ColdDuck 0 #1 October 1, 2002 Has anyone made demo jump into a football game before? And what kind of stadium was it? Did you have PRO Rating? The reason I am asking is because a friend and I are looking to jump into the homecoming football game at our school in order to promote our club. It is a small division two field, (basically like a high school football field). I looked at it the other day and it is very wide open, with a lot of good outs nearby. As far as I know we have FAA approval for the jump. My only diliemna is that I cant't get my PRO rating only baceause I don't have 500 jumps yet. Any advice ? "Insurance should called In case shit happens, if shit don't happen shouldn't I get my money back?" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nws01 0 #2 October 1, 2002 Chuck (SkyMonkeyOne) has done them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Levin 0 #3 October 1, 2002 Quote My only diliemna is that I cant't get my PRO rating only baceause I don't have 500 jumps yet. Any advice ? you can get something similar to a pro-rating thru the faa. levin vSCR#17 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ColdDuck 0 #4 October 1, 2002 You wouldn't happen to know what this is called would ya ? "Insurance should called In case shit happens, if shit don't happen shouldn't I get my money back?" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ojf1982 0 #5 October 1, 2002 QuoteYou wouldn't happen to know what this is called would ya ? A Letter of Profiency. Basically, an inspector would have to see land within a few meters of a target.The edge ... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who know where it is are those that have gone over - Hunter S. Thompson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Levin 0 #6 October 1, 2002 has anybody reading these forums obatined a letter of proficiency from the faa? just curious what's involved and what the steps are in getting one. levin vSCS#3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ojf1982 0 #7 October 1, 2002 I dont remember but you would have to contact your local FAA office.The edge ... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who know where it is are those that have gone over - Hunter S. Thompson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #8 October 1, 2002 Some demos can be done on just a D licence if the FAA official approves the accuracy. I'd look at doing at least one practice jump and a few orbits in the plane to learn of outs, hazards, etc before a demo. Also learn how to use Wind Drift Indicators and be able to make a steep approach and still hit the target. You have to obey the laws about passing over crowds below certian heights so if you have to land cross field you might have to shoot a steep approach to hit the center of the 50 yard line. Also if this is a night demo I'd do a lot of night accuracy jumps to warm up even if it is a lighted field. Learn about your NOTAM's and how to file them and look at the rental fees on a jump plane to fly you for it.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 4 #9 October 1, 2002 I have jumped plenty of stadiums, but then again I have a PRO rating. "Back in the day", before that rating, it was entirely up to the ASO (later renamed S&TA) and the local FAA. I jumped into Legion Field in Birmingham, Alabama (for the All American Bowl) several times with nothing but a fairly fresh D-license, but that was then, this is now. One of the other demo teams here on Fort Bragg has a guy who was granted his PRO ticket with less than the requisite number of skydives. His appeal to USPA stated that since he did not "fun jump" and only jumped with the team with "real" demo gear, all his jumps should be considered demos. Also, as such, he claimed he was far more proficient at the requisite demo skills than most people with over 1000 jumps. Well, he got the waiver (and his PRO ticket), then promply femured in on a fairly straight-forward demo (which I was also on) this summer. It was all over the local papers; unfortunate. While he did have the skills to get the rating, he didn't have the pure jump number experience to be able to deal with the odd wind conditions and the constrained landing area. Bottom line here is that you really have to have your shit together to be able to deal with the "unknowns" on a demo in front of a crowd. Every year we see examples of people making a spectacle of themselves in front of huge crowds. Real TV and other shows like that thrive on the mishaps that result from poor planning and indecision at critical times. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shark 0 #10 October 1, 2002 Quote....the ASO (later renamed S&TA) Now I know why they changed it. Didn't want to confuse ASO, with A-hole. But the S-T&A is cooler to say and refer to. BTW, I though the military teams get PRO waivers... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nacmacfeegle 0 #11 October 1, 2002 Everything Chuckie says applies..... I've done heaps of demos here in the Uk. We don't need a PRO rating, but most demos require a minimum of a C-license. We have to have a 'display team leader' I'm a little unsure of the license requirements, basically this is the guy who will select the demo team and do the spotting, briefing etc...... Jumping into stadiums can be tricky with wierd wind effects etc. Also be very careful on things like canopy selection. I'd also spend a whole load of time spotting before I committed myself and some pals to an exit over a built up area. From what I've heard about US pro ratings, I think they are a good idea, so my advice would be to get a pro rating, and then think about your demo. Or least satisfy yourself that the jump number requirement is the ONLY thing preventing you from obtaining your pro. Biffing in front of a crowd is not good for the sport.....-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyvixen 0 #12 October 1, 2002 You DON"T need a pro rating to land in a HS football field. You just need USPA "D" A Pro football field would need a Pro-rating and notification to FAA 7 days before jumpLet's put the FUN back in Funeral Life is a Freefall Enjoy!! MUFF #2760 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #13 October 1, 2002 You still need to file the NOTAM and the FAA official has to approve it and you for the jump.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve1 5 #14 October 1, 2002 I'm getting close to 500 jumps, and would like to start working toward getting a pro-rating. I'm just wondering if all 500 jumps need to be on a square canopy. I have a lot of round jumps from the olden days. Thanks for your input. Steve1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #15 October 1, 2002 I think the wording of the Pro rating is Ram-Air.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 4 #16 October 1, 2002 No, they don't have to all be under a square. As a matter of fact, if you wanted to get a PRO rating with a Para Commander that would not be a problem either, so long as you can stand it up ten pre-declared times in a row in the ten meter target. Your PRO ticket has printed on it which canopy you got your rating under. What that means is that you are only certified PRO under that canopy (actually, that canopy size. For example, I could not jump into a pro stadium under my 75 (not that I would want to either) since my PRO card says "StarTrac 1" on it. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spy38W 0 #17 October 1, 2002 QuoteNo, they don't have to all be under a square. As a matter of fact, if you wanted to get a PRO rating with a Para Commander that would not be a problem either, so long as you can stand it up ten pre-announced times in a row in the target. Your PRO ticket has printed on it which canopy you got your rating under. What that means is that you are only certified PRO under that canopy. Wow, are these things that have changed since my 98/2001 Sim was printed, or am I reading it wrong? 3-4.04 (3) Have at least 500 jumps on a ram-air type canopy. (2k1 SIM 7-2(B)(c)) 3-4.05 (A) The smallest canopy used during the qualification will be the smallest size canopy to be used for minimum (Level 2) landing area jumps(yadda ydadda yadda) (2k1 SIM 7-2(B)(3)(a) -- Hook high, flare on time Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 4 #18 October 1, 2002 I am assuming that they (USPA) didn't think anyone would want a PRO ticket with a round, but the card makes no mention of what configuration the parachute must be; only that one make the requisite pre-declared landings in presence of one of the three certifying officials. Even if it says something in the SIM, I am sure you could get a waiver if you worded it correctly. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,107 #19 October 1, 2002 >Has anyone made demo jump into a football game before? Yes >And what kind of stadium was it? Qualcomm stadium in San Diego; a stadium at San Diego State. > Did you have PRO Rating? No, but I should have had one to do the larger stadium. >My only diliemna is that I cant't get my PRO rating only baceause I > don't have 500 jumps yet. Any advice ? Make the jumps. Get the rating. I had 2000 jumps when I did my first stadium, and I did _not_ have the skill to do it. I should have gotten my PRO rating under a big dog of a canopy, which is really what you need for a stadium. I made the mistake of taking a Tri-190 into the 'real' stadium (Qualcomm) and barely got the thing stopped before the outfield wall. Demos, especially stadium demos, are very different than any other sort of jumps. The pressure is different. Spotting is different. Your decisions must be different. Outs are different. Obstacles are different. Winds are different. It takes a lot of practice to be able to do demos well. My suggestions: 1. Start working on your PRO rating. 2. Get involved with a demo team. Be on ground crew for a few; then talk them into letting you do an easier demo (like a golf course.) 3. Get the PRO rating and do a practice demo into a stadium like yours when it's deserted. That will prepare you well for doing such a demo. I know it's tempting to do it sooner, but think about how your club will fare if you do a demo and one of you breaks his back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 4 #20 October 1, 2002 QuoteQuote....the ASO (later renamed S&TA) Now I know why they changed it. Didn't want to confuse ASO, with A-hole. But the S-T&A is cooler to say and refer to. BTW, I though the military teams get PRO waivers... ASO= Area Safety Officer. They were the true authority for people wanting to do demo jumps in their geographic area. We, as active duty military teams, are still required to have PRO tickets just like everyone else in order to get FAA approval for tight demos. We have non-PRO's on our team, but they can only do low-level demos and pull dirt. They do, however, reap the benefits of many, many free skydives and first-rate training for their labor and effort. We have a guy who completed all the ten declared ten-meter PRO landings before he had 40 jumps; outstanding. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
outlawphx 1 #21 October 1, 2002 When I was a senior in high school, I did a night demo jump into my high school homecoming football game with the Flying Elvi. It's quite a rush looking down at the goal posts, stadium lights, stands, the parking lot, and trying to figure the best landing pattern and what "outs" you have on approach. I was jumping a Nova 150 on the weekends, but I used a Manta 288 for the demo. I definately agree with jumping a bigger chute for demos, because there are too many variables on your approach and landing for most people to consider while under a little hot rod. Most spectators are impressed if you can just touch down softly in the middle of the field, so don't worry about pulling off a 300ft swoop. They'll be impressed anyway Anyway, I jumped into my high school's homecoming football game again when I was a freshman in college, and I made a few night demos into the Las Vegas Silver Bowl for a rodeo. Demo jumps are quite a rush Oh. I didn't have a Pro Rating, but the S&TA was on the jump with us. I had about 250 jumps and a D License at the time. I had completed all 10 of my predeclared jumps, but I didn't have the 350 jumps they required at the time. BTW, I was 17 at the time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve1 5 #22 October 1, 2002 This has me wondering what size of canopy would work for a safe demo canopy. I have an old Falcon 235 that was used for a lot of stadium jumps by another jumper. I weigh about 175. I'm just wondering if this size and type of canopy would be a decent demo rig. Thanks for the advice. Steve1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sebazz1 2 #23 October 1, 2002 The Falcon 235 has proven to be my favorite Demo canopy Steve. Actually I think Falcons are pretty cool any size. 265, 300, etc... I've used them all. Good luck with tthe demo... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YahooLV 0 #24 October 1, 2002 That sounds like a great canopy. I fly a TRI 150, but for demos I'll be using no less than a PD 210. Big is safe, and safe walk away!http://www.curtisglennphotography.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 4 #25 October 3, 2002 Our team uses StarTrac 1 and 2's in 260 and 280. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
