidation as burning a cross on somebody's front lawn, and is just as fundamentally wrong and unjustifiable. Saying it never happened doesn't scare jews, it makes them (and most others) view you as a freak. QuoteIf you were to ask me how I expect the laws to be enforced, well - now its illegal to be a gay basher. It's been illegal to be a gay basher a very long time. There are laws agaisnt assault and battery going very far back. Even in Canada. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #84 May 28, 2004 QuoteA few years ago I remember a gay man got killed by being dragged behind a truck down south somewhere. I remember the entire world was shocked by the depravity Let's change one bit: "A few years ago I remember a person got killed by being dragged behind a truck down south somewhere. I remember the entire world was shocked by the depravity" OK - Someone explain to me which scenario is worse and deserves more or less punishment. Redo it with color, sex, religion and than tell me. I'm really interested at understanding the mentality of this type of law. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #85 May 28, 2004 QuoteQuoteA few years ago I remember a gay man got killed by being dragged behind a truck down south somewhere. I remember the entire world was shocked by the depravity Let's change one bit: "A few years ago I remember a person got killed by being dragged behind a truck down south somewhere. I remember the entire world was shocked by the depravity" OK - Someone explain to me which scenario is worse and deserves more or less punishment. Redo it with color, sex, religion and than tell me. I'm really interested at understanding the mentality of this type of law. Interestingly enough, it actually was a Black man named James Byrd who was dragged by a truck in Texas. Remember the NAACP ads during the 2000 Presidential race where they claimed more blacks would die and more black churchs would burn if Bush was elected? I don't remember hearing of any black churchs burning lately. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kennedy 0 #86 May 28, 2004 I'm sure the church burners and lynch mobs are just waiting until September when the AWB sunsets so they can go get their "assault weapons. However, I, too, am waiting for an explanation as to why one murder is worse than another based on motivation.witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
