Cruelty to animals

[christopherm 0]

Actually, I take that back, I do wish that I knew you. I have the greatest respect for anyone who has served for the U.S. Military (except of course for the spineless dicks executing innocent in Nam or elsewhere). I think it would be great getting to know you. However, YOUR argument about the cows being slaughtered humanely is a joke. How the fuck do you know they don't suffer. Fact is, you DON'T. Next time you are out grunting it, make sure to hit your mark in the head every time (yeah right!) so that nothing will suffer. Or maybe that won't work, it'll just blow of one side and he'll lay there, uable to talk, untill the infection gets so bad he dies. If you've seen more death than I ever will you know this happens. C'mon, killing is ok if it is humane.
-I've got a tricked out speed machine that takes me from 0-120 in 6.0... GRAVITY!

[nws01 0]

In reply to:
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I do tend to avoid bears and Mountain lions
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Pussy
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Clay tends to avoid that too. haha
Nathan

[nws01 0]

On a serious note I come from a family of hunters and did spend some time hunting growing up. I came to this conclusion. I do not like waking up very early in the morning and sitting in a goose / duck / deer pit or stand and freeze my ass off waiting for this animal to come so I can kill it.
However, I do understand the need of hunting so we can control the population of the animals. If it was not for deer hunting the number of car accidents in a year would be outrageous. The number of geese, ducks, quail, doves, pheasant etc, would be more than we could bear.
I also am not an avid fisherman but we have to control the population.
If anyone wants to hunt or fish and bring the food over to my house I am a damn good cook.
On the other hand animal cruelty should not be tolerated.
There is a major difference between population control and beating/starving/killing an animal for no reason.
Nathan

[freefallfreak 0]

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I have the greatest respect for anyone who has served for the U.S. Military (except of course for the spineless dicks executing innocent in Nam or elsewhere).

If you haven't been there, you don't have a clue about "innocent". Talk about something you know about, or have experienced, but not something you don't know about. It only shows ignorance of fact.

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How the fuck do you know they don't suffer. Fact is, you DON'T.

At the packing plant here - the only one I have ever been inside of - the animals head is placed in a stainless steel harness and a .32 "shot" is fired directly into the brain. From what I have personally experienced, a shot to the brain cuts life extremely short, minimizing pain. I didn't say "no pain", but it would be of a very short duration, and not the "torture" you speak of.

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make sure to hit your mark in the head every time

I load and test fire weapons for Kenny Jarrett Rifles as something to do when I get bored. These are some of the finest rifles in the world, hand made and accurate to a group of three rounds in a two inch circle at 700 meters. And our best shot can knock the flame from a candle at that range. Don't say it isn't possible, cause I've seen John Hicks and Kenny both do it.
TripleF
"If you have something vital and it's sincere, you can communicate." Butch Trucks

[Jonno5 0]

Well i Love dogs,we cant have kids,so our dogs are just like our kids,i have nothing against hunting as long as it is done in a responsible way.But too often i see a bunch of drunk idiots shooting at anything they see that moves.We cant take our dogs out in hunting season in Colorado because too many people are too stupid to tell the difference between a Rhodesian Ridgeback and a deer,because they are both brown i guess.Im totally against any deliberate cruelty to animals and im sure if i ever caught anyone stringing a dog up by its leash or similar i would have no problem Knee-capping them.

[christopherm 0]

You know what... Fuck... I just gave you all the respect I could and you still don't know what else to do but blast off from the mouth like you are the only one who know anything about everything. Don't fucking tell me what I do and don't know about war. I didn't spend my entire senior year studying Vietnam and interviewing veterens to have some tell me that innocent people weren't killed on purpose over there. Do you call going into a villiage of people that don't even know what the fuck you are saying, lining them up, and shooting them, justified. I'm by no means accusing you of doing this but don't sit there and try to play off the Vietnam War as "the U.S. did everything just right. Bullshit. Oh, yeah, and I guess that a little bit of suffering is ok, but a lot is bad. Stop being so hypocritical.
-I've got a tricked out speed machine that takes me from 0-120 in 6.0... GRAVITY!

[Schroeder 0]

"Tell me you haven't stepped on an ant before, put salt on a slug, hunted, ate hamburger before. When is ok and not ok to kill animals? If not then I can accept your animal rights freakishness. By all means, what they did to that dog and what happened to the horses was terrible and the people who did it deserve to be jailed... but really... death? Think about it, it's like saying that someone who just murders someone is ok, but someone who tortures that person should be punished. Your literally saying the same thing. 1000's of cows are slaughtered daily but nothing has been said about it. Who here eats meat? That's what I thought."
http://www.veganoutreach.org/whyvegan
Go to that link for lots of information. I'm not directing that link at christopher, but to everyone reading this thread.
I, myself, am a vegan. I feel that I've been on both sides of this fence, and can therefore comment on and back up my position on my (it obviously isn't for everyone) lifestyle choice. I grew up in a village in northern BC, canada. I understand what it is to pull a trigger on dinner. I learned alot about native hunting practices and hunting ethics, I have stepped on ants, I have enjoyed hamburgers. But that was all before I was educated to the suffering of animals that our society causes. I spent 16 years hunting with my father, and by myself. I did pull the trigger on the deer/moose/bear, I have skinned animals. This is the reality of hunting. It pisses me off to no end when people (mainly in the city I've noticed) will give X-amount of dollars for a freshly packaged side of lamb, but could NEVER do their own dirty work. Why? Is it because of the industry? Is is just people doing it for convienence? No. After so many years, we've detached the action from the product. People who complain about a dog being hung, are, in my mind on the right track, but damn people, there's so much more out there, on SUCH a larger scale. And what do we do about that? Nothing. We go and buy our milk, cheese, eggs, fish, hotdogs ( I can't imagine why...) etc. We go and perpetuate that which we pretend we are against. Look, I'm not trying to preach here, but take a look at the necessity of animals in a dietary sense. Take a look at the numbers, the comments by respected thinkers of our time, etc. If what happened to this dog is such a travesty, and I agree that it is, then this is my appeal for those of you who found it disturbing to research a little further to see what's really going on, that we've chosen to ignore.

[Jonno5 0]

The world is full of people who have studied what others have done,without ever experiencing what was happening and what was happening to them.You so sound pretty angry about it>i would suggest that rather than spouting self rightousness to people about war ,you should go try it for yourself instead of just reading about it.You might find your outlook changes.

[Schroeder 0]

who's talking about war?

[Schroeder 0]

whoops, he must've wrote that while I was typing my speech. Nevermind!

[freefallfreak 0]

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I didn't spend my entire senior year studying Vietnam and interviewing veterens to have some tell me that innocent people weren't killed on purpose over there. Do you call going into a villiage of people that don't even know what the fuck you are saying, lining them up, and shooting them, justified.

LOLOL!!! Studying??? LOLOL...grow up..get the practical experience...then come back and tell me about Nam. Till then, all the "studying" in the world isn't gonna' help you know what you are talking about. If you haven't been there, you are blowing smoke. People (veterans included) will tell you what you want to hear. It sometimes gets their name in the papers...lol. But studying still doesn't mean you know what you are talking about.

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"the U.S. did everything just right.

Who ever said that the US did everything right?? War is never right, but it will happen, regardless. I would not say that atrocities didn't happen, cause I believe they did, and in the heat of battle, shit happens...maybe you don't understand this - but say you are laying next to your best buddy, fighting for your life, he takes one to the head, and you witness it, not only with your eyes, but you feel his brains splatter across your face. Does this affect you in a negative way, making you not only sad for losing him, but mad and bitter to the point of revenge? If you haven't experienced it, you can't state facts. That is something you will never know until you experience it.
TripleF

"If you have something vital and it's sincere, you can communicate." Butch Trucks

[Jonno5 0]

I second what Mr Freak said

[skycat 0]

You know if I never had to buy meat from a grocery store I wouldn't. I was raised in a farming community almost my entire family is in farming. Their farms are very different from those on that page. All of their animals are free range animals. The chickens, geese, cows, and pigs didn't live like that. The meat from them was 10x better than what you get in stores in terms a leanness. I've been at my grandparents farm when they were slaughtering for themselves and for market, they made sure the animal was dead the first time around. Of course their main form of income was from grain crops, but they still had plenty of animals to sustain the farm in lean times, and for their own uses. Maybe I'm desensitized to the killing of farm animals for food, but I was outraged by what I saw on those pages. It reminds me of puppy mills.
I guess I was taught that some animals place in life is for food, just like some animals pull sleds, or rescue people from buildings, or even are just companions. I was also taught not to waste, and what alot of those pics were of was waste, just like killing an animal for only it's skin is waste. but that is another topic all in of it self.

[freeflir29 0]

BOOBIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sorry you guys are getting out of hand...."I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay

[Schroeder 0]

speaking of puppy mills, have you looked into what happens to thousands of cute cuddly beagle puppies each year? They're used in vivisection 'research'. I thought they we supposed to be a "companion" animal? Can a dog that's your companion pull you from a burning building, or scan that same dog pull you on a sled? My point is, that the only reasons we put animals into these catagories is for our own convienence. Should germans ONLY make cars? exaggeration but you get it.

[Jessica 0]

Unfortunately, free-range meat isn't realistic for the volume of consumption in this country. It would make such a huge difference, environmentally and otherwise, if people would eliminate meat from just ONE meal every day.
And it would also be nice if fairy godmothers came to do my dishes for me, and if my boss called this afternoon to tell me I've been working so hard, why don't I take the rest of the week off.

[freefallfreak 0]

Schroeder,

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Should germans ONLY make cars?

Yep...lol...well, they do make some gorgeous blondes, sometimes...lol. (With great BOOBIES, might I add)...lol
TripleF
"If you have something vital and it's sincere, you can communicate." Butch Trucks

[Schroeder 0]

haha
capital...!

[skycat 0]

Yes I do know about the animals put into research, I know about the shit put into animal food that has been linked to making them sick. I know about the dogs stolen from homes to be put in labs. I've seen the results of animal abuse in different animal related industries. I know you are saying well do something to stop it, well ok you stopped eating all forms of animal and animal by-products. I can't do that, I work to much, have to much stress, and have a shitty diet, I'm basically anemic and that is with taking supplements. So my other option is to do something like PETA, well then I'm an extremist. Can't win can I.
Hmmmm.....to bad we can't do that "research" on those that are making your cuddly beagles into "research" animals. (btw...my Mom has MS and unfortunately I know alot of her treatments have come from animal research) Actually it's to bad that modern technology hasn't come up with a better way to test drugs and different forms of "cures" for our human diseases which are probably in part caused by the crap that is given to farm mill animals to get fat and grow big. Vicious cycle huh.....
Btw, we do categorize humans to, in farmers, laborers, engineers, designers, dr.s, the list goes on and on. Being a companion is a job, did you know there are humans who's job it is to be a companion to other humans.

[skycat 0]

Hey can you send your fair godmother over my way, my place needs spring cleaning done in a BAD way.

[freeflir29 0]

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did you know there are humans who's job it is to be a companion to other humans.

Umm...yeah....They're called Hookers...Right?
"I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay

[skycat 0]

ummmmm....only if they are your companion

[freefallfreak 0]

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ummmmm....only if they are your companion

Ohh, ohh, I want a hooker - errr, mmm, ahhh, a companion...tee-hee...
TripleF
"If you have something vital and it's sincere, you can communicate." Butch Trucks

[freeflir29 0]

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only if they are your companion

For 30 minutes or so....."I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay

[Schroeder 0]

Skycat, regarding the companion as a job thing, I was just pointing out that a life is more than the catagory it's been assigned. A farmer can quit and be a social worker, etc.
There was a good quote regarding extremist animal activists...
something about the people who liberated the african american having been considered extremist by the mainstream. And there's a point to that. We used to treat them the same as animals. Maybe one day, with some hope, we'll be able to look back on these days and see the error in our ways. With hope.
I'm anemic too, much as a part of my diet, but I'll take supplements up to the do or die point before going back to any form of animal based diet. Iron pills suck! But hey, it's better than the alternative. With time and research, I'm sure we'll find more and more ways to research and develop treatments etc. It's just a matter of public opinion. If it changes, the industries would be forced. As if they'd do it on their own...