mouth 0 #26 March 7, 2003 Whether you feel it is justified or not this war will most likely happen barring some act of God. That said my thoughts and prayers are with those who must fight it. I hope and pray for their safety and ours. -- Hot Mama At least you know where you stand even if it is in a pile of shit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #27 March 7, 2003 Does it not take an act of Congress to declare war?Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #28 March 7, 2003 QuoteWell, considering the inspectors have stated that they need a few months in order to be sure Iraq has complied, the deadline is a load of BS. If we're going to war, we're going to war. Fine, but don't hand me some crap that GWB tried to give them a chance. Even if there are absolutely zero WMDs in Iraq at this moment, there's no way that could be proven to the inspector's satisfaction in 10 days. The deadline is meaningless and purely an attempt to look like we're compromising with the will of the majority of the rest of the world. The inspectors ARE NOT investigators. They are shown what the Iraqi's are told to show them proactively. They are little boys and girls that don't have a clue as to what they are doing. I REPEAT!!! They are not investigators NOR HAVE THEY BEEN TRAINED TO FIND WMD's!! Sheesh!! They are a bunch of boy scouts running around the desert looking for easter eggs. That is all they are actually QUALIFIED to find. Inspectors are useless.. A deadline is PARAMOUNT to not getting jerked around any longer while Sadham hides his weapons in CIVILIAN automobiles and homes. We can not wait any longer.. Tic Toc Tic Toc... Segador is coming for them.... Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #29 March 7, 2003 NOPE Billvons hero got the privelege taken away from him. Bush had it restored at the beginning of his term. -- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michele 1 #30 March 7, 2003 Hi, Bill. Don't have a ton of time right now... But this link intimates that what you have been saying about the terrorism act recently passed {the Patriot Act} was what the ACLU was saying about Clinton's 1995 omnibus action. http://archive.aclu.org/news/n1024952.html That being said, QuoteHe may not have done enough, but he certainly did not ignore the problem I have recently read that the KLA was connected to OBL, and that Clinton's insertion (unilateral, I might add) of 20,000 troops in Bosnia to support the KLA had a great deal in "encouraging" OBL that the US was not aware of the depth that the AQ was working, operating, and planning at...however, I will say that the site where I read that is, in my opinion, not the most "unbiased" source around. I will look further when I have time, for confirmation of this. QuoteAnd I would have thought that laying 9/11 even partially on Iraq was beneath you, but apparently you continue to do it. I do not claim to be disspassionate about the murder of 3,000 of my fellow citizens, nor disspassionate about those several hundred citizens from 80 other countries who were brutally killed in the 9/11 attacks. Nor do I claim dispassion about my feelings toward a man who admittedly sends funds to suicide bombers, uses chemical weapons on his own citizens, and is willing to order the rape of children in front of their parents. And I do not claim the egoism that I, Michele, must know all the intel gathered to make up my mind. History has shown this man to support terrorism; it has demonstrated that he has the hatred of America; and that he has allowed, in the past, to have terrorists trained in his country. It is my opinion that Saddam poses a great threat...maybe not to me, here in Burbank, but to the world in general. I am not so selfish to believe that my life is the only one which counts. And just as a point of clarification, I did not use the word Iraq in the post you're quoting... Quote It doesn't present that threat. That is your opinion. I hold a different one. And I do respect you as a person with a different opinion. And I am tickled pink that we are able to have this discourse here, publicly...there are many people who cannot talk publicly about their opinions in countries where having a dissenting opinion means certain death. Have a great day, Bill... Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #31 March 7, 2003 QuoteDoes it not take an act of Congress to declare war? Congress gave that right to the President not too long ago.. So an act of congress did allow it.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jraf 0 #32 March 7, 2003 Robert, as far as I know you are not going to war. I sure as hell am not going either. Go enlist, volunteer for front line duty and then tell me "we are going to war" Dude...think, it has a huge future. Think before you say something, cause if you don't you may give the impression of not being the sharpest tool in the shed. Now you would not want that, would you now?jraf Me Jungleman! Me have large Babalui. Muff #3275 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michele 1 #33 March 7, 2003 QuoteThe deadline is meaningless and purely an attempt to look like we're compromising with the will of the majority of the rest of the world. Isn't that the workable definition of "diplomacy"? (And isn't that what Saddam is doing, too?) Made me grin...thanks! Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #34 March 7, 2003 Excuse me wonder child? I am a U.S. Marine... Brain child... Did you serve your country? Or was the Paddle Boat coast guard not hiring? Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #35 March 7, 2003 QuoteA deadline is PARAMOUNT to not getting jerked around any longer while Sadham hides his weapons in CIVILIAN automobiles and homes. We can not wait any longer.. I've got no problem with a deadline. But make it a realistic one. By definition a deadline means something is supposed to take place before that time to avoid repurcussions. Would you please tell me what exactly it is that Iraq should do in the next 10 days to prove they are in compliance? Even if they legitimately destroyed every single banned item (which I doubt they would do, but suppose they did), how is that proven to us to avoid war? We're not goign to take their word for it, we need to inspect for ourselves to be sure. And we can't possibly do that in 10 days. So, there's absolutely no reason for a 10 day deadline. We've decided we're going war. It's pretty stupid of us to tell them exactly when. The deadline is a political ruse so that GWB can say "we tried everything". Since it's obvious that we've decided to attack we might as well go in tonight. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #36 March 7, 2003 You know anyone going? I do, I know at least a dozen people already over there. You know what? Not a single one I know has a problem with being there. Since their life is on the line, it would be nothing short of rude to disagree with them. -- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #37 March 7, 2003 QuoteI've got no problem with a deadline. But make it a realistic one I would say 12 years was pretty realistic.-- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #38 March 7, 2003 Phil.. He's had 12 years... Ferret, I agree.. I have tons of Recon brothers out there RARING TO GO.. They are fucking psyched!! Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,589 #39 March 7, 2003 That was well stated. I disagree with some of it, but that's way different from thinking of it as a jingoistic "let's kick some butt so everyone will know we're the big dogs this week" statement. Thanks a lot for inserting some substance. WendyThere is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #40 March 7, 2003 QuoteIsn't that the workable definition of "diplomacy"? (And isn't that what Saddam is doing, too?) Not really. Diplomacy - The art or practice of conducting international relations, as in negotiating alliances, treaties, and agreements. It's more the definition of spin doctoring. Interesting that you would compare the tactics of GWB and Saddam, though. Gave me a grin. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumpergirl 0 #41 March 7, 2003 I still think it all just sucks. I honestly have no idea what is going on. All I know is that ugly things are happening and we are losing guys, girls, friends, lovers, mothers, fathers, sons, and daughters. It stinks and I wish it would all just go away. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #42 March 7, 2003 I know of people that have been 'gone' in the spec ops community since 9/12/01. They have had their lives on the line for years. We have teams in Iraq right now, on the ground, have had for years. If we think there is heavy shit going down, there is a reason why. I dont agree with kicking ass to be the big dog. But I do believe in walking softly and carrying a big stick. Threat of force is what the entire concept of military strategy absolutely revolves around. You show hesitation more than a few times, your credible is gone. Period. I fix computers for a living and I hate it when lawyers or accountants tell me how to do it. Therefore, I am not going to tell a soldier how to do his job.-- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,589 #43 March 7, 2003 QuoteI've got no problem with a deadline. But make it a realistic one. By definition a deadline means something is supposed to take place before that time to avoid repurcussions. But this is kind of like a parent telling a kid over and over again "clean your room" while letting him keep the door shut. And the shit piles up, and eventually the parent says "get all the stuff out of the room, no questions asked, in 10 minutes." Which really means that he has to get a garbage bag and just dump everything in. That's a valid thing to do if it's your kid. Really. The problem is that we're not the world's parents. We really aren't. The guy's house really stinks, and there are a few rats coming and going. But it's got to be a community action to go kick his ass. Wendy W. (whose bedroom is NOT clean)There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jraf 0 #44 March 7, 2003 Marine...well that explains everything...child. See I serve my country in a different way. I create the weapons you use, write the manuals for them so that you can understand. I transport your food and weapons to the battle field. I bring the wounded back. I do psychologic evaluations on your officers. I refine the fuel for your truck and tanks. I make the sattelites and computers that run the battlefield support systems. I am too valuable to be dumped on the beach. I have two degrees from an expensive university. In addition to that I can do all that you have been trained for. (oh yes I can baby!) I can also do inteligence work and think strategically on the battle field. I can understand the enemy, because I know his language. Last but not least I can feed you, because I know how to cook. Do you think I feel any worse than you...child.Do you want to tell me you are jraf Me Jungleman! Me have large Babalui. Muff #3275 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,589 #45 March 7, 2003 QuoteBut I do believe in walking softly and carrying a big stick. Remember that walking softly comes first, and the big stick is for when you're attacked. Not when an asshole is across the street and you go beat him with it. Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #46 March 7, 2003 You also proclaim the values of cocaine on a public forum. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=406817#406817 Therefore, I laugh at the above post. -- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vallerina 2 #47 March 7, 2003 QuoteIn the meantime, as far as his job performance goes - I've got no complaints. I've got quite a few! In my sum up, he spent way too much of his time preparing for war on Iraq (especially since I don't think they ever planned on attacking us or supporting Al Qaeda) and much too little time on domestic affairs (have you ever read the little blurbs dug in the middle of the paper on the crazy stuff he plans on doing with our money/education?) I haven't read a clear definition of exactly why war is necessary. I guess that part is still confusing to me. Maybe I don't read enough. I just don't see anywhere that there was a reasonable threat of an attack by Iraq. Just because Iraq hasn't done what they were told by now doesn't mean that we should kill a bunch of people.There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #48 March 7, 2003 QuoteSee I serve my country in a different way. I create the weapons you use, write the manuals for them so that you can understand. I transport your food and weapons to the battle field. I bring the wounded back. I do psychologic evaluations on your officers. I refine the fuel for your truck and tanks. I make the sattelites and computers that run the battlefield support systems. I am too valuable to be dumped on the beach. I have two degrees from an expensive university. In addition to that I can do all that you have been trained for. (oh yes I can baby!) I can also do inteligence work and think strategically on the battle field. I can understand the enemy, because I know his language. Last but not least I can feed you, because I know how to cook. Do you think I feel any worse than you...child. I have a PHD myself... Child.. lol o.k. You are too valuable? And I suppose you put that worth on your head... ?? o.k. I trust you.. But you aren't fighting for anyones freedom.. Nor have you ever. And don't ever question my integrity or loyalty to my country. Dumb thing to do when you didn't have the balls to serve yourself. Keep engineering toilet paper. Soldiers need to wipe their asses.. Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jraf 0 #49 March 7, 2003 You forgot to mention weed. Laughter is good for your body and soul. Laugh away. bjraf Me Jungleman! Me have large Babalui. Muff #3275 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jraf 0 #50 March 7, 2003 You are so right...soldiers need toilet paper. Next time you go into combat and find that you have no ammunition, maybe you will hope I was there managing the supply chain. Fighting for freedom can be done in many ways Robert. No only with gun in hand. The day you understand that, I'll give you a hug.You chose your profession I chose mine. The fact you are a solider does not make you any better than I. And don't wine about risking your life for your country. You chose your job, not me. You get paid for it. You are expected to perfom, just as any factory worker is. You don't like the pay than change it. I did not force you to enlist. jraf Me Jungleman! Me have large Babalui. Muff #3275 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
