do not forget.... 9/11

[weid14 0]

got this in my email today, thought I'd share.

"DO NOT FORGET"

I sat in a movie theater watching "Schindler's List," asked myself, "Why didn't the Jews fight back?"

Now I know why.

I sat in a movie theater, watching "Pearl Harbor" and asked myself, "Why weren't we prepared?"

Now I know why.

Civilized people cannot fathom, much less predict, the actions of evil people.

On September 11, dozens of capable airplane passengers allowed themselves to be overpowered by a handful of poorly armed terrorists because they did not comprehend the depth of hatred that motivated their captors.

On September 11, thousands of innocent people were murdered because too many Americans naively reject the reality that some nations are dedicated to the dominance of others. Many political pundits, pacifists and media personnel want us to forget the carnage. They say we must focus on the bravery of the rescuers and ignore the cowardice of the killers. They implore us to understand the motivation of the perpetrators. Major television stations have announced they will assist the healing process by not replaying devastating footage of the planes crashing into the Twin Towers.

I will not be manipulated.

I will not pretend to understand.

I will not forget.

I will not forget the liberal media who abused freedom of the press to kick our country when it was vulnerable and hurting.

I will not forget that CBS anchor Dan Rather preceded President Bush's address to the nation with the snide remark, "No matter how you feel about him, he is still our president."

I will not forget that ABC TV anchor Peter Jennings questioned President Bush's motives for not returning immediately to Washington, DC and commented, "We're all pretty skeptical and cynical about Washington."

And I will not forget that ABC's Mark Halperin warned if reporters weren't informed of every little detail of this war, they aren't "likely -- nor should they be expected -- to show deference."

I will not isolate myself from my fellow Americans by pretending an attack on the USS Cole in Yemen was not an attack on the United States of America.

I will not forget the Clinton administration equipped Islamic terrorists and their supporters with the world's most sophisticated telecommunications equipment and encryption technology, thereby compromising America's ability to trace terrorist radio, cell phone, land lines, faxes and modem communications.

I will not be appeased with pointless, quick retaliatory strikes like those perfected by the previous administration.

I will not be comforted by "feel-good, do nothing" regulations like the silly "Have your bags been under your control?" question at the airport.

I will not be influenced by so called,"antiwar demonstrators" who exploit the right of expression to chant anti-American obscenities.

I will not forget the moral victory handed the North Vietnamese by American war protesters who reviled and spat upon the returning soldiers, airmen, sailors and Marines.

I will not be softened by the wishful thinking of pacifists who chose reassurance over reality.

I will embrace the wise words of Prime Minister Tony Blair who told Labor Party conference, "They have no moral inhibition on the slaughter of the innocent. If they could have murdered not 7,000 but 70,000, does anyone doubt they would have done so and rejoiced in it?

There is no compromise possible with such people, no meeting of minds, no point of understanding with such terror. Just a choice: defeat it or be defeated by it. And defeat it we must!"

I will force myself to:


-hear the weeping
-feel the helplessness
-imagine the terror
-sense the panic
-smell the burning flesh
- experience the loss
- remember the hatred.

I sat in a movie theater, watching "Private Ryan" and asked myself, "Where did they find the courage?"

Now I know.

We have no choice. Living without liberty is not living.

-- Ed Evans, MGySgt., USMC (Ret.)
Not as lean, Not as mean, But still a Marine.

[antimike 0]

Very well put!!!!

[Muenkel 0]

Quote

I will not forget that CBS anchor Dan Rather preceded President Bush's address to the nation with the snide remark, "No matter how you feel about him, he is still our president."

I will not forget that ABC TV anchor Peter Jennings questioned President Bush's motives for not returning immediately to Washington, DC and commented, "We're all pretty skeptical and cynical about Washington."

This is why I only watch Fox News for fair and balanced coverage. On the major networks and my "favorite" CNN, gone are the days of anti-biased journalism. They are in the pockets of the liberals and report everything from that point of view.

_________________________________________
Chris

[smiles 0]

Yesterday my son found out what his tattoo said
(he was very drunk in Mexico when he got it done and had no clue what the Japanese symbols meant)
He sketched them out on paper and I took to the d.z. where a japanese woman read to me.....
"Do not forget."

Smiles.

[happythoughts 0]

Quote

"No matter how you feel about him, he is still our president." -Dan Rather

"No matter how you feel about him, he is still our president." - Monica Lewinski

[billvon 3,080]

>I sat in a movie theater, watching "Pearl Harbor" and asked >myself, "Why weren't we prepared?"

I watched the same movie in a video store and realized that I was watching it on a Japanese TV and a Japanese DVD player, and realized that the US doesn't have a very long memory.

>I will embrace the wise words of Prime Minister Tony Blair who told
> Labor Party conference, "They have no moral inhibition on the
> slaughter of the innocent. If they could have murdered not 7,000
> but 70,000, does anyone doubt they would have done so and
> rejoiced in it?

I hope Ed remembers that we killed 350,000 innocent people a little under 50 years ago and rejoiced in it. We put the Arabs to shame in the killing department.

And I'd love to know where the 7000 number came from.

>There is no compromise possible with such people, no meeting of
> minds, no point of understanding with such terror. Just a choice:
> defeat it or be defeated by it. And defeat it we must!"

Like Israel defeated the Palestinian terrorists?

>I will not forget the Clinton administration equipped Islamic terrorists >and their supporters . . .

And I hope Ed does not forget that Bush Jr. gave the Taliban millions in the early months of 2001, or that Reagan essentially created Al Quadea in the 80s when he gave them billions in weapons.

>I will force myself to:

>-hear the weeping
>-feel the helplessness
>-imagine the terror
>-sense the panic
>-smell the burning flesh
>- experience the loss
>- remember the hatred.

I hope Ed will remember that, whether the people dying are people in the WTC or people in a wedding in Afghanistan, the panic, terror, pain and hatred are the same - and as long as we fight terror with terror, we will have terror.

[Kennedy 0]

Quote

I hope Ed remembers that we killed 350,000 innocent people a little under 50 years ago and rejoiced in it. We put the Arabs to shame in the killing department.

depends on your definition of innocent, but we've been there and done that.

OK, probably rehashing this for the N-thousandth time, but have you got an answer?

I have one in mind, but I want to hear other opinions first, rather than responses to mine.

Tom Kennedy

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[Muenkel 0]

Bill,

Is there anything good about America?

_________________________________________
Chris

[PhreeZone 20]

>Is there anything good about America?

I can think of lots... its just that holding onto the past (with our short memories) is'nt always the best idea. The author must have forgot about he millions of tons of weapons and training we gave to different factions to shape the regions in the way we wanted them... during the Reagan eras as an example.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[Muenkel 0]

Not to mention the Clinton era also.

_________________________________________
Chris

[PhillyKev 0]

And the Bush Sr. era

[kmcguffee 0]

My God Bill. Your cynicism and hatred of the US government is a direct slap in my face. I have spent over 13 years of my life working for the US government. The most kind hearted, selfless, dedicated people I have ever met work for that government. I'm talking Democrats and Republicans.

I have met very few people in the government that are there to get rich or powerful. If they are their to get rich they are just stupid. I currently work with people who took pay cuts of $50 - $60 grand a year in order to do a job that they feel needs to be done. They do it because it is the right thing to do. I met more money grubbing sleeze balls who cared only for themselves in my 1.5 years in the civilian life than I ever have in the government.

The US is not perfect. No country is perfect. You criticize decisions by people and have no idea the circumstances they were in while making these decisions. It is the classic college professor syndrome. Why don't we all sit around a camp fire and sing kumbaya. I'm sure the terrorists will all lay down their weapons and realize they are wrong just like the Nazis, the North Koreans, the Japanese, and so on.

War is not the answer to everything but there is a time when it is the only option. I've always believed that the poorest person in the world is the one who believes his life is so important that he is unwilling to die for anything. You strike me as that kind of person.

"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Ben Franklin

[billvon 3,080]

>Is there anything good about America?

Plenty. Most of the time I believe that we really, honestly try to do the right thing. No country is more accepting of outsiders, and no country is willing to do more to help out other countries. We have freedoms unparalleled in the civilized world, and we let huge numbers of people into our borders to enjoy them. With some exceptions we're pretty peaceful. With some exceptions we are good allies.

I believe the good strongly outweighs the bad here in the US. However, that does not mean that we're always right, or that our military and economic force is always used wisely. We must be on our guard against the forces of greed that would choose money over human welfare, and we must guard against the desire for power that would lead men to try to choose their own desires over the dictates of democracy.

So there's plenty good about America. One of the best things about it is our freedom of speech. It is protected by the constitution partly because it is one of the things that keeps us great - tragedies like Kent State and Japanese concentration camps are discussed, and through discussion, are steered away from in the future. It is in that vein that I hope we learn the lessons of history and do not repeat the mistakes we've made in the past - and we've made plenty of them. If we learn from them, we will be better off. If we don't, things like 9/11 will be just the beginning.

[billvon 3,080]

>Your cynicism and hatred of the US government is a direct slap in my
> face.

Sorry to hear that. I do not hate the US government; on the contrary, I support them despite mistakes they have made. I am cynical of some things they say, but I think you'd have to be very, very trusting to believe everything the government says. I doubt even you go to that extreme.

>I have spent over 13 years of my life working for the US
> government. The most kind hearted, selfless, dedicated people I
> have ever met work for that government. I'm talking Democrats and
> Republicans.

I agree. Most of our elected officials are dedicated to the principles of democracy. It is why, more often than not, democracy works.

>The US is not perfect. No country is perfect. You criticize decisions by
>people and have no idea the circumstances they were in while
>making these decisions.

Do you really, honestly support the Kent State shootings? The Japanese concentration camps? Our sale of pulse neutron generators (i.e. bomb components) to Iraq a few years back? I think those were mistakes. And as long as we live in a democracy, I will use what little power I have (my vote, my right to speak against them) to try to prevent us from making the same mistake twice.

>It is the classic college professor syndrome. Why don't we all sit
>around a camp fire and sing kumbaya.

Don't know the words to that, sorry.

>I'm sure the terrorists will all lay down their weapons and realize they
> are wrong just like the Nazis, the North Koreans, the Japanese, and
>so on.

Those were countries, nation-states. These are terrorists. Did a massive military response stop the terrorism in Israel? Did the Russians have any luck with a military response against the Afghan rebels?

About the only 100% effective military solution against terrorism that I've seen has been Milosevic's - i.e kill all the arabs. Are you prepared to propose that?

>War is not the answer to everything but there is a time when it is the
> only option.

I agree. We used war against Al Quaeda in Afghanistan. Did we 'win?'

>I've always believed that the poorest person in the world is the one
> who believes his life is so important that he is unwilling to die for
> anything. You strike me as that kind of person.

I would willingly put my life on the line to defend the US from a foreign aggressor. I would not willingly do it to set up a puppet government in Iraq (for example) that will fall in a year.

[Muenkel 0]

Bill,

How would you eliminate the terrorists in this world? You know the people who want you and all your loved ones dead simply because you are an American.

War is violence. I acknowledge that. Violence is evil. But there is such a thing as a just war. Sometimes innocent lives are lost. That does not change the intention. I guess I still can not get past the approximately 3000 innocent people who were selfishly murdered on 9/11 by people who do not even value their own lives. They killed all these people simply because they were American. It is no different than what Hitler did to the Jews in Nazi Germany. He selfishly killed them simply because they were Jews.

I don't know about you, but if an Al Qaeda terrorist comes after anyone I love and I have the opportunity, I will blow them away in a heartbeat. If an innocent gets killed in the crossfire, I will grieve for them and I will pray for them.

_________________________________________
Chris

[billvon 3,080]

>How would you eliminate the terrorists in this world? You know the
> people who want you and all your loved ones dead simply because
> you are an American.

You do not eliminate people who want you dead. We want Hussein dead; that does not mean it's OK to 'eliminate' Americans. You distance yourselves from them and deny them the means to do it. If they still come after you, then you eliminate them - but you do it because they are attacking you, not because of anything they believe.

A lot of Americans think some Arabs hate us because they dislike freedom and justice, which is about the biggest piece of propaganda I've ever heard. Think about the 9/11 terrorists. Why do you hate them? Do you hate them because of their strong moral codes, their protection of women, their worship of their god? (Because that's what Arabs think.) I don't - I hate them because they killed thousands of Americans. Many Arabs hate us because we killed thousands of Arabs, and they often don't make the distinction between the US military and US civilians. Killing a few thousand more will not reduce their hatred of us. Ending the killing on both sides is the only thing that will do that.

>War is violence. I acknowledge that. Violence is evil. But there is
> such a thing as a just war. Sometimes innocent lives are lost. That
> does not change the intention. I guess I still can not get past the
> approximately 3000 innocent people who were selfishly murdered on
> 9/11 . . . .

I agree, and while it was not the best solution in retrospect, I agree that we had to go after Al Quaeda. We did that by invading Afghanistan; that didn't initially accomplish its objective. We actually seem to be having more success rounding up Al Quaeda by allying with Pakistan and using their services than we did during the war.

> . . by people who do not even value their own lives.

Or who value something more than their lives. When they wear a US uniform we call such people heroes.

>I don't know about you, but if an Al Qaeda terrorist comes after
>anyone I love and I have the opportunity, I will blow them away in a
> heartbeat.

So would I. I would not, though, go to their home and kill them because I thought they hated me.

[Kennedy 0]

Quote

You do not eliminate people who want you dead. We want Hussein dead; that does not mean it's OK to 'eliminate' Americans. You distance yourselves from them and deny them the means to do it. If they still come after you, then you eliminate them - but you do it because they are attacking you, not because of anything they believe..

Just how would you "distance yourself and deny them the means?"

Quote

So would I. I would not, though, go to their home and kill them because I thought they hated me..

What if they were in their home, building weapons they had TOLD YOU they were going to use against you? What would you do then?

I agree with a bunch of what you've got to say, but I have to ask some looming questions.

Like I said earlier, just what would you do. Don't use some generality. What would you do?

Would you close the book to deny them access?

Would you raid their "homes" to take away the means to nuke/bio/chem weapons to deny them the means?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[AndyMan 7]

Just how would you "distance yourself and deny them the means?"

Just a guess, but the way that the US has distanced and denied means to Fidel Castro is probably a good example. The US won't do that though, they want to buy Iraq's oil.

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[Kennedy 0]

Quote

Just how would you "distance yourself and deny them the means?"

Just a guess, but the way that the US has distanced and denied means to Fidel Castro is probably a good example. The US won't do that though, they want to buy Iraq's oil.

works for me. I have no objection to placing Americans and their lives WAY ahead on the importance scale.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[jraf 0]

In order to eliminate terrorists you should use:

1. Flamethrowers
2. Hand grenades
3. High powered rifles
4. Guards&Guns&German shepherds
5. Napalm
6. Enbalming fluids
7. Your ex partners
8. Bulldozers
9. Other appropriate means available

Full scale aggression against foreign countries is a proven means to improve our economy, thus it is good.
War is good, because you can make funny movies about it (vide: Schindlers List, Private Ryan etc.)
War is good because it provides entertainment and employment to the underprivilrged who join the Armed Forces.
War must be good as Bill Gates is against it.

jraf

Me Jungleman! Me have large Babalui.
Muff #3275

[billvon 3,080]

>Just how would you "distance yourself and deny them the means?"

Distance yourself - simple, avoid them. They're 5000 miles away; they're easy to avoid. Deny them the means - make sure they have no CBN weapons.

>What if they were in their home, building weapons they had TOLD
>YOU they were going to use against you? What would you do then?

If the weapons were illegal, call the cops to have them taken away. Here in the US we do not have the right, as individual citizens, to break into someone else's house because we suspect they mean us harm.

>Would you close the book to deny them access?

I don't know what that means.

>Would you raid their "homes" to take away the means to
>nuke/bio/chem weapons to deny them the means?

Raid? No. Go there with a warrant first. If they resist, then it becomes a raid.

[Skyrad 0]

Well said.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Kennedy 0]

Quote

>Just how would you "distance yourself?"

Distance yourself - simple, avoid them. They're 5000 miles away

OK. And when they come here?

Quote

If the weapons were illegal, call the cops to have them taken away. Here in the US we do not have the right, as individual citizens, to break into someone else's house because we suspect they mean us harm.

We're talking terrorists. They generally don't live around the corner.

I think you have the right idea, I really do, but like so many other people, you seem to refuse to actually take steps to implement your nice sounding generalizations.

When I said "close the book?" I meant the border. Would you?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[freeflir29 0]

Quote

Ending the killing on both sides is the only thing that will do that.

You know that will never happen.

[Kennedy 0]

Quote

Quote

Ending the killing on both sides is the only thing that will do that.

You know that will never happen.

Not until one side is not there anymore. Of course, then somebody else will stand up and rase a hand. It's not exactly a short line.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*