New can o' worms....

[diablopilot 2]

Interesting reading....

http://www.philosophers.co.uk/god.htm

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[miked10270 0]

Good one

Mike.

OK, I took one hit and bit one bullet, but that was probably due to an excess of blood in my alcohol.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[riddler 0]

no hits, bit one bullet, and was awarded some sort of medal. I feel like I just fought in a war. Do I get any veteran's benefits?

Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD

[Push 0]

I answered true to both 10 and 14 and took a hit. I don't think this hit was justifiable. Here is what I sent to them in defense of my position:

Quote

Hello,

I want to point out what I see as a mistake in the wording of questions 10 and 14. The argument in your FAQ holds, but the wording of your questions provides a loophole. The main premise of the loophole is that the word "belief" is equivalent to the words "matter of faith". Belief is the act of choosing one explanation out of the set of explanations for a phenomenon when none of the explanations have conclusive supportive evidence. That is to say, when you must choose (a) or (b), and you have no proven reason to choose one over the other, any choice here is a matter of belief. This act is perfectly rational. Now, to apply this to your questions, we get:

"As long as there are no compelling arguments or evidence that show that God does not exist, atheism is a matter of faith, not rationality."

Answering true to this means that, unless a conclusive bit of evidence is presented, atheism is a matter of faith, ie, a belief. Nothing wrong here.

"If, despite years of trying, no strong evidence or argument has been presented to show that there is a Loch Ness monster, it is rational to believe that such a monster does not exist."

See my explanation in the first paragraph. It is, indeed, perfectly rational to BELIEVE such a monster does not exist. That is, it is still a matter of faith. Note that this does not imply the irrationality of the other position. When we are talking about belief, both answers are rational. If one answer becomes irrational, it is no longer a belief. QED.

To explain further, this means that, for atheism, just like Nessie, both belief and disbelief are a matter of faith, and answering true to both questions is not logically inconsistent.

My suggestion would be to change question 10 to something like:

"If, despite years of trying, no strong evidence or argument has been presented to show that there is a Loch Ness monster, it is rational to BE CERTAIN/TO CONSIDER IT A FACT that such a monster does not exist."

There is no ambiguity here.

Cheers,
- Eugene

-- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo
Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

[diablopilot 2]

I had some what of the same trouble with that one, but I was not able to express in such a detailed manner. Go git em'!

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[Push 0]

I can't. I wrote that up in their "Contact Us" page, filled everything out, pressed submit, and got a nice big white page with one word in it: Error. I tried several times and double checked everything. I guess I'll just try again later.

Oh well, it's not like they're Immanuel Kant or sometning

-- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo
Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

[Push 0]

Just tried again and it went through. We'll see what they have to say. I'll post the correspondence here.

-- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo
Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

[kingbunky 3]

You suffered zero direct hits and bit 1 bullet.

dunno what that means either, but i won a medal! woohoo!

"Hang on a sec, the young'uns are throwin' beer cans at a golf cart."
MB4252 TDS699
killing threads since 2001

[miked10270 0]

Yeah... That was where i also took the hit.

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[Push 0]

I'm going to stand up for the skydiving community. Let's organize a mass protest.

EDITED TO ADD:

-- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo
Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

[wlie 0]

Quote

Jesus will return. As a free-flyer.

In that case, we're all angels in training for an endless track dive!

My other ride is the relative wind.

[ERICCONNELLY 0]

Quote

Congratulations! You have made it to the end of this activity.

You took 1 direct hit and you bit zero bullets. The average player of this activity to date takes 1.36 hits and bites 1.09 bullets. 84543 people have so far undertaken this activity.

Same hit.

I guess we think alike. I agree with your suggested rewording of the LNM question.

[Push 0]

I checked your profile, and you're jumping a Tri 160. Guess what my beer chute is...

-- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo
Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

[Muenkel 0]

I also had the same issue with 10 and 14. Push, you worded your objection well.

_________________________________________
Chris

[bmcd308 0]

I took zero direct hits and bit three bullets, but I do not agree with the definition of biting a bullet. The creator of the study shifts some value judgments into the logical analysis of the questions.

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www.jumpelvis.com

[jlmiracle 7]

I had zero hits and zero bullet bites.

Judy

Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

[nubain1 0]

Congratulations!

You have been awarded the TPM service medal! This is our third highest award for
outstanding service on the intellectual battleground.

The fact that you progressed through this activity suffering only one direct hit
indicates that your beliefs about God are, on the whole, consistent.

[miked10270 0]

Quote

I had zero hits and zero bullet bites.

WARNING!!!!

It appears that we have a normal person on the forums!!!

Mike (CLINICALLY Sane)

Taking the piss out of the FrenchAmericans since before it was fashionable.

Prenait la pisse hors du FrançaisCanadiens méridionaux puisqu'avant lui à la mode.

[Muenkel 0]

Quote

I had zero hits and zero bullet bites

Your profile name makes more sense now.

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Chris

[Zenister 0]

not really , it was easy to see from the wording what the authors agendawas. he needs to work on quite a few of his definitions we covered most of his argument in the "what do you believe" threads in a single day...this site just isnt that deep.


example "nessy" MUST exist inside x,y,z,t. Why is it necessary for God too? that one idea takes care of the last 4 or 5 of his questions..

unfortunately with such an agenda there isnt much point in trying to point out the logical inconsistencies in his own questions and judgments of others answers..

should have know it was rigged when the only options were "true and false" any two-sided system of belief is inherently flawed..

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Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.