Guest #76 December 11, 2002 "Only the dead have seen the end of war." - Plato"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
prepheckt 0 #77 December 11, 2002 Nah..my interests are many and diverse...I wanted to be a virologist when I was younger and read the Hot Zone...no Clay, its not a porno...Level 4 Biohazards..very scary.."Dancing Argentine Tango is like doing calculus with your feet." -9 toes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bbarnhouse 0 #78 December 11, 2002 Clay I certainly DO NOT need a lesson from you in this regard. Given that you know nothing of my background your statements are nil at best. It is a sad day when we lose sight of our own humanity. My statement "shame on us all"....was meant to include all people not just those that live in this great Nation. So with that said...BTFU!! in of course...the nicest possible way Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SudsyFist 0 #79 December 11, 2002 QuoteThis is a battle of religions and it has been on going since the crusades. The problem isn't ISLAM or the USA, it's the RADICAL Fundamentalists TOTALLY agree with you there, hands down. i wasn't trying to make a point that one side or the other was the problem; it was more about the specific attitude towards the taking of lives, i.e. ugly-but-gotta-be-done vs. gotta-hardon-over-the-thought-of-it. QuoteThe only way to compromise or settle with thees type people is the same way to deal with a rabid dog....you put them down. here's the shit, though... there is *no* way to compromise or settle with these types. hundreds of years of diplomacy and war alternating like perris ground winds (woohoo! made it skydiving related!), and where are we? do you honestly believe that this new initiative is going to bring an end to it all? since we're likely to have conflict there for years to come, methinks we just need to be prepared to take whatever action is most appropriate and effective for the situation. right now, it's armed response. steve Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Schroeder 0 #80 December 11, 2002 Ok, I'm gonna ask question here. Please, if it seems silly at first, I am going someplace with this: Who here knows _why_ they hate us? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #81 December 11, 2002 Quotemeant to include all people not just those that live in this great Nation I understood that. Just reminding you that Eutopic Philosophy is a LOOOOONG way from reality. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #82 December 11, 2002 Quotehere's the shit, though... there is *no* way to compromise or settle with these types. hundreds of years of diplomacy and war alternating like perris ground winds (woohoo! made it skydiving related!), and where are we? do you honestly believe that this new initiative is going to bring an end to it all? We are in total agreemnet here on this point Quotesince we're likely to have conflict there for years to come, methinks we just need to be prepared to take whatever action is most appropriate and effective for the situation. I think a quick ,violent decissive action far better serves both sides and the lives of the many that would be lost during a long draw out conflict."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bbarnhouse 0 #83 December 11, 2002 Quote I understood that. Just reminding you that Eutopic Philosophy is a LOOOOONG way from reality. Thank you and it is simply A reality.....not THE reality. Further more...I dont need such reminders...obviously.....the sheep need tending to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
prepheckt 0 #84 December 11, 2002 You could write a book,(many have), study them as a career (many have) and not understand(many don't). There are so many reasons... If I remember my history correctly, (correct me if I'm wrong) Many are religous based..ie (Israel claims original ownership of the land (Biblical references). Many radical fundamentalists refer to history and the Crusades undertaken by the English to retake the Holy Land..so we are seen as invaders...ironic considering we are seen as "People of the Book". Islam allows the concept of "jihad". Most translate that as "holy war"..it is closer to "holy struggle". There are rules to jihad..no attacking noncombatants..any olive branch MUST be accepted. The land now held by Israel was promised to the Palestinians by the British..then the UN decided after WWII to give that land to the Israelis..obviously the Palestinians are not happy. So. theh concept of jihad tto interpet that we are infedels and jihad can be conducted because they see the US/Europe interfeing in the Muslim community (I wonder where tthey go that idea?) IMHO, we do, because our economies run on oil... The voters will not stand for an oil embargo or prices to rise...so its a catch 22..we're dammed if we do, we're dammed if we don't.."Dancing Argentine Tango is like doing calculus with your feet." -9 toes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SudsyFist 0 #85 December 11, 2002 Quote Betsy...I'm proud to have done my part to allow you, Steve, and all those Hollywood actors to live in a world where you can have this sort of attitude. all right, sheep boy, i'm calling you on this one. to what attitude are you referring? i spoke of reveling in death being ass, hate being poopy, and extremism sucking sack... you disagree? steve Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #86 December 11, 2002 QuoteWho here knows _why_ they hate us? Broad subject...but this might get you started. www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,46610,00.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #87 December 11, 2002 Quoteon your own admission, you raised up the knife, and you brought it down ending another man's life. when it was done you just threw down the blade, whilst the red blood spread wider like the anger you made. i don't want this anger burning in me, it's something from which it's so hard to be free, and none of the tears that we cry in sorrow or rage can make any difference, or turn back the page. Love the base solo on that song. Don't care much for the rest of the album though.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SudsyFist 0 #88 December 11, 2002 Quote I wanted to be a virologist when I was younger take the playstation away from him, dear... he's getting obsessed! steve Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SudsyFist 0 #89 December 11, 2002 Quote I think a quick ,violent decissive action far better serves both sides and the lives of the many that would be lost during a long draw out conflict. sucks, but true. steve Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
prepheckt 0 #90 December 11, 2002 Quote take the playstation away from him, dear... s Who are you calling dear??? I hope not me...cause we're gonna have to "chat" if you are.."Dancing Argentine Tango is like doing calculus with your feet." -9 toes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Schroeder 0 #91 December 11, 2002 So then, what might happen, all speaking hypothetically, if we (western world) were to revamp our society to use less oil, to the point where we could provide to ourselves? Is sitting in an SUV really worth knowing that the oil/gas consumption issue you're contributing to is worth it's part in the resulting conflict? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #92 December 11, 2002 Quoteto what attitude are you referring? When discussions like this start there are always those that will pick "peace" at any cost. That seems to be you....and those 104 actors in Hollywood that signed a petition against ANY war with Iraq. They seem to think diplomacy can and will solve all our problems. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest #93 December 11, 2002 QuoteOk, I'm gonna ask question here. Please, if it seems silly at first, I am going someplace with this: Who here knows _why_ they hate us? "They hate us for our freedom." - Dubya I used to think that remark was silly, until I looked deeper. They really do hate us for our freedoms. Consider: we're a flawed culture, it's true, but look at what we've got and how far we've come-- Political Correctness to the point of absurdity, but the intention is good - that everyone is valued, and no one is rejected or left behind beause of what sex they are, or the way they look, or what church they go to (if they even do). A black woman is the National Security Adviser, and a black man is Secretary of State. Women hold critical positions in Government, business, and academia. Yes, the smut peddlers and hate-mongers of our culture hide behind the First Amendment, but we put up with it because we know that we must let all have their say, regardless of how offensive we find it (referring to crucifixes in urine as "art" comes immediately to mind), and the net result is that we're all better off for it. In their world, thieves have their hands and/or feet cut off in public. In ours, they get fines and community service. In their world, women are chattel; property to be bought, sold, even beaten to death if that's what a man wants to do. In our world, women can walk around without wearing a bedsheet from head to toe. It's these things, and many more, that the ragheads hate us for. It is the intrusion of our "dangerous" ideas and ways of living and thinking into their twisted, poisoned little world that they hate us for. The politics of the Middle East is just a sideshow. It's a clash of cultures. Fortunately, the ragheads are on the wrong side of history. We in the modern world will not go back to the Middle Ages. We've come too far, struggled to hard and too long to let some bearded maniacs treat us like this and get away with it."The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SudsyFist 0 #94 December 11, 2002 QuoteWhat I do feel is grim satisfaction, I take satisfaction in witnessing their pain and suffering, your satisfaction is still troubling to me, but i s'pose we can agree to disagree. Quotef you think that this kind of brutality (the AC-130 gunship) is horrifying, it's not the brutality i find horrifying -- it's people's revelry in it. steve Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
prepheckt 0 #95 December 11, 2002 QuoteSo then, what might happen, all speaking hypothetically, if we (western world) were to revamp our society to use less oil, to the point where we could provide to ourselves? It is possible..but too much $$ is involved for it too be much of an effect..we'd have to shut down our economy do it. QuoteIs sitting in an SUV really worth knowing that the oil/gas consumption issue you're contributing to is worth it's part in the resulting conflict? Unfortunately, most people don't think about that kind of thing or even care of end-use consequnces..for example...skydiving...how much do you think about pollution that a plane puts out per load...and the JP is made from oil that does come from the ME..food for thought.."Dancing Argentine Tango is like doing calculus with your feet." -9 toes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest #96 December 11, 2002 Quote Quote I think a quick ,violent decissive action far better serves both sides and the lives of the many that would be lost during a long draw out conflict. sucks, but true. steve Well said. "Conflicts" can drag on for centuries, but "wars" generally don't last very long, and have a way of settling matters."The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #97 December 11, 2002 Quote Is sitting in an SUV really worth knowing that the oil/gas consumption issue you're contributing to is worth it's part in the resulting conflict? Are you really so naive as to think our policies in the Middle East have a DAMN thing to do with people driving SUV's? The entire population of the world can drive Honda insights and it won't matter. Sure...it will have an impact but until Honda makes F-16's and tanks that run on batteries I don't think our policies will change... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bbarnhouse 0 #98 December 11, 2002 QuoteWhen discussions like this start there are always those that will pick "peace" at any cost. That seems to be you....and those 104 actors in Hollywood that signed a petition against ANY war with Iraq. They seem to think diplomacy can and will solve all our problems. Bwahhhhhhh God save me from people who dare to assume they know what I think.....and think they know everything. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #99 December 11, 2002 In fact...there is probably some high level intel entity somewhere that has gone with the plan of using up the entire world's oil supply outside the US. Then....we'll be the only ones with oil.... Ever think about that? The rest of the world would be crippled.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest #100 December 11, 2002 Quote Quote Is sitting in an SUV really worth knowing that the oil/gas consumption issue you're contributing to is worth it's part in the resulting conflict? Are you really so naive as to think our policies in the Middle East have a DAMN thing to do with people driving SUV's? The entire population of the world can drive Honda insights and it won't matter. Sure...it will have an impact but until Honda makes F-16's and tanks that run on batteries I don't think our policies will change... As I have mentined elsewhere in a thread about SUVs, I would hope that our consumption of oil would decrease to the point where the political situation in the Middle East completely changes. As I also mentioned, the ragheads will still hate us, but they will have far less rationale for their behavior."The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
